Manipulation/alienation

[Loupyloula]

Hi
I’ve posted on here a fair bit but named changed (just in case DP’s ex comes here ever)
Not looking for advice. Just a rant really.
My DP had a call from his daughter this week. Highly unusual! And so he was delighted to answer but she was just calling to say ‘I don’t want to stay with you. Bye bye’
He could hear her mum telling her what to say in the background. She’s 5.
It’s entirely feasible she said something like that to her mum as she often says to us ‘I want to stay here forever’ and then five minutes later will ask ‘how many more sleeps before I go to mum’s?’ We would never dream of exploiting when she says ‘I want to be here forever’. We just try to help her understand her rhythm and make the most of it and cope with the harder parts of it.
My poor DP’s heart is breaking to see his daughter controlled like that. My heart is breaking for both of them.
Ill be signing the parental alienation survey.

[Iseewhatyoumeanthistime]

No advice unfortunately OP as my SC mum is doing exactly the same thing, but on a much grander scale. It's an horrendous situation at the minute and I'm fearful for DH state of mind and I'm at a loss as to how to help him.

[Loupyloula]

It’s horrible isn’t it. Especially when there’s no way to stop it. At least we can provide moral support.
And I log everything in the hope that somebody somewhere will one day be interested.

[NorthernSpirit]

Your OH needs a defined court order regarding contact. At 5 she’s too young to make the decision and unless there are safe guarding issues mum doesn’t get to control or decide.

Go up court and stop her silliness.

[Loupyloula]

Sorry Northern, I didn’t provide many details. There is a defined court order in place so the phone call means nothing in terms of whether access will happen or not. It will happen. That’s (fairly) black and white.

But this kind of manipulation is so tough. There’s nothing he can do to make his ex behave better with his daughter. And nowhere he can turn for real help.

[NorthernSpirit]

Ah I see.

My advice would be to be consistent. Show her she’s loved.

My OH’s batshit EW has also tried similar stunts. Kids are 10.5 & 13.5 now. I thought it would get better but as her control lessens (in theory) she gets worse.

On dads birthday (which wasn’t a contact day or indirect phone call day) she wouldn’t ‘let’ the kids ring dad. My OH was upset, but knows it’s not the kids.

We never stoop to her level but i am hoping that one day the kids wake up and see her actions. She’s so bitter she can’t see how her actions affect the kids.

Good luck and stay strong.

[Loupyloula]

Thanks Northern.
I get the feeling this will never get easier. The road is long.

[Iseewhatyoumeanthistime]

It's crazy the emotional and mental abuse and manipulation some women will inflict on their own kids just so that they can feel like they are punishing their ex. It really is shameful they hide behind their own kids in doing this. I cannot understand how they believe our DHs do not realise what is happening. In our situation it's all about control. The woman is a control freak and now in theory, she can no longer control DH she is doing it through the kids. Shameful.

[NorthernSpirit]

@Iseewhatyoumeanthistime completely agree (and my OH is in the same position).

Absolutely disgusting behaviour.

My OH never bad mouths the EW or lowers himself to her level. But I hope that one day the children realise what she’s done and it comes back to bite.

[HaroldsSocalledBluetits]

Life is full of funny coincidences isn't it OP. I mean, here we are one day with someone touting a petition about parental alienation and here we are the next with an example of it suddenly happening. And you've even referenced the petition in this thread, which is handy.

[Iseewhatyoumeanthistime]

@NorthernSpirit its shocking isn't it. But what can we do other than deal with it week in week out. Although DH has made me aware very recently it is grinding him down now, to the point even he dreads their contact times. Its constant put downs, constant criticism and comparisons to others or other things, it is mainly from one of the children who she appears to be able to manipulate. Perhaps because he took their separation harder, I don't know? But DH has said to me that conversations he has with him, the horrible text messages are carbon copies of his mum, which is why he knows it's her words sent through the kids. It causes an atmosphere in our home. She tells DH that he doesn't want to come, yet this time she has managed to persuade him making out she's the good guy? Not sure what game she's trying to play as every time she wants to go away we have SC. Everything is amicable ie maintenance and access no courts or anything so how do we manage this? Where can we turn for advice because as well as his own mental health DH is actually concerned for his son as he sees him as a replacement for him. Control again. So sad.

[Iseewhatyoumeanthistime]

Ps sorry @Loupyloula didn't mean to hijack your thread

[Loupyloula]

You didn’t hijack my thread! I just came in for a bit of a vent really and, while it’s sad that you and northern and your DPs are in the same situation it’s nice to feel a bit of solidarity.
There’s not a lot of help out there for this kind of thing. We’ve had psychologist help in the past for us and DSD and I think we’ll continue to go down that road. It helps us to know how to talk about things with DSD. And hopefully it will help her make sense of everything that she says is ‘all messed up in my head’ :(

[Iseewhatyoumeanthistime]

Ah glad you didn't think that @loupyloula, but you're right there's not a lot of support for situations like these. DH cut unnecessary contact with EW, and when kids got mobiles (far too early in our opinion though) it did mean he could have direct contact with them. But he can't cut contact with his son and at the minute we don't know how to deal with this. Anyway, we're going to look into our options. Hope your situation improves

[Loupyloula]

Iseewhatyoumean- You too, hoping you find a way to make things better

[SandyY2K]

It's terrible that some parents do this.

[Butterflyone1]

I'm sorry to hear your DP is upset (and rightly so). We have similar issues with DP children. You just know the ex is behind the negativity.

Just try and comfort DP and explain sadly there's not much he can do but to try and keep the routine and structure with his visits.

When DD is with you, show lots of love and affection and she will continue to want to spend time together.

It absolutely baffles me how these women can be so callous to their children. Do they not realise how damaging it is to their wellbeing. Surely as a parent all you would ever want is for your child to be safe, happy and loved and yet some people just want to mess things up for their children. It makes me so angry.

[ChillUrBeans]

Just be consistent yourselves as they get older they see it for themselves.

DP's ex sees everything as a competition and constantly bad mouths both myself and DH. We had an idea it was going on for years, about 2 years ago at 17 we were on our way out with just her and her BF and she came out with "mom whats to know what my brother getting", when I asked what she means and said we take hi out loads he is with us most weekends, she replied that "she is just using it as an excuse to try and twist his head, like she always trys to do".

Both her and DSS have a very strained relationship with mom now, she moved out at 18 and DSS sas he hates living there because mom is a "crazy phsyco", we say nothing bad about her - in fact I get on great with her when we need to see each other. We don't need to say anything because now they are older they see it for what it is and whilst they love their mom they both have no respect for her.

[fatoldandbroke]

I'm very sorry to hear about your situation Loupyloula.
This type of manipulation is child abuse and should be of concern to everyone.