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am going to try and get it all in one posting because i am sick of being accussed of drip feeding so while i have 5 minutes.....

(34 Posts)
TheLadyEvenstar Wed 19-Aug-09 21:47:44

bit of background first

ds1s father and i split when ds1 was 22m old. The relationship was not very good tbh it was total crud with him being manipulative, lying, violent, and controlling.
I raised ds1 alone until 2006 when i met dp.

However when ds1 was 3 his behaviour was not so good he would have raging tantrums, these worsened when he was 4 1/2 and had the MMR.

He is now 11 yrs old has been seen by drs, child psychologists, child psychiatrists, counsellors, learing mentor at school.

A typical day in our home (holiday time)

I will wake him up
he will have breakfast..this is when problems start...
I will ask him to wash and dress (if we are going out)
then the tantrums start and they escalate very quickly from him saying "its not fair" to "I hate you and wish you would put me in care/were dead"

I have tried many reward systems over the years and tbh i am at the point of screaming. I tried posting this on AIBU and basically have been told his behaviour is all my fault, i have emotionally damaged him, i bully him etc.

1 of the child psychologists diagnosed ODD but the one we are seeing now says no thats not the case.

We had a session the other day which was quite lengthy...3 hours to be exact. The CP spoke to ds1 for an hour or so and then ds1 and ds2 (23m) went into the bedroom to watch a film and play. Although i had been listening to ds1, the CP seems to have got inside his head and had some things to tell me.

He stated again that ODD is not what is wrong with ds1.
DS1 is fully aware of what he is doing
That to ds1 this is a game which he is actually having fun with.
He says basically ds1 enjoys having power over me, that his threats he makes - "Take me to see a psychiatrist and i will make them believe you beat me" are all to dominate me and make me back down into submission.
The same as when i was meant to go out and he said "If you go i will play up so dad calls you to come home"
I digress.
The CP believes that ds1 is far more aware than people are giving him credit he is playing the fool whilst being very cunning. He also says DS1 needs to learn to take responsibility for his actions. He (ds) harps on about how hard his life is because he has to do a few chores
Load the dishwasher
bring his clothes to the machine
and clear up with ds2 when they have finished playing.

He is demanding £10 per month pocket money plus a daily payment of either 50p or a £1 i am "allowed" to make that choice.

He refuses to go to sleep, last night was awake until 1.30am and i cancelled a day out because of it.

sorry need to deal with ds2 be back soon.

smallwhitecat Wed 19-Aug-09 21:58:20

Message withdrawn

TheLadyEvenstar Wed 19-Aug-09 22:06:15

Small, I don't want to be accused of trying to have all the answers (again).
What this CP says does chime in and thats the thing i have tried to get others to understand. He does know what he is doing, I am not saying he has not got hurt from the past.

BUT this is where i cannot get people to understand,

IF i DON'T ask DS1 to do anything and do everything myself that includes everything for him then he will be perfectly behaved.


IF i DO ask him to do something even as simple as putting a cup in the dishwasher he will start tantruming. which as i said will start with its not fair which i generally reply to with "well life isn't fair" and escalating to what i already stated.

So in my belief yes he is fully aware of this because he says things like

"If YOU had told me we were going out i would have behaved"

"If YOU give me something i will behave"


smallwhitecat Wed 19-Aug-09 22:23:40

Message withdrawn

TheLadyEvenstar Wed 19-Aug-09 22:31:19

Small, I would say the latter reason...anger at rejection by his own father who has had little to do with him in the 9 yrs we have been apart. He has seen him once in 4 years and that was on ds1's request.

smallwhitecat Wed 19-Aug-09 22:37:07

Message withdrawn

TheLadyEvenstar Wed 19-Aug-09 22:53:01

I have tried to talk to him in the past about his father, he won't even call him dad he is known by his first name by ds1. His dad lives with him (dp).

Have a good sleep x

mummyslittleboy Wed 19-Aug-09 22:54:14

Hi Ladyevenstar,

He sounds exactley like my step son used to be when he lived with us this was about 8 years ago now but he was exactley like your son if he didn't get his way he would smash the house up this went on for years in the end his uncle used to come round every time he did it and have a go at him but he would then make a point of praising the others with a treat ie magazine sweets etc because they were behaving It will be a long hard slog and by no means an easy task you have but we got there in the end and you will to take care xx

mummyslittleboy Wed 19-Aug-09 22:56:21

oops forgot to say we did get him councelling which he went to the first session and then ran away from home I didn't tell him about the secound session and when we got to the hospital he ran away againangry We tried everything but it took time

TheLadyEvenstar Wed 19-Aug-09 23:11:20

Mummy, in my heart of hearts i know he is aware of what he is doing. I am on here because AIBU people have really run me down one has reported me as well. it is tiring living like this and i come on to vent or get things off my chest but am faced with "its your fault" you caused this you won't listen etc etc.

Someone else suggested doing that praising ds2 if he was doing something good when ds1 was not if that is right....i did today ds2 got the milk out of the fridge he is 23m old and i made a fuss of him. ds1 was already kicking off at this point and it did make him worse but he quickly calmed down!

mummyslittleboy Wed 19-Aug-09 23:27:43


Sorry I am quite new here so dont know all the abbreviations AIBU?

It is tiring living with a child like your son and the extremes they go to my stepson i swear was like it because his mum kept kicking him out and he felt like she didn't love him. It is not your fault you dont cause your child to be like it at all it is the way he is and the emotions he is going through that are making him this way. SO don't blame yourself you are n here trying to get advice to help him if you didn't care you wouldn't be here you would be letting him get on with it.

