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Here some suggested organisations that offer expert advice on SN.

can i ask a question , this is sort off bugging me ?

(15 Posts)
drlove8 Sat 24-Oct-09 12:26:23

i have dd4 who is suspected ASD/ gdd.
i also have two boys who are dyslexic
and one who has adhd.
I have noticed that the boys are concidered(at times, not always) by certain people , to have SN.
I dont really agree with this tbh, i think they just have unusal "quirks". The dyslexia in particular is managed very well and isnt really a problem. ADHD is definatly more challenging , but i wouldnt class them as anywhere near dd4's situation .
am i right ? or am i just being silly here.

daisy5678 Sat 24-Oct-09 12:44:25

I suppose I don't consider dyslexia so much of a SN as a SEN. I would consider ADHD to be a SN though, as it affects everything, not just mainly school.

Hassled Sat 24-Oct-09 12:44:30

I would see Dyslexia more as a Special Educational Need than anything else. But it's just words/labels at the end of the day - you can pick and choose which terms you wnat to use. Your "quirk" is another person's Special Need - there's little you can do to change people's perceptions.

sarah293 Sat 24-Oct-09 14:06:22

Message withdrawn

BobbingForPeachys Sat 24-Oct-09 14:20:02

It ahs to depend on the rpesentation I think.

ADHD can be very severe and cause a need for special ed, all sorts of intervention, or it can be manageable. Likewise Aspergers (Riven's son is manageable, I can't link as I cant go there atm but there's a thread about my son on SN from yesterday called soemthing about resi care. He's off to an ASD unit at comp I hope.

Dyslexia is difficult I think and it is considered an SEN / SN at severe level by LEA's if they grant a statement (and it can happen)- if there's a full presentation with organisational skills, memeory issues etc it can impair life chances severely. But mostly on MN it is classed as SEN, which is a bit different and has its own area.

But i think it is very much a case of look at the child and not the name; if the condition is causing impairment to life chances then its SN.

Also, if people are using SN to refer to their child it usually means they need support, and who are we to decide who needs that after all?

BobbingForPeachys Sat 24-Oct-09 14:21:26

Sorry if that came over as riven's son is less sever I didnt mean that, just there are different risk factors and presentations. DS3, fairlys evere ASD, is more manageable than ds1, even if he is higher functioning IYSWIM.

drlove8 Sat 24-Oct-09 15:30:40

I see , thats what i sort of ment . the boys with dyslexia use alphasmarts at school , so they cope fine (i dont think they are severe btw). Ds3 - with the ADHD is quite badly affected by it and his schooling has suffered , but hes now medicated and catching up with his peers at an increadable rate . He's like a different boy now. But even pre - medication he was much easier to parent than dd4 .There was less hospital appointments (and worry if im honest) and disruption to our life.
These days it seems most of the running around is dd4 based , her appointments , her needs have to be met first. If only dd4 could be helped with medicine ,like her brother .sad.
I think SN and SEN get confused,or overlaped sometimes.And from what i`ve learned here today SEN is education based?that it stops or slows their education?
My oldest boys fall into the sen then?
ds3 is mostly sen, but might have been SN pre-meds?
blush - its as clear as mud !

BobbingForPeachys Sat 24-Oct-09 15:33:30

Ah you see thats where it gets confusing

On MN SEN covers educational stuff, SN the disability stuff (generally I think of disability as qualifying for DLA).

In RL though, the LEA uses the term SEN to cover anything needing additional suppoty-they don't separate the two

drlove8 Sat 24-Oct-09 15:50:51

funny you mentioned that Bobbing .... (lea) its a teacher that usually say x and y`s special needs hmm

BobbingForPeachys Sat 24-Oct-09 15:55:46

Ah what theya re doing is abbreviating the system under which they receive help- its called the SEN system but SN is shorter I guess; everything that needs any help at all, whether its at SA level ( mild needs) to statement, is encompassed.

So my guess is you've got someone dodgy on their termnology., rather than anyone making a point IYSWIM

drlove8 Sat 24-Oct-09 15:59:49

oooohhh i see <<<<penny finally drops !>>>
thanks everyone , will try not to get irked by it in future . smile

daisy5678 Sat 24-Oct-09 23:42:08

I sometimes forget that J is SN - he is my only child so I have no comparisons. I guess that's the thing with 'hidden' disability. When he's in a good phase, things can be so lovely. He's never ever dull.

