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Court with my fiances ex :(

(107 Posts)
roxyk0303 Tue 16-Jul-19 21:37:27

I found this site whilst googling and hope someone can help sad

My fiancé and his ex are currently going through court about access arrangements for his 2 daughters. He has put in an application for shared care (full 50/50). We currently only have them 1 night a week. He sees them on a Monday for tea (takes them to his mums) then on a Thursday and Friday he works 6am-2pm so he picks them up from school those days. On a Thursday he drops them home at 8.30/9pm and then they sleep over on a Friday, returning home at 3pm Saturday. He now wants them with us Monday, Thursday and Friday over night every week, with a Saturday overnight added every second week. I want to support him but in reality its not practical at all!

We live a 30minute drive from them and their school, its longer with traffic. I don’t drive and I have my own daughter (12yrs) to get to school in the morning before I go to work.

Im completely torn and cant help feeling he is doing this for all the wrong reasons!

His daughters are 11yrs and 9yrs old. He and his ex split up almost 4 years ago now, she left him and he thinks she was cheating (she had a new man and was pregnant within 3 months). They had been separated for 8 months when I met him. He was left paying a lot of debt when she left. A personal loan for £15,000 that they got to renovate their house, and a car loan of around the same. He lost his house after she left him as he couldn’t keep up with the mortgage so he got no money from that and he stupidly put both the loans in his own name when they were together so he had no come back on those. She took the car with her when she left, then denied having it when he tried to transfer that loan to her. He couldn’t prove the car was hers and the kids told him she didn’t have it any more but he never found out where it went. He is still paying these loans now.

Because he was paying the loans, he wasn’t paying her any maintenance. She seems to think he has access to an endless pot of money. She wasn’t happy not getting maintenance and went to the CMS. They awarded her 16% of his gross wages a month. He changed jobs at the end of last year. The CMS recently did a review and his ex has been awarded an extra £130 per month. He is absolutely furious about this and this is what has spurred him to go to court for 50/50

We are not rolling in money by any means. He pays out a small fortune each month on those loans, due to defaults when he was signed of work ill, they now come to over £600. and when you add in the maintenance, our rent and other bills and just day to day living expenses, there isn’t a lot left at all at the end of the month. We cant afford to pay her any more money. We simply don’t have it. CMS don’t care about outgoings, they just take what they want from the top amount

The relationship between my fiancé and his ex has always been extremely fragile, it completely broke down when he reported her to social services (before I met him) for neglect. They found no concerns (I don’t believe there ever would be, the girls have the life of riley there) and his complaint was marked as malicious. He has admitted to me that he was trying get the girls removed from her care to hurt her. The girls were told what he had done and refused to see him for months. When I met him he was trying to re-establish contact and they were battling access out through their lawyers. They reached the current agreement and that has been in place since (no court order).

The girls live with their mum, her boyfriend that she left my partner for and their son. They also have an Auntie that is very (overly so, I feel) involved in their lives. Auntie has a daughter the same age as mine (12yrs) who also spends a very minimal amount of time with her own father. The girls spend a huge amount of time at their Aunties (their
houses are walking distance apart). They refer to their cousin as their sister and will correct you if you if you say shes their cousin. Auntie is loaded. She seems to have endless amounts of cash to spare. She is very glamorous, gorgeous, has a fast car and is just oh so cool. She is all about big hair, make up, designer sunnies and ripped jeans. Both of the girls worship the ground she walks on. They sleep over there several times a week, even on school nights. She takes them on holidays and constant weekends away, usually meaning my fiancé misses his Friday contact. When my fiancé put his foot down one weekend and said they couldn’t go and had to come to ours, they were a nightmare the full weekend, then we didn’t see them for nearly 3 weeks because they were mad with him!

There are also a lot of things we don’t agree with regarding how they are being brought up, but whenever we try to put our parenting views across, or enforce our rules, they just stop coming. They are “ill” or have “a birthday party” or are at Aunties house instead. The youngest especially blows off a lot of time with dad in favour of Auntie and regularly starts sentences “When im bigger and live with (Auntie)…….”

That was the reason my fiancé actually started court proceeding in the first place. He was initially just trying to get a court order put in place for his current (already agreed for almost 3 years) contact so that he has some clout over his time with his children and could try and make them come when they are supposed to. He is seen as so unimportant and they pick and choose when to come and spend time here.

