Argh!!

[fackinell]

Usually a calm voice of reason on SP issues but after a weeklong nonstop of entitled behaviour I am ready to leave!! DSD's behaviour is that of a normal teen: often bratty, I need, changing plans last minute, refusal to do anything and being snidey. It's her father's behaviour that's driving me insane. Pandering to all whims. I had a go at him earlier saying he should have left things at me saying 'sorry, I don't date Dads!' After we had to cancel our evening plans. NOT because of DSD but because HE asked her to come round after I said I wanted to go out and have tea (she wasn't unwelcome but had hers already.)

After two years together he insisted that when DSD hit 16, getting a divorce would be his first priority. 3 mths on and he's ummming and ahhhing about it. I'm not OW, he was separated 6yrs before me (She had an affair,) AIBU to want to get out now?

[Emptychairs]

I doubt very much that he will want to shatter the illusion for his dd, condemning you to a bit part in the great drama of her life...
Contemplate your options and decide if he's worth investing a huge amount of time and energy to steer him in the right direction, I.e. a committed partnership (marriage possible but not mandatory).
My hindsight is better than my vision, btw.

[fackinell]

Thank you, Empty. I keep thinking he is and then I get another example of how I'm bottom of the pile. I know he doesn't want to be bad daddy and instigate a divorce but it would be cheap, DSD is over 16 and her mother already has everything that she was entitled to. I think he's just worried that making their split permanent will see DSD kicking off.

Can't be arsed putting my life on hold with weekends in (as a presence for possible company) while she goes out, no overseas hols as he won't go without her and can't afford to take her and the zero discipline no matter what. Thanks for reading my rant!!

[UC]

How is he being a "bad daddy" by instigating a divorce after 8 years following separation? How could their split be any less permanent? Is DSD still hoping her parents will get back together? I think it is cruel to allow her/enable her to really believe that. It also makes you into a dispensable person. A divorce now is just confirming the current situation on a piece of paper.

You can't go on holiday without her? Never? You can't plan for weekends in case DSD comes over?

What are you getting from this relationship OP? You don't sound as though you're even on the pile, let alone near the top of it.

Have you spoken to your DP about how you feel? If he can't prioritise you even sometimes, then find someone who will. In a nuclear family, the children wouldn't be prioritised over the adult relationship all the time, so I don't see why it is different in a split family. It sounds like your DP is making his DD a mini-spouse, which is massively unhealthy for her.

Sorry.

[fackinell]

I agree, UC. We have been away for mini breaks but he ALWAYS asks if he can invite her. I want a hol away abroad and he says how much she would love it and how he would like to ask her. I would like an adult hol away and I always encourage him to do things she would enjoy, with her occasionally. 2 of our four breaks have been with DSD. He has a habit of asking her first and telling me after on a lot of things.

As far as the wknd goes, he doesn't like to make plans for a Saturday in case she fancies coming round, she stays over Thursday and Friday and I see a Saturday night as ours. Even just going out for tea involves him saying that he will see if DSD wants to come along. He is not very sociable and every evening out together begins with him asking what time we will be leaving. Not too enjoyable for me after that.

Re. the divorce, I am in no rush to get married, I just see finalising things as a commitment to me. ExW is still will OM but he is also married so its not an issue for her (and she wouldn't instigate as she wouldn't want to pay.) Money is a huge issue between them, he pays over the CSA amount plus generous pocket money but its never enough and she occasionally asks for more.

I just feel as an equal in the running and paying for the house, I should have an equal say in how we spend our time other that DSD's 'scheduled' days. He takes my money quick enough for the household but my opinion means v little. We have been fine for ages but this latest behaviour/ party trashing incident (which he did a bit of 'there there, what did the mean boys do?' head patting) means I am choosing this as one of my rare battles to pick.

[Emptychairs]

I feel for you OP. this is the same obnoxious behaviour I had to endure with dh and dsc, taking my money, etc, and doing what pleases him and dsc. I did complain very loudly to dh but to no avail. Only when I said I was considering living him if he didn't start valuing me did he finally repent. No need for dsd to be mini wife, he had me now, no need for dss to be BFF, ditto.
Looking back, it is unbelievable the kind of bs I was exposed to and meant to accept,,unquestionably.
Pick a moment when you are feeling calm and tender towards dh, tell him he means a lot to,you but you also need to feel valued by him. Just telling you he loves you means nothing. You have to feel it too. It has to be obvious, like enjoying dates with you not dsd especially on a Saturday night, the odd weekend away without dsd , etc. if he won't agree to these very modest tokens of love and then ltb...

[fackinell]

Thanks Empty, I have said to him I am seriously considering my own place and a possible complete split.

Just for once it would be nice to suggest doing something that doesn't involve him saying 'ooh, I will see if DD fancies that.' I informed him that if he doesn't stop I'm going to bring my DM along to everything we do (at least it would be a good laugh then.)

The biggest issue ATM is her behaviour which he is enabling. Being 16 has opened up a whole new world of what she thinks she can do. I remember it well and was just the same. It's the lack of punishment that bothers me (I dropped my phone down the toilet, I need a new one 'here you are DD.' etc)

Also the issue of the divorce. It will cost around £70. I was the one who told him to wait until she was 16 to lessen the cost. Why should he fork out the best part of a grand to free himself of someone who cheated on him and then took his child away from her father and home?

