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now I know there is no way I would vote for this man

(243 Posts)
2shoes Sat 16-Aug-08 22:48:55

dipstick that he is

QueenBhannae Sun 17-Aug-08 00:42:07

That sickened me. sad

The picture looks emotionless on his part too. sad

Raine3 Sun 17-Aug-08 00:58:38

Classic publicity shot ! talk about using your child.

JamieJay Sun 17-Aug-08 01:09:28

How can a father speak so dismissively about his own son.

r3dh3d Sun 17-Aug-08 07:31:31

That's the only picture I've ever seen of Cameron with his disabled son, obviously it's years old. Interesting that they don't release another one, it's very "politician kisses baby" which when it's your own child is Just Wrong.

I don't think what he has said is surprising. He was either going to go with what the Conservative voter wants to hear (ie I don't have a personal agenda which might cost you tax money), or he was going to take a personal stand on an issue most voters don't understand, which would brand him forever as anti-abortion (ultra right-wing, anti-women, old-fashioned etc. etc. all stuff he wants to get away from)

The only surprising thing to me is that he said anything at all. If I were him I'd avoid the question completely.

sarah293 Sun 17-Aug-08 12:04:41

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2shoes Sun 17-Aug-08 12:05:32

it saddened me that he thinks disabled children are not worthy in the same way as nt kids. i thought he would be good fro the sn world, but yet another dipstick.

heartmummy Sun 17-Aug-08 12:15:07

complete fecker!!!!! doctors told me to abortion when 7 months with my dd said she would not live a few days!!! she will be three in november and a happy little girl,all these babies need a chance of life

jimjamshaslefttheyurt Sun 17-Aug-08 14:19:12

I don't think he has any choice does he?

I mean I personally wouldn't back the introduction of a law that made termination on grounds of disability unlawful. yes, I'd like a tightening of the definition of 'severe disability', no I personally wouldn't have a termination for a condition compatible with life but I think if asked the questions he was asked then my responses would be similar.

As r3dh3d said he can't align himself as ultra right and anti-women.

BouncingTurtle Sun 17-Aug-08 14:31:27

'In one region, the South West, 117 babies with club feet, cleft palates, or webbed or extra fingers and toes were aborted between 2002 and 2005.

Across the country, more than 400 pregnancies a year are terminated because of Down's syndrome.'

I find these statistic horrifying. Club feet, cleft palates and extra fingers and toes are easily correctable. And many, many babies with Down's syndrome grow up to become happy and fulfilled adults, even the ones with serious heart defects often have an excellent chance with modern surgical techniques.

I wouldn't say that I'm anti abortion - but I cannot agree with abortion in the circumstances above.

sarah293 Sun 17-Aug-08 14:34:46

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Graciefer Sun 17-Aug-08 14:40:45

Those statistics are horrid and really hit home with me as I live in the South West and DS2 who has Downs Syndrome was also born with bi-lateral talipes (club feet).

He is one years old next month and after having the Ponseti treatment, you would not know there was ever anything wrong with his feet.

He is a beautiful and very happy young chap and the light of our lives, it is sad to think that according to those statistics he could not of been here at all, iyswim.

jimjamshaslefttheyurt Sun 17-Aug-08 16:28:55

I wonder whether there was something else as well- I can't see why anyone would terminate for extra fingers and I can't imagine a doctor agreeing to it post 24 weeks.

I do think that the 24 week limit should apply to all except those who have conditions incompatible with life. Personally. But it would be political suicide for anyone or any party to suggest it with current views towards disability. People need to be challenged as to why for example DS so bad that it would be OK to terminate a 36 week old foetus because of it?

I would imagine if you posted that question on the main boards there would be uproar. It's not the sort of thing that it's acceptable to ask or suggest at the moment. And that's why politicians of whatever party cannot yet even suggest it.

anonandlikeit Sun 17-Aug-08 17:45:04

Whilst I think his choice of words are very poor, I do agree with a choice for parents when faced with the knowledge that their baby will be born with a very severe/life limiting condition.
I think the rules must be tightened so abortion is only used in the most extreme of circumstances & not for the minor conditions quoted.
personally I don't think I could opt for abortion, but I do believe that in some circumstances that choice should be available to parents.