Yeah the praising thing is right the way we did it though was as soon as he started in one of his tantrums i would say to his sister aren't you good for behaving so well and would get a treat out of the cupboard and give it here it made him worse at first because she got something and he never but if he had a good day then I would reward him to and thank him for making the day so nice in time it worked it took a long time and there were days when i felt like giving up but in the end we got there.

TheLadyEvenstar Wed 19-Aug-09 23:32:29

AIBU is am i being unreasonable.

I will continue to try this method Mummy, TY xx

mummyslittleboy Wed 19-Aug-09 23:35:03

Goodluck let us know how it goes feel free to get in touch anytime I know its hard but it will get better xx

debs40 Thu 20-Aug-09 00:13:07

LadyEvenStar - I don't agree with what you've said about the responses to your posts on AIBU. Many posters were trying to offer constructive advice over a long period of time but basically lost patience after the responses they received - rightly or wrongly. I think the fact that some were aware (although I am not) of what seems to be a substantial and complicated history to this which may have affected their responses.

I hope you and your son get the help you need.

TheLadyEvenstar Thu 20-Aug-09 00:22:49

Debs, I was told it was my doing, my fault etc hence me saying that. I am far too tired to bicker and argue anymore, trust me there has been enough of that indoors. I am not saying everyone did that but some did. Some people gave me some sound advice others were not listening or rather reading the whole picture.

debs40 Thu 20-Aug-09 00:30:13

I hope it gets better for you.

lou031205 Thu 20-Aug-09 09:28:23

TLE, I have read various threads of yours, both now and in previous posting name, and I read the other thread you started in AIBU. I didn't respond to that one, because you already had several 'conversations' going!

I do think that the issues you have with your DS are complicated. I also think that in some way there seems to be a focus on apportioning blame. You seem to blame your son for his behaviours, and the posters on AIBU in turn seem to be blaming you for his issues. I think the very first thing to do is to try and step away from blaming anyone. It reminds me of the thing that psychologists say about arguments. If someone is shouting at you, your instinct is to shout back, which fuels the agressor even more. By lowering your voice, the agressor runs out of 'fuel' for their anger, and it deescalates the argument.

Right now, your DS, for whatever reason, is getting his feedback from a negative source. He is gaining your attention by behaving in unacceptable ways. I think, from what you have posted, that there has been quite a significant shift in his role in your life in recent years. In his earlier life, he played too much of a grown up role, and so boundaries weren't clear. You treated him more as an equal, as it was just the two of you. Now, as he is growing up, he is expected to play the role of a child, because you have a DP. He is rebelling, because he is frustrated and insecure, I think.

Unfortunately, any action you take will need to be repeated a hundred fold, in order to sink in. And that mostly means positive, positive, positive, positive feedback. Even when disciplining him. Clear boundaries, established consequences, but no apportion of disappointment or blame.

MojoLost Thu 20-Aug-09 09:37:45

Hello TLE,
I haven't read any of your previous threads so I have no idea of the history. But what whitecat says I think is spot on.

I recommend that you read a wonderful book called : The power of positive parenting, by dr. glenn latham. It's motto is:
"Research has shown that the most effective way to reduce problem behaviour in children is to strengthen desirable behaviour through positive reinforcement rather than trying to weaken undersirable behaviour using aversive or negative processes"

The past doesn't matter, whatever happened happened. The wonderful thing is that you are a caring mother who wants to fix the issues, that is why you are looking for help and advice here. So just concentrate on the future.

You CAN change your child's behaviour, but first you need to modify your own behaviour and your response to his tratrums. It will take a long time, and you will need bucket loads of patience and love, but it will happen. PLease please, read this book I mention, it will help you.

MamaMaiasaura Fri 21-Aug-09 14:26:21

TLE - sorry you had the AIBU stopped. Reading I felt that there was a alot of advice there which seemed well meant. It did seem thought that you didnt want to hear all of it and only picked bits that suited you. Sounds like you and your dc has ahad a really hard time but work and effort needed with all. I didnt see a response to my question as to whether you have a diagnosis as well to deal with for yourself (bpd) but if so this is an area to be addressed to and together.

TheLadyEvenstar Fri 21-Aug-09 17:22:35

Awen, I do not have BPD there is nothing wrong with me thanks....why would you suggest I have a borderline personality disorder because my sons behaviour was getting me down???

I am human and sometimes we all need to rant about things. It seems MN is no longer the place it used to be.

debs40 Fri 21-Aug-09 17:55:45

I thought BPD was Bipolar disorder??

Anyway, I think Lou's advice was really helpful for any mum. These are issues which affect us all to one extent or another at some time or another, so don't take it too personally.

FabBakerGirlIsBack Fri 21-Aug-09 18:05:24

TLE - if it is any consolation I am sometimes sure my kids know exactly what they are doing.

TheLadyEvenstar Fri 21-Aug-09 18:58:22

Debs, no I don't have bi polar. I suffered from depression after my dad died.

saintlydamemrsturnip Fri 21-Aug-09 19:09:29

God it sounds horrendous . In some ways the label doesn't really matter - strategies do - have you been given any?

For younger children I always recommend Stanley Greenspan's - the challenging child. I wonder whether it's worth reading to see whether it rings any bells from his younger years.

saintlydamemrsturnip Fri 21-Aug-09 19:16:27

One thing about a strategy is that you have to be able to stick to it. Otherwise you just make the behaviour more persistent. So trying things when you're unsure can make the situation worse.

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