But now there is no excuse. Feeling a bit like a cash cow ATM. Good enough to sleep with and pay halves but not quite good enough to free himself to have a proper relationship or have a voice in the relationship. I don't like the stigma of being with a 'married man,' I feel it cheapens things, even though she was well gone when I came along.

[fackinell]

Btw are you still with yours, Empty? If you left, did you regret it?

[Emptychairs]

No, OP, I'm still with dh, but only just.
We have been in couple counseling since January and there have been big improvements to his behaviour, BUT these have only come about because the conselor told him off and said how badly this will affect his kids, spousification etc. NOT because I was the one pleading, crying, being seriously upset.
I was the one who found sites on spousification and bought the books. He read them and initially agreed, but no difference to his behaviour. He actually argued with our counselor (a lovely, understanding divorced woman herself), complaining that for example he will have to make a conscious effort not to talk to dsd, 16, in their special lowered voices. How unfair! At least it has worked out for dsd,,she's a lot happier now (I can tell because she is v nice to me and confides in me now and happily does chores).
But when I had to go through same argument re dss, his best buddy, I was ready to quit, that was in July. A scheduled appointment at counseler set dh straight, and he is making a massive effort to mend his ways.
But something has died, I fear... I realize I may be sounding a bit immature, but I'm no longer in love with dh. I miss him when he's not around for a few days, but I'm accustomed to being lp, so I know I'd manage without him.
In a way I'm waiting to see if dh is going to continue to make an effort and this behaviour will become second nature, or if he's going to spring something else on me to unsettle me or make me feel bad...
Only you know how much you can take.

[fackinell]

Sorry to hear of your troubles, Empty

I'm going to google spouseiffication (sp?)

I know what you mean about the fizzle going out. We are fairly early days and had hoped for a DC ourselves but lost one. Madam put me through hell and back whilst pregnant. She was furious and so was her mum and other siblings (not DP's.) I failed to recognise this right to be furious (upset maybe) and I very nearly left back then.

I remember her screaming how she hated me and wished there was no baby as I was cramping and bleeding and thinking how lucky she was to be getting her wish. I'm again just thinking about those times now and cursed him out for sharing our news so early with her.

I really think we will split tbh. I will honestly never date a father again, I never had after seeing friend's problems and should have stuck to my own rules.

[Emptychairs]

Thanks for flowers, fackinell.
I'm so sorry you lost your baby. How bloody awful,of your dsd though! That is unbelievable. I'm not sure I could have gone on. How very brave you must be.
Re spousification, I can recommend Patricia Love and her work on covert incest. Apparently this can go through several generations. I know that dh mum treated him like a spouse when he was growing up. Their marriage ended years ago but they are still together. Appearance is everything.
Dh and exw had a bad marriage for years, v destructive, but stuck it out for 15 years because divorce was out of the question. Dh cheated and they finally broke up.
Then dsd became mini wife... When I came along she hated me and dh did everything to make her feel superior to me. I don't know now why I married him, I think I believed just living together was undermining my status. How silly of me, of course it was him!
I feel I'm suffering from PTSD! Will I ever trust him again? Specially knowing he really blames exw for his affair? Thankfully I have a job and can look after myself, if push comes to shove...
Hope your circumstances also allow you to at least consider leaving?

[fackinell]

Thank you, Empty. Not sure i was brave, just very Vulnerable at the time and going seemed to be like letting them all win too.

I'm financially independent of DP although SE so it can be variable. I will have a look at your book recommendation. I feel he does her no favours by enabling this 'helplessness.' I had a go at him for having to teach her how to stir a pot!! I was beyond disbelief and asked him how it had got to that stage.

Don't get me wrong, I really do care about the girl although I do wonder at times how I have managed to achieve this. I totally get the marriage thing, btw. In my mind I feel it would make me feel more secure but in reality, I doubt it would change a thing.

[Emptychairs]

Re helplessness, that is more dss, 12, strategy. I don't think its laziness, more an attention thing. Dss will literally stand in the kitchen and not be able to find a bottle of milk. I don't do a thing, if dh is there I just look at him and see how he chooses to deal with it. It used to be he would baby dss and dsd just to show how much he cared, give them every second of his time, ignoring me.
Now he make them act more independently, but you can see his heart really isn't in it. Maybe its just one habit replacing another. I'll give him the benefit of the doubt for the moment.
Re dsc, I always cared for them, when they were aloof or rude it hurt. Now that dsd has come round though its like Im not that bothered anymore. I had to detach so much and for so long that its difficult to attach any real or deeper feelings to my relationship with them. Sometimes I think I'm holding it all together for ds, he is v fond of dh, gets on great with dsd and has a real brotherly relationship with dss. This is the family with siblings he has always wanted. I'd feel a total bitch if I walked now.

[fackinell]

No, I don't think you'd be a real bitch at all. If you aren't happy then that will reflect back to your own DS. You should do what you feel IMO.

Just had a new run in. I have a (gay male, if it matters?) friend visiting tomorrow when DP is at work, he gave an exasperated sigh and asked if he HAD to come here. Story of my life.

I told him in no uncertain terms that I clearly was welcome to pay into half the household without the privilege of having a home. I cant invite friends round or have impromptu visitors. His retort was that his bills and home insurance had increased and I was in no means paying half

He did eat humble pie when I said last night's issue was not DSD coming around but the fact he had invited her in spite of my plans. RE. The property trashing and his softly softly approach he called me 'the fucking parenting police' and said it was none of my business!!