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Can cafcass see thro manipulating parents.

(37 Posts)
Mum2oneds Wed 23-Aug-17 17:04:22

So have filed the court forms to set In stone to see dss more,as frankly fed up with do's, exs crap.
Dss is staying with us half a week from Monday first time she's allowed it. however when we dropped him home this weekend. The ex was saying, you know mummy will miss you and be lonely without you,and be sad you're not here. so if u want to come home you can and daddy will bring u home..
So she's planting that seed. Yesterday had a text saying dss Isnt sure he wants to come etc. We'll I can a billion percent assure you that he was very excited about this when we discussed it the weekend, as he gets to see some family we don't see often and going out for days.
We're wondering as to whether when it goes to court, of she brings it up whether they will see she's poisoning dss about staying. Spoke to the sch a while back and they said dss has been a bit withdrawn since March.. Well that's probably because mummy has had 3 men since March that each are the best thing ever etc then they walk.. ( but that's another story lol) but they said dss speaks very fondly and excitedly about when he's with us..

HappylandToysEverywhere Wed 23-Aug-17 17:06:28

Who/what is Do's? X

HappylandToysEverywhere Wed 23-Aug-17 17:09:55

CAFCASS aren't daft. If you tactfully tell them facts. Explain that he was excited then your ex said x y z and suddenly he's supposedly unsure... Let them join the dots without actually saying "I think she's manipulative" they should see it for themselves.
If ex says he's unsure, then go along with it. Say "Right ok fair enough" and then when CAFCASS are involved tell them all the times he was meant to come but didn't etc. Play the decent one.

Mum2oneds Wed 23-Aug-17 17:10:05

Oops dps, walking and typing!

Mum2oneds Wed 23-Aug-17 17:12:39

Thank you. Yeah he doesn't want to look like being a tale tale to cafcass but just telling them facts is a good idea. And majority of stuff we have on text thankfully.

Underthemoonlight Wed 23-Aug-17 17:12:58

TBH the last comment about mummy having there bfs made me realise you sound as bad as each other that comment was completely unnecessary and just demonstrated your stance on the whole situation.

Mum2oneds Wed 23-Aug-17 17:13:37

And the sch will have evidence of when we spoke to them hopefully.. If it came to it?

Mum2oneds Wed 23-Aug-17 17:15:27

It want meant like that the school said about three men too, doing drop offs and collecting etc and was unsure on the situation completely. We only know stuff through what dss tells us. Hopefully she can find someone to settle with and will hopefully settle dss at home and gain his confidence back

Underthemoonlight Wed 23-Aug-17 17:15:53

Three"

Underthemoonlight Wed 23-Aug-17 17:16:46

Could be a family friend cousin or brother the school has no real reason to be commenting on who drops them off.

Mum2oneds Wed 23-Aug-17 17:18:00

Yeah we thought that at first but dss said they always kiss and it's 'gross' bless him.. Suppose to kids that's gross lol

Mum2oneds Wed 23-Aug-17 17:19:38

But like I say, we do hope she settles somehow as being a lone parent for 7 years in the past I know how hard it is and honestly wish her all the best. Just need to get it all settled with dss as he doesn't know what to think etc.

3had0w Wed 23-Aug-17 22:50:15

The ex was saying, you know mummy will miss you and be lonely without you,and be sad you're not here. so if u want to come home you can and daddy will bring u home..
So she's planting that seed.

TBH I don't think this is 'planting the seed' I think it's a mother who is genuinely concerned about her son

Although I don't know your full situation and last obs

Janeismymiddlename Wed 23-Aug-17 23:05:46

'Planting the seed' can be a two way process - telling a child what they will be doing (or missing) and deliberately putting in place amazing activities is exactly the same thing. Equally manipulative.

Mum is allowed boyfriends, particularly if she has been single parenting for so many years. There is a very recent thread on here where it is vehemently argued introducing children quickly is perfectly acceptable. Not something I would do but unless there is clear evidence of abuse and/or neglect, CAFCASS likely to,regard it as a parenting difference. If the school comment on it, that might make a difference but depends what they say.