2shoes Sun 17-Aug-08 18:14:59

severe/life limiting condition is differnt to a degree, but most dc's born with a sn will not have a life threatning condition.
when I go to dd's school most of the young people theres disability was caused at birth(as was his sons I reckon) so you can't predict that.
choice is ok, but killing a baby that could survive is not imo.

Icanseethesea Sun 17-Aug-08 18:40:45

I find it completely sickening that abortions are taking place for completely correctable conditions, ie. cleft palate, extra digits, etc. My godson had an extra thumb, which was removed very easily with a local anesthetic. He is a delightful, happy little boy. To think his chance of life could have been taken away because he wasn't 'perfect' is horrendous.

anonandlikeit Sun 17-Aug-08 19:02:03

I totally agree 2shoes ds2's sn certainly would not be picked up by a scan, most of ds2 friends with sn are as a result of either brain injury at birth or genetic conditions.

My friend made the heartbreaking decision to terminate a pregnancy after the 20 week scan detected multiple organ abnormalities (heart, kidneys, brain plus others). It took several weeks of appnts with cardiac & neuro teams from GOSH. The prognosis was poor & even if the baby was delivered alive multiple surgeries would be needed & even then the heart condition was not totally correctable, they were given the news that the baby would be unlikely ever to leave hospital.
For them although a very difficult decision they feel it was the correct one & they were grateful that they were allowed to make that choice.

MannyMoeAndJack Sun 17-Aug-08 21:34:58

I am pro-choice. However, I do think that the upper limit to very late abortions should be reduced - 39 weeks is too late IMO. Nearly all women have 20 week scans and many have even earlier scans/tests so I don't understand why it would take until the end of a pregnancy for a severe disability to be detected.

Romy7 Mon 18-Aug-08 15:32:42

I am pro-choice.

I also don't think that pic is a publicity shot - it is very old and looks like the meeja have dug around in the archive until they have found the only pic of him and his son they could get hold of - looks like something he's probably got on his living room wall,or e-mailed round his friends a few years back, rather than a publicity pic. he doesn't do publicity shots with the 'poor little disabled kid' or generally refer, for obvious reasons.
actually - i think this has all been a storm in a teacup - he was asked a question off the cuff and panicked because he didn't know what the 'right' answer was - he wasn't making a prediction on tory government policy.
he was merely (in a fairly bumbly way, i'll grant) trying to explain that actually, he probably is in a posisiton to judge what families of very disabled children go through (note - he wasn't talking about extra toes - he was talking about severely life limiting conditions) and wanted to explain that he was pro parental choice. i think it looks like he was so embarassed about having to drag up his son that he got himself in a fluster.
not a great way to prove your unflappability, but not exactly a hanging offence. i'll be waiting for some policy decisions before i get the big stick out to beat him with.

mm22bys Mon 18-Aug-08 16:31:00

I am pro-choice too, and I think the wrong message was given in that maybe so many parents want not to have a non-NT child because they are scared how they will cope, scared about help, scared about what it means for themselves and the rest of their families long term.

If he could somehow swung it round to "promise" more money to help sn children and their families, maybe we'd not be having this discussion.

I don't mind him, he does know what it's like, but he only went one direction with his response.

sarah293 Mon 18-Aug-08 16:48:01

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2shoes Mon 18-Aug-08 17:02:24

riven good point. I doubt if he has to worry about what will happen to his son whne he goes into adult services.

mm22bys Mon 18-Aug-08 17:05:00

They may have no financial pressures, but I don't believe they don't know what it's like in other respects...

2shoes Mon 18-Aug-08 17:08:22

but if you take away the finacial pressures most of the rest will go to. I know that if I didn't have to worry about the future, had carers to help and a bigger house. dd;s cp would be a lot more manageble.

MannyMoeAndJack Mon 18-Aug-08 17:18:51

Maybe, just maybe, DC realises that he is in a uniquely privileged position in that although he is the parent to a severely disabled child, he is still able to go on holiday, have a high-level career, have nannies, sleep at night, etc, etc, but that he knows that just about every other family is nowhere near as fortunate which is why he would like to keep the pro-choice option open?

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