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I dont want to join this club

(34 Posts)
ipodtherforipoor Tue 06-Oct-09 13:08:41

but I think I am...

DS4 been at school 4 weeks has just been excluded for the rest of the day.

I think its time I faced up to the fact that as bright and funny and clever he is, he is also probably ASD.

God I feel crap - I cant stop crying, heaving, and wondering where this is all going, I just want to run away
- with DS actually!

I dont know what to do - do I send him to his room for the rest of the day, let him watch tv, play, read - it all seems like a reward for being sent home

arghhhh I want this to stop before it begins

logi Tue 06-Oct-09 13:13:51

Hi,what was he excluded for and how old is he?
My ds is ASD and can be a handful but he can also be very your ds being assessed for ASD ?

ipodtherforipoor Tue 06-Oct-09 13:27:47

not yet but they are sending in some sort of fast responce team tomorrow and the head has said he has to have 1:1

He's 4(feb baby), and he has been excluded for hitting scratching multiple adults and teachers, and children, and deviance when being asked to move from one activity to another,

When I went to pick him up he was sat in the heads office having his lunch while everyone else was out playing.

He is the sweetest thing but I think its all learnt, ie he knows what to do because I've taught it but he doesn't understand or feel it.

catkinq Tue 06-Oct-09 13:37:37

what do you mean by "its all learnt"?

fatzak Tue 06-Oct-09 13:44:10

Ipod sad

Isn't it odd how our first instinct is to run away from it all and to take them with us? Whenever DS has a bad time of it at school, that's always, without fail, my first emotion. I have literally sobbed for hours about DS1 and how if only we could just go and live in the middle of nowhere and lead some innocent life away from all the pressures of life. (am having a weepy moment as I type thinking about it blush)

I hope that you get the help and support that you and DS need and that he will be able to be back in school soon.

amberflower Tue 06-Oct-09 13:55:59

Totally understand the desire to scoop up child and run. DS was DX'd asd/aspergers in May and I can vividly remember lying cuddled up in bed with him that evening, reading bedtime stories, and thinking 'I wish I could just take you away from it all and protect you forever'.

Does he seem to understand why he has been excluded and what he has done wrong, or is he a bit baffled? And when you say 'it's all learnt' - have you had issues before, i.e. at preschool, which have given you cause for concern that he might be ASD? Do you have issues at home? Or has all of this come out of the blue?

Either way you have my sympathies - DX was a total shock to us; we have no issues with DS at home but he has found school hard. He's more of a withdraw into own world when under pressure child than a hitting out one but no matter how it manifests itself it's distressing to say the least, and desperately hard for you as a parent. I hope you get some support both for your little boy and for you.

magso Tue 06-Oct-09 14:03:39

Oh Ipod I feel for you! My son was unofficially and officially excluded in his first half term at school too for similar. Its horrible.
I hope the fast response team can put support in place quickly.

ki28 Tue 06-Oct-09 14:11:15

hi ipod, big hugs and glass of wine coming your way from me(if only!) I know how you feel. and its very hard.
My son was the most perfect,normal(wat eva that is)bright happy little boy(to me and my close family and friends he stil is all the above),untill we started school.

When after being their one term,we had a metting with scholl they brought up asd and explained aswell as they could,bearing in mind i had a baby of three weeks also.

i just sat shellshocked and cried.
Untill that day we had the (so called) perfect little family.
As scary as it is the more you learn and listen to others who have been there and dealt with this,it doesnt seem so much of the unknown. this board was and still is my lifeline and my handbook to my sons suspected asd.

I just tried to remember that he is still the same little boy as he always has been and that the stress(so i think,after advice from here) from beginning school tiped him on on the spectrum.

My best piece of advice is take every help that is offered as waiting for apps can take a while,read up on it and ask questions.
You have my support,please dnt hesitate to message me. take care x

AboardtheAxiom Tue 06-Oct-09 14:20:23

well honestly there are worse clubs you could join smile {{{ipod}}}

I posted in a similar manner over a year ago, and totally relate to how you are feeling, my DS is currently being assessed for ASD (he is high functioning but definately on the spectrum!), and is struggling in school, and them with him. I too wish I could scoop him up and run away with him.

I don't think you should instill an all afternoon punishment, but maybe keep mentioning in a short factual way, we don't hit. (Or something - I know that sounds a but patronising, I know you will say that anyway). I have been thinking about my own DS's behaviour at school - he is withdrawing rather than lashing out but could just as easily be doing same as your DS, and I think rather than punishing his behovious school should be looking for what triggers it and trying to change the environment/situation to avoid it/minimise it.

Good that the school are on board in pshing for an assessment and 1:1.