HappylandToysEverywhere Wed 23-Aug-17 23:17:39

Ignore the nasty comments on here. Some people are just looking to pull others apart. If you have concerns about who is around the little boy maybe speak to Social Services? I do find it disturbing that there are strange men dropping him off at school? That doesn't describe a stable home environment to me?

Hissy Tue 29-Aug-17 13:35:24

"The ex was saying, you know mummy will miss you and be lonely without you, and be sad you're not here. so if u want to come home you can and daddy will bring u home..
So she's planting that seed.

TBH I don't think this is 'planting the seed' I think it's a mother who is genuinely concerned about her son"

you know mummy will miss you and be lonely without you, and be sad you're not here

Oh that concern is anything but genuine. Good parents don't lay on this thick layer of guilt.

Mum2oneds Tue 29-Aug-17 16:32:57

We picked dss up last night. Within 30 minutes of being home we had big sobs and upset saying he wanted mummy as mummy will be crying with out him there and she's on her own at home. We explained that it's no different to all the other times he stays at weekends. But still he was inconsolable asking what mummy would do without him there, would she cry all the time. We said go to work like she normally does etc etc to earn pennies. He phoned her and she was saying I miss you, I'm very sad too and wish you were here with me. Etc etc.
It was so hard and awkward.. In the end he settled and fell asleep. Been out most of today, he's going to phone her on a bit to tell her about his day.
He keeps saying things like when I go to junior school after infant school I won't be see you anymore, my mummy and nanny said so.. And we might move to nanny's holiday house so it's too far from you..
So dp will be having a chat with her about all that when we drop him back thurs
It would be so much better if it was amicable.
I'm so glad I don't get this with my ex and my DS.

TheRealBiscuitAddict Tue 29-Aug-17 16:46:41

How old is he?

TBH there are several things here:

Firstly, if he's worried about his mum being lonely/sad I would tell him that she's probably doing all the things that she won't need to do then wen he's there i.e. Going to work/tidying his bedroom etc, and I would time phone calls to her at a time when he A, is unlikely to get too upset afterwards e.g. In the morning so that there is something planned for afterwards, and B, when she doesn't have the time to pile on the guilt e.g. Just before she's due to go of to work for instance. Also, if he calls in the morning then he won't be going to bed dwelling on his mum's sadness etc iyswim.

Also I would make it so that he calls her and not the other way around. That way she can't manipulate the situation to her advantage.

Re the boyfriends, no it definitely isn't ideal if she has several boyfriends she's introduced over a short period of time, but in the scheme of things it's not the biggest of deals. They may come and go and he'll get used to it on some level even if when he's older he rolls his eyes at yet another bf being on the scene, and he will....

And don't engage on issues at home about mummy having said x or y other than to smile and nod. Don't give it the attention she wants it to have and she'll eventually learn that there's nothing to be gained by trying to poison him in the hopes that he'll bring the poison home to his dad.

It's hard I know, but you need to rise above and be the bigger people....

And this will pass. Mine are teenage now and have other issues, but every year brings different changes and what seemed like a nightmare last year becomes less important as they grow up and gain their own independence. Hth

BeyondDespair Tue 29-Aug-17 17:13:37

Didn't your partner have to do mediation with his ex before putting in the court forms mum2oneds?

It would be interesting to know what your partner's son said to mum before mum was supposed to have responded in that way.

I recognise that conversation from when my daughter used to go to her dad's house - and didn't want to go. I would try and persuade her and then assure her that if it really wasn't OK, I'd ask her dad to drive her home or I would pick her up. Not planting seeds, just responding to her concerns. She would only go if she had that assurance.

So is dad allowed to have a partner, but mum isn't? Do you really feel she'd snog 3 men in the playground? I've yet to see any mother like that in many years of school pick ups and drop offs. And I'd be very surprised if a school was passing on information to anyone about any male friends his mother may have. The last thing they'd want would be to be dragged into domestics. They'd just be working on who the named person is who does pick ups/ drop offs. Could your partner's son be getting a bit confused? Could be school dads helping her out with the school run, a brother, uncle, neighbour, friend etc. Neighbour across the road rarely ever does her daughter's school run - lots of different people turn up in the morning and in the afternoon with her daughter. Doesn't make her a bad mum, just a busy one. And she also has a partner.