But even in a good phase, I forget how much more he needs than other kids. He can never ever be unsupervised, at home or at school and the level of his Statement, DLA and SS provision reflects that massive extra input I guess. His self-care skills are very minimal, still needs help with dressing, toileting etc. etc. and can only eat with his fingers or occasionally a spoon. And then I remember how much input he's had from so many agencies to reach this stage!

Agree with Peachy that some children with ASD need masses more input than others. It is a spectrum and some have quite mild ASD and will not need more than a bit of extra input on social skills or something. A lot of children on the autistic spectrum need a lot less input than J but then again he has some massive strengths too - nobody beats him on a computer!

It hits home sometimes when I meet parents of other kids, especially ones with ASD, as I always assume that we share similar experiences, but often I realise that, behaviourally, J is extreme and that's where the disability is massive in terms of its impact on his life and mine.

I belong to a parents' group which is working with the local authority to try to re-design the short breaks programme. There used to be two unofficial sub-groups - those with children who had a physical disability and one for those with a mental disability. Initially, you could tell that the divide stemmed from the fact that the people with physically disabled, often medically complex children thought that we had it easy because wheelchairs etc. and the very visible barriers that their child faced each day were far more difficult to overcome than a behavioural/ learning or social problem which seemed more minor or fixable because it couldn't be seen. Equally, some of the ASD children's parents (and those with GDD etc) felt that they had it harder because society could see physical disability, attitudes are better towards it and provision was easier to put in place.

But then I think everyone has realised that we, of all people, shouldn't be competing over who had it hardest, and that we all had it hard in different ways. I did get a bit sad though when I was talking to a new lady one week about a major 3 hour meltdown that J had been on where he'd destroyed most of the downstairs, actually managed to smash a bottle and try to hit me with it (this is because I'd accidentally deleted one of his numerous Sky+ed episodes of Scooby-Doo) etc. etc..

She was looking at me very shock and said how awful it must be to be me sad because she wouldn't have the physical or emotional energy. She said that the numerous jobs and medical stuff is exhausting but predictable and she couldn't cope with an unpredictable violent child like J sad. Her ds has CP and a rare genetic syndrome (can't remember the name) and is in a wheelchair and I was quite upset actually to see that she felt that about J- still can't quite unpick that now to articulate why.

We've talked on here before about the hierarchy and competitiveness that goes on about SN and I hate it really. I think that we and SS and all the other people who make judgements on level of disability have to take into account the impact on that person's life and those of others around them. What peachy said really. It's about impairment and impact, not the name.

daisy5678 Mon 26-Oct-09 11:57:45

I really do think this country needs a reminder that disability isn't always physical - had another verbal slap from an old guy today about using J's Blue Badge at Tesco - why won't they change the picture on it to something other than a frigging wheelchair?

Felt like offering to let him do a trial run (literally) with J from one end of the huge car park to the other without J a) running off b) screaming and whirling because a car has beeped c) screeching and running off because he's seen a dog d) shouted at a random stranger for 'walking weirdly' e) fiddled with every car door and wing mirror that he passes (blush when someone is in the car) etc. etc.

Grrr. Instead, just walked off with nose in the air with J whirling beside me. Am finally developing an ever-thicker skin.

drlove8 Tue 27-Oct-09 23:07:57

ah the blue-bade fiasco strikes again.... do you find its mostly older people who comment? ... i have been told off for useing disabled bays by a older , man with a walking stick ...hmm...not exactly a visualy recognised disability himself...<sigh> you'd think he'd have recognised that the blue badges are not just handed out to chair users.
tut tut and thats out of order comments annoy me the most, i think . i have to admit that i have snapped back on occasion that (dd4)she will have her disability for life and that it isnt something that happened due to old age , its not like she can look back and say i was fine until i hit 50-60 yrs old...
... and why does this always happen when its a "bad" day .... aka - meldowns r us! hmm

daisy5678 Tue 27-Oct-09 23:24:38

It definitely always happens on a bad day, a day when I kick myself for not remembering to do the online shop in time.

Oh well, he kept the shoppers entertained with his singing obsession grin. He's moved onto Phantom of the Opera now (finds all Andrew Lloyd Webber stuff on Youtube) and is really quite dramatic and beautiful...just still finds it hard to understand why he shouldn't sing so loudly in public ("but you say I have a lovely voice Mummy, so why can't I sing?"). So we compromise and he sings quietly, but we still get very funny looks, particularly as he leaps and whirls his imaginary Phantom cloak grin

Then he threw all the eggs on the floor by the checkout 'to see what would happen'. hmm

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