They say that its boring here and we never take them anywhere. This is true, but its because we have no money left after paying their mums debts and the maintenance. We cant afford days out and trips to the cinema and I feel like when we do give them things or take them places, they don’t appreciate it because its not as good or exciting as what they get from mum and Auntie

He had already applied for that and it was in the process of going though when the maintenance review happened and their mum got awarded the extra money. He then changed his application to complete 50/50 care, meaning there should be no maintenance paid at all. I completely see where he is coming from. We simply cannot afford to pay out more money every month (his mum is paying his lawyer as we are so broke sad ) but if he gets the 50/50, then the practical logistics of getting his girls to school from here in the morning are not possible. Especially on the Friday morning when my fiancé starts work at 6am. He is talking about having his mum come over and pick them up (she lives close to the girls mum, so she would be driving here to pick them up and drop them at school on a Tuesday and a Friday morning) but she doesn’t keep well at all and is currently under investigation for some sort of heart problem, they were talking about a bypass, so I really don’t think its fair to put that on her. She doesn’t like driving at the best of times, never mind an hours round trip in morning rush hour.

He was at court today and the judge has ordered that the girls have to be asked what they want, so there is someone from the court being sent out to talk to them at their mums, about their wishes. The girls have already said they don’t want anymore over nights, and the judge basically said today that what my fiancé was proposing was too much and would be quite disruptive to the girls, so I really don’t think it will go to full 50/50 shared care but that doesn’t help our financial situation. They are back in court in early October

On one hand, 50/50 care would help our finances (ie get rid of the maintenance payment, or at least greatly reduce it) and free up some cash, but practically it would be a nightmare. Its also not what the girls want

But on the other hand, if access stays as it is just now, we are completely screwed from a financial point of view. His mum is already paying his lawyer and my mum has already helped us out. This was the first month with the higher maintenance payment. We don’t get paid till the 27th July and we have £85 left in the bank. My fiancé needs diesel and we need to do a food shop. That £85 should be £215 and we would normally get by, but I don’t know what we are going to do this month

I also don’t see why we should be paying all that money to their mum when the girls seem to spend the majority of the time with their Auntie sad

I just really don’t know what to do sad

OP’s posts: |
Willyoujustbequiet Sat 20-Jul-19 12:52:26

He's a deadbeat. Spiteful and vindictive. Thinking of himself rather than the children and you're enabling him.

Think of your daughter and get rid. Stop making excuses for him.

user1486131602 Fri 19-Jul-19 20:59:58

It would only be bigotry if it had not been a personal experience of divorce and the way the divorced ‘man’ had been!

On the other hand, maybe I do like your form of bigotry and prejudice

"Like all divorced men he’s sounds like a little boy who has been bullied"


Ah, prejudice & bigotry! Dontcha love it? 😂

I'm a big advocate of 50/50 care. It's usually a really good way of maintaining a strong relationship for kids with both their parents, and there's a wealth of evidence that speaks to the importance of that.

However, those arrangements do have to be in the kids' best interests - and in this case, it is crystal clear that they are not.

I'll be blunt - what your ex did in reporting his ex was totally abhorrent. He subjected them to a social services investigation that was unwarranted. He put them in a terrible position - those investigations are an horrific experience not just for the adults involved in them, but also for the kids! He is NOT a good dad. No good parent would ever contemplate subjecting their kids to that, just to get one over on their ex. The thought should never have crossed his mind. It really doesn't matter that he regrets it now - this man is not trustworthy, and is not capable of putting his kids ahead of his own narrow self-interest.

And he hasn't changed. He's now using his kids to try and solve his financial problems.

If he (and you) have financial problems, sort them! Stop blaming it all on the ex. Loads of us got fucked over in our divorce settlements. We accept it for what it is, maybe vow never to marry again(!), and then crack on with fixing it. I can't believe this needs saying, but.....his kids are not weapons. They are not pawns. They are not tools to be manipulated to help him solve his financial problems. If he doesn't have enough money....he needs to get a better job. Work more hours. Get a side income. Live more frugally. Be an adult, and fix the problem. Don't start manipulating his own bloody children in the hope that they'll be the solution!

After what he did with SS, he should be grateful that they are willing to see him at all. He should be pouring his efforts into rebuilding their trust, and improving his relationship with them. Not trying to force them to spend more time with him, when they don't want to, just to help solve his cashflow issues! I know you say he wants to improve his relationship with them....but do either of you genuinely believe that forcing them into an arrangement they don't want is the way to do that?! That is - to put it crudely - mental. Not exactly likely to get them trusting him again, is it?

The specific 50/50 pattern he was proposing was just as mental. Way too much moving around - and a clear demonstration that he constructed it to suit him, without a moment's thought as to whether it would make sense for the kids. Then there's his inability to actually make that pattern work - is this guy capable of thinking about anyone else for even a second?

Look, if he really wants to deal with these issues, he needs to take ownership of his financial problems, amd crack on with tne hard graft of sorting them. Through bis OWN sweat. Stop focussing on the ex. Stop looking for ways to get other people to solve them. Stop wallowing in self pity. Be a man, and bloody well work to fix it.