I would leave your partner to sort it out directly with his ex - face-to-face.

Mum2oneds Tue 29-Aug-17 17:23:14

Yes they have had mediation and she was all nice. At one point the mediator said to her you seem like you don't want to let go of your ds. But each time just after mediation it all goes tits up and she tries to change goal posts to suit her. . So the court forms are filled in and with mediation for them to do their bit on there.
Dp hadn't said anything other than explain he was coming different days because it's the holidays.
I never said she snogged three men in the playground. However the school did mention about different men picked him up etc. But that was only brought to light when they said dss has been more withdrawn for a few months, so dp did say, maybe it's his home life unsettled atm. That's how it came abit wasn't tit for tat type stuff. They were definitely boyfriends at the Time as since then he spoke to her about it and she didn't deny it. She said she now has a new BF who is good with dss, and makes them happy. So that's a good thing for them. And wouldn't want more upset for dss.
So hopefully things will settle if it's settled more that end.

Blondienut Tue 29-Aug-17 17:23:19

OP I feel for you. You won't get much understanding here however as unfortunately the majority of mumsnetters seem to be totally anti new partners/step mums and totally for the ex wife despite how unreasonable or nasty they may be (not saying that all ex wives are unreasonable). There are so many shit dad's but there are also so many great ones who unfortunately get a bad name from the crap ones. All you can do is continue to love and support and tell the truth. Any child has a right to have a relationship with both parents.

Mum2oneds Tue 29-Aug-17 17:26:32

Oh and when dss says things like moving away etc we just say it will never be too far away and he will always see daddy so don't need to worry. Then change the subject to what's happened at sch or what my DS may of done that day etc.
We wouldn't use dss as a go between and dp always speaks to his ex face to face when he can.. Sometimes she just opens the doors let's dss in and shuts it again so therefore he texts. But tbh txt is better as always have proof of stuff incase anything ever got stupid.

Mum2oneds Tue 29-Aug-17 17:31:32

Oh I know that and believe me I know EVERYONE has faults and no one by far is perfect. There has been times at the beginning that dp rose to silly things that was said and become just as bad. But that was nr 2yrd ago and tbh now he just does it by the book and does what he can for his son. As hard as it is not to rise to it.
See I have an ex who sees DS. And takes him away etc. But in other respects does minimum to classify being a dad. But that's some people and we just rise above it and just say things when they need to be said if directly involves DS. So I've been lucky really. I even get on with his new wife and I know she does a good job with ds too.

Like I say I hope one day his ex can move on. Realise that dss has two homes and we want to be involved with as much as possible. And hopefully one day she'll appreciate that any help or anything is a godsend.

Mum2oneds Tue 29-Aug-17 17:32:37

When I say does it by the book I mean, regards to mediation etc.

BeyondDespair Tue 29-Aug-17 18:28:45

BlondieNut. I've been an ex wife, new partner, step parent (in name), been through courts, CAFCASS, Social Services etc. Dealt with ex wife, new partner etc. What I've found in much of this is that there is often a great deal of misunderstanding of the ex wife/ partner's role and life. I've been accused of so many bizarre things by ex's and their new partners and ex wives. Including having a man in my house because A CAR was parked outside my house (in a packed residential street.) And having moved abroad because our local sorting office has an airport name and this was postmarked on a letter from me. The courts are not interested though. They don't care if so and so thought that so and so was kissing, or mum has 3 men. All the judge is interested in are CAFCASS, Social Sevices and Police reports, and even then they may decide to ignore them.

The poster's partnerwill have to deal with his ex wife for the next 14? years. And then at weddings, funerals, with grandchildren etc. Much better to actually make the braver decision of properly talking to her face-to-face, without blaming, and understand where she's coming from on all of this.

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