Keep posting, this club is very supportivbe and I don't know what I would do without MN, coming to terms with your child having SN is like a grieving process and having mums around who totally 'get it' really helps.

ipodtherforipoor Tue 06-Oct-09 14:21:12

thanks you guys,

I think "learnt" describes it because of the way he says it - it sounds like me! He's so unaware ofthe meaning behind the words - He was asking why I was crying but before I anwered he responded with the same answer I give him when he cries because he misses my mum and dad when the travel for work " you know dee and Da go to work, they'll be back on a stay home day" - its like a little tape recorder! and he say "I just cant helo myself" - almost like someone has said it to him to explain his behaviour. Perhaps I'm reading too far into it..

I used to fantasise about running away on my own from him but now I want to take him with me! Clearly my own mental health has improved!

At nursery he did have problems but they managed him - ed psych put him on transition plus, but she didn't hint that he had a "diagnosible" problem or advise me to take him to the Dr. Feel aa bit let down and guilty all at once.

School have asked me to speak to GP but he looked at me like I was bonkers after seeing the boy! Not sure he believed me that the polite interested in the medical models was the same child that they see at school.

hmmm, lets see what tommorrow brings and what this emergency ed psych says.

I'm going to hit the green&blacks tonight - the milky bar I tried last night didn't make it any better! hmmm, I feel that 3st I lost coming back already!

ipodtherforipoor Tue 06-Oct-09 14:24:35

I know its not such a bad club - even at the extreme ends of the spectrum its somewheere I would fancy working in my day job as an OT - yep, it gets worse - ~I'm one of those professional types that should understand and cope with this much better!

thaks for all the hugs and wine etc!

5inthetomb Tue 06-Oct-09 14:25:37

Just glimpsed through this post, and have to go on a driving lesson now. Will come back to it later.

Call your HV and ask her to make you an appointment, as from my past experience, GP's don't listen.

Will be back later, in the meantime, enjoy your chocolate smile

MissBreezy Tue 06-Oct-09 14:30:11

Just wanted to say hi, we are going through all of this at the mo and can honestly say it's been the worse few months of my life!
My DS sounds very similar, he's been hitting out/pushing, having meltdowns and refusing to do things etc and he's only been at school for just over 3 weeks and have been called in over 4 times ;-(

We are in the assesment stage right now so I'm hoping for a dx very soon!

Not got any real advice as it's all quite new for me too but just wanted you to know you are not alone xxx

pumpkinpasties Tue 06-Oct-09 14:31:37

totally welling up at the cuddling up and reading stories amber ds has cp, hes only 1 and i just want to protect him from the big bad world. sorry for gatecrashing.

AboardtheAxiom Tue 06-Oct-09 14:35:21

ha ha the tape recorder and the polite child interested in the doctors medical models sounds startingly familiar. hmm DS described gloop as 'mysterious' this morning to me, a group of other mums, and classmates this morning. I totally get the idea of your little lovable, clever and sweet little boy doesn't gel with the idea of admitting he probably has ASD. As I said I really feel for you.

I work with children too and being able to recognise it doesn't help you emotionally, you are a mum with him not an OT smile

ipodtherforipoor Tue 06-Oct-09 14:44:29

true - but I did OT him out of not liking gloopy things! now he likes it! Still wont eat hot food though - cold pasta, meat , fish, raw veg - most things just not hot!

debs40 Tue 06-Oct-09 15:07:57


The HV will not usually deal with children over 5 but if you have a friendly one, she will point you in the right direction.

You need the school doctor rather than the GP but the GP is the way to reach the school doctor (community paediatrician). This is the first step, generally, in the assessment process.

I do feel for you so much as like many posters, I've been there (am still there grin). DS is being assessed for ASD and every morning DS says he doesn't want to go to school and I see him lost going into class. He hasn't been in trouble for a while but is so easily misunderstood and I'm sure he misses half of what goes on despite his intelligence.

I often fantasise about home ed. Don't know if it would be the right thing or be possible but it seems so hard for him at school sometimes and he seems so vulnerable.

Like some of the other posters, everything was fine before school (or so we thought) as we were safe in our own little world!

I think punishments seldom tackle the issue and communication is really important to set up so a neutral, non-judgmental chat about what happened is probably more effective. If you can get him to talk, that is a real step in the right direction.

Good luck

magso Tue 06-Oct-09 15:46:27

Regarding what others did during exclusions. If my son was sent home because the school could not cope - ensure his safety (lunch times, school trips, staff shortages etc) we had a busy cosy day. If ds was sent home because he did something unacceptable (picking flowers, pushing, scratching) I was worried he would learn to repeat the event to get home so felt making it boring for a short while was needed. Then we were cosy - making a card to say sorry, buying a new plant for the school garden- something to help ds understand cause and effect. Quite frankly he often did not know what he had done wrong.

janess404 Tue 06-Oct-09 16:35:26

Give your ds a big hug if you can take him to the park and make good memories with him rememebr he your ds and an school excluding a child and not having empathy and a plan to move forward and build relations with the parent is not a school where you should want to send your child,

Fuck the school maybe its a good time to look for a better place

Dont be too upset its going to be better for your son!

daisy5678 Tue 06-Oct-09 17:34:11

hmm don't think saying 'fuck the school' is very helpful, actually. It's about the school and the OP being able to work together to help DS4, not just walking away.