As for his kids, he needs to be putting work into that relationship, understanding where the kids are coming from. When he increases his income, maybe designate a portion of that increase for debt clearance, and a portion for activities with the kids. Really talk to the kids. He's starting from a low base, so he needs to adapt his approach completely - you don't get to dictate that your kids should spend more time with you after subjecting them to what he did. Time for him to find some humility.

As for you, I'll behonest and say that I have no idea what you see in a man like this. Your daughter is having her living standards comprkmised because thisnguy is incapable of gettjng his shit together. No way I'd stand for that in a partner. Amd she'll remember that. But you'd hardly be the first woman to put a man ahead of their kids. If you're going to stay in this relationship (and I suspect you are), I think you need to look at boundaries. How do you get him to take more responsibility for his issues, so that it impacts your daughter less?

HeckyPeck Fri 19-Jul-19 07:51:57

Like all divorced men he’s sounds like a little boy who has been bullied.

What a ridiculous sweeping statement.

There are plenty of divorced men who are decent parents and co-parent well with their ex-partners.

TowelNumber42 Thu 18-Jul-19 22:09:10

Does he pay 50:50 towards everything with you? Or are you subsidising him?

How long did he go not paying maintenance before CMS money started being taken from his wages? Did he pay off the loans faster? Pay for his children's school uniform?

He let the house get repossessed so she would get no equity out. Then defaulted on loans. Then paid no maintenance. Then moved away from his daughters to live with another similar aged girl. He could have lived close on his own. I guess he wouldn't have a housekeeper then though. Then he applied for 50:50 care to save £380 per month. He obviously thought his daughters would cost no money to have 50:50 then. He got his mum pay legal fees on a no hope case to piss off his ex and his children. It seems he also expected his mum to pay for petrol and use her time to ferry the children around so he could have some money for luxuries.

The mum has got a lovely support network going. The girls are happy. Yet this seems to piss you off.

A prince among men.

You have a lying cocklodger.

VolcanionSteamArtillery Thu 18-Jul-19 22:08:19

You really only have your partner's word for it that the loans were for the car, or the reason they split up was due to her relationship since.

And your OP is known for his honesty and upstanding behaviour hmm

He will drag you down with him if you're not careful.

user1486131602 Thu 18-Jul-19 22:04:14

While I understand your worries, THE most important thing should be those girls. Above everything and everyone EVERY time.
If he was to win custody 50:50 things would not get easier or cheaper for either of you. He might get a reduction CSA but would have to pay food, clothes, trips, phones,uniform, house expenses, child care costs etc. Please rethink what is best for those girls. Perhaps ask the ex if they could stay over at the weekend during the school holidays, or even take them on holiday for week , no courts or lawyers involved.
Like all divorced men he’s sounds like a little boy who has been bullied. IT IS NOT ABOUT HIM OR HIS MONEY.
It’s about the children.

TowelNumber42 Thu 18-Jul-19 21:51:12

When she left him and he stopped paying the mortgage, where was he living and where were the wife and girls living?

TowelNumber42 Thu 18-Jul-19 21:49:36

Is your house big enough to have the girls 50:50? Where do they sleep? Where do they keep their clothes?

TowelNumber42 Thu 18-Jul-19 21:46:23

I took out a bank loan to buy a car. I can easily prove the car was bought. I paid a big wodge of money to the car dealership. It's on the bank statements. I also have paperwork that details the car bought from the dealership: the quote and then invoice paid.

If I lost the statement and invoice I would call the bank and the dealership for copies. I might have to pay a small fee for those. Easy peasy.

user10303739730 Thu 18-Jul-19 21:26:01

I am sorry to say he sounds awful. As somebody is going through court, hardly receiving any CSA, and been reported to social services myself i don't have a great deal of sympathy for him. This is about whats best for the children

NeverTwerkNaked Thu 18-Jul-19 21:14:36

I feel so sorry for OP's daughter living in dire financial straits to enable this vindictive loser of a boyfriend.

Mumoftwoyoungkids Thu 18-Jul-19 21:11:46

Take care when you finally dump him Op - he was willing to ruin his own children’s lives in order to get revenge on his ex. God knows what he’d be willing to do to your child to get revenge on you.

MyCatHatesEverybody Thu 18-Jul-19 12:34:43

Bloody hell the misery some mothers will put their kids through for the sake of a bit of cock. I feel so sorry for OP's daughter living in dire financial straits to enable this vindictive loser of a boyfriend.

Penguincity Wed 17-Jul-19 20:16:32

Why are you broke? It's his mess let him sort it. It does sound like he has mad lots of poor choices. Don't marry him and keep your finances seperate. I don't think he has a hope of getting 50/50, if he did get getting his girls to school is not your concern

Nameusernameuser Wed 17-Jul-19 20:05:44

Sorry but without stating the obvious, do you realise it'll cost you more than £300 a month to have the girls there 50/50?

C0untDucku1a Wed 17-Jul-19 19:20:56

Op, why are you settling for this man. You're living in poverty. Don't you want more from life? Doesn’t your child deserve more? Don’t you expect more?

NeverTwerkNaked Wed 17-Jul-19 18:35:28

He sounds awful. I would leave any man who did these things to his ex.

swingofthings Wed 17-Jul-19 18:26:10

OP, just from what you've shared here, what he has told you doesn't stand up. He would have had many opportunities to sale his house before it was repossessed. Why don't he? Was it that he didn't want her to have anything and would rather lose out himself than her getting more?

The £15k house improvememt loan, surely if it wasn't finished, there should have been some money left. What did he do with it?

As for the car, it just doesn't stack up. She says he never gave her the money. He claims he gave her a loan but it was a bank loan with no trace thst it was for the car. The car registered to her. Then he can hate her enough to make false allegations to social services but he won't take her to court to claim the money she supposedly owe her? Can't you see how this makes no sense? He most likely took the loan out for himself but his telling you it was for her to gain your sympathy. My ex did e sctly thst, claimed his debts were due to things he bought for me. It was so far from the truth but she blindly believed him for ages. He is a serial liar but a trained convincing one.

SandyY2K Wed 17-Jul-19 17:28:46

This man will not add value to you and your DDs life. He is a user. He doesn't care about his sick mum. He's not trying to her joint custody for the benefit of spending more time with them...he's going to rely on his sick mum and you.

His mum is paying his legal bills and your mum has had to help out too. This man will drag you down and I hope it doesn't have too much of an impact on your DD... because it's the kids who didnt ask for any of this.

Everything is about him. His behaviour will only drive his DDs away from him...then he'll act the victim in several years, when they decide to have their SD accompany them down the aisle, because he's been a better father to them.

He acted in vengence last time and apparently regrets it... his current behaviour doesn't show he's changed.

He is happy to disrupt their lives . He should be paying CM. His loan repayments are not as important as the upkeep of his children. It shouldn't be left to their mum alone.

I'm not sure how much truth there is about them missing school so often. How does your fiance know this?
What have the school done about it, if they're so concerned?

Does he attend parents evenings? Does receive other updates from the school about the girls?

And as has been said..teenagers get bored easily. A picnic probably isn't so enticing to them, but even kids who like theme parks dont want to be there all the time. I have 2 of those myself. Its exhausting, waiting in line and walking around.

He can also save for special treats... what about something cheaper like tenpin bowling...

He's not coming across as making enough effort and it was rather foolish to put the car in her name, when the loan was in his name.

I'm sure she would have a very different version of events.

pikapikachu Wed 17-Jul-19 17:08:07

I think that he should be grateful that the girls have a generous aunt who funds their trips to amusement parks as well as access to another "sister". Sounds like a lot of fun to me.

I'm not saying that mum is perfect but if your partner cared about attendance etc he would have acted 4 years ago.

lyralalala Wed 17-Jul-19 16:55:07

Personally I think he was given poor advice about going for the days that he did.

There’s no chance he was advised to go for those days.

If anything picking those days smacks of a man who wants to make life difficult for his ex by hauling her to court, but doesn’t actually want 50:50.

He’ll also be able to play the “courts favour mothers” and the “she’s poisoned them against me” cards to elicit sympathy from anyone still believing he remotely has his children’s interests at heart as well

pikapikachu Wed 17-Jul-19 16:44:08

I feel sorry for your dd OP. She's going through a lower standard of living because of your partner. Why would you want to marry a man like that? Quite frankly if I were your partner I'd move in with my parents (to save half rent and half bills)

50/50 doesn't always mean no maintenance paid btw. If Dad earns much more than Mum then he may be liable for some money.

His plan to use his sick mum (and presumably you) to enable 50/50 is insane. Has he thought about how much the girls cost? Your food bill will double half the month, your petrol costs will rise, he'll have to invest in his own uniform and clothes, if they don't have a bedroom now then they'd need a bed, desk for homework etc the older child is presumably starting y7 - has he seen the initial cost of uniform when starting secondary? (I'm not even going to start mentioning the fact that they don't want 50/50) Personally I think he was given poor advice about going for the days that he did. One day here and there would make the girls feel constantly unsettled and the organization of making sure that the right books are at the right house means inevitable extra trips to drop them off.

TeachesOfPeaches Wed 17-Jul-19 16:05:20

Loads of dads go for 50/50 to get out of maintenance. All a judge will want to know is whether it is in the best interest of the child? By the sound of it it will be a big fat NO. What a waste of time and money.

My ex also sent malicious reports to SS which were very easily disproved. He is a twat OP.

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