OP, I'm sorry - tis really hard and J was v similar in reception. We went down the road of sorry cards and stuff if he'd been sent home & no TV, but quiet things like reading him a story.

Sounds good that the school are looking into 1:1 and I would also insist that the GP made a referral to CAMHS, well-behaved in the surgery or not, there's obviously an issue that could be usefully investigated.

I find that keeping in my head 'he can't help some of it' but also 'he still needs to be taught what he can and can't do' helps balance out the veering between feeling he should and shouldn't be punished. In 8 years, J will be in 'real world', where he can't punch, bite etc. and will be punished, ASD or not. But, at the moment, I want school to be very aware of his capacity for perfection i.e. not possible, so don't want him punished for every little thing he does, just the big stuff.

Take care.

janess404 Tue 06-Oct-09 17:45:16

I guess everyone has different ways of dealing with things however i have learnt a few things since been in this special needs world,

i) never apologise for my son to the school.
ii) dont pussy foot around with the school its a service provided by the government to help you and your child just because they look down at you the parent doesnt make them right. They are there to serve and assist you.
iii) everyone is accountable to someone even the school so dont be scared to say what you want.
iv) the relationship with your child and your health is more important than some teachers opinion, dont make yourself unwell or the relationship with your child hostile on the word of a teacher.

Yes maybe fuck the school is a little extreme but rememeber you are the customer and you have other choices you dont owe the school anything they owe your child an education!

sorry if i caused offence but people get brain washed in to what the school says is the law IT IS NOT!

ipodtherforipoor Tue 06-Oct-09 17:54:43

GP rang to feedback from the appointment I had with him last week to say that he thought the school ed psych would be sufficient - so I explained what had happened today so he said he'd go off to speak to ed psych from nursery and find out where to make referral to for NHS type intervention. He's new to Plymouth and hasn't had to do this yet. He was very nice actually and asked how I was and did I need anything - I said I had lots of friends supporting me! whch made me giggle a bit as I know none of you from Adam!

My G is only 4, an only child and has only been at this school since 5th Sept 09! - I'm not at the point of wanting to change schools but I am prepared to if need be. The school have been very supportive so far. I think perhaps the problems have been minimised by the nursery staff who cared so much for DS, so the school was not really prepared for the transition problems.

CakeandFineWine Tue 06-Oct-09 18:42:17

hey hun

Why haven't you contacted be before it got to this!!!
I'll ring u later when both our DC's are tucked up in bed!
He's NOT bad or Mad and you know it!!!!

amberflower Tue 06-Oct-09 18:43:17

Ipod - it is still very early days for your DS, I do see where janess404 is coming from but if at all possible start off by working with the school so to speak and try to foster as positive a relationship as possible. Admittedly there are, sadly, many schools that are not meeting the needs of some SEN children - but if your DS's school have been supportive so far then that is a good start....see what the ed psych comes up with, they may well refer for multi agency assessment (this is what happened with my DS).

I too have a DS who you would never suspect as having social and communication issues if you were to meet him outside school. Only in the 30-kids-in-the-class environment of school do the ASD behaviours come to the fore. So, it's all about getting as much help as he might need within school so that he can be happy there and maximise his potential. The same will be true I am sure for your DS - it is still very early days for him at school and it is amazing how effective even some of the smallest interventions can be.

daisy5678 Tue 06-Oct-09 19:26:47

Janess404 - you remind me why I hate my job (a teacher) at times. No, we're not there to 'serve you', as you so charmingly put it. We're there to teach your child.

Your attitude to teachers is only too clear. Fuck the school, never apologise, say what you want...all your own words. hmm

I accept that there are some bad teachers and schools but, ffs, how on earth can you work in partnership with teachers and schools for the sake of your child if you have that sort of attiude?

I really hate people who take out their attitude towards teachers and schools on their child, and who always assume the school is at fault. Just as bad as teachers who assume the parent is at fault and in no way helpful for the child. Who should be more important than a bad attitude or 'getting one over' on the school.

OP, sorry to have taken this off track. FWIW, there is a middle way between letting your child do whatever they want & blaming the school every time anything goes wrong and punishing your child for everything.

Me, I've learned that 'in this SN world', polite but firm, forceful but fair and trying to see others' points of view gets you a long way. You sound like you're that type of person anyway and so I wish you luck. Please don't see the school and other services as the enemy - they shouldn't be and I think implications that they are are very unhelpful for you, tbh, as they might well be your lifeline for getting ds help.

Good luck.

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