ASD kid in threat of exclusion during new school trnasition- how do I persuade school to give him a chance?

[Peachy]

DS1 9as many will know) has just transferred to Juniors- and woh! like a shot has fallen through every gap going. His home school loink book reads like a nightmare, but we KNOW that as it is a transtion period, thinsg will improve- school don't seem inclined to give him a chance. Any ideas?

[Niecie]

Have you had any face to face discussions with anybody about it? Are they not prepared to try anything?

Do you have any ideas about what will make it easier for him?

Sorry lots of questions but no answers. Just wondered what you had tried so I don't say anything too obvious.

[Peachy]

We went in on our request as DS1 complained he was being bullied (he is, but as he responds with losing his temper he gets the blame- I think it's right that he is punished, but also think that the group of kids that taunt a Sn kid every break, and do so forcibly, should be dealt with). A list of things to help was drawn up and they were really positive- and nothing has been put in place, except that the Head watched him all day (presumable gathering evidence? don't know). A lot of the things that he's in trouble for- eg, not wearing a tie- happened because the item of uniform was lost in school, and we wanted to see if ti turned up before it was replaced 9we said we'd repalce after a week, suppliers is a 40 minute drive away so not unreasonable imo).

I dor ecognise he's being very ppunchy atm, but don't feel theya re giving him a chance- the time out system ahsn't been put in palce, theya re actively putting him in a pair with a particulalrly touchy feely kid (who ahs ADHD so can't help himself any better than ds1) when it is know they always implode (DS1 is one of thsoe children for whom bodily contact hurts).

Apar6t from when we went in, DH ahd a very unhelpful call yesterday that DS1 had been at it again from the school secretary (who knew no deatils and couldnt put us through to anyone), and I was descended upon by the teacher when i arrived this morning who had a checklist of things I should remember - NONE of which I ahev ever forgotten (!)- it just seems to be a total closeout tbh.

[Niecie]

That sounds really hard on him. Sounds like they have plans to deal with a child who has x,y, and z wrong but the reality of the child and his own personality and specific behaviours has them flummoxed.

The bullying has to stop especially as your DS can't cope and fights back. Rather than blaming him for fighting back, could the school not give him some private space for time-out where he could be alone for 5 minutes. It makes you totally sick, doesn't it, when you know your child was simply protecting themselves and the school say they are equally to blame. Happened to my DS a couple of times. I actually saw one event as we live next door to the infants school and I saw the child holding DS by the shoulders trying repeatedly to kick him. DS was trying to get away and struggling but according to the school he was equally to blame. .

I am not sure about pairing him up with another child with sn either. Does he need to be paired with anybody at the moment, until he has settled in?

Only a suggestion but what about drawing up a list of things that DS does or needs to give to the teacher. I am sure you have talked to her but now she has had the chance to get to know him maybe it would help to make a list of his particular behaviours, their triggers and the ways you have of dealing with them so that she has strategies to try. A long time ago I saw something like this on a website but I have no idea where now. I will try and have a look later - it might have been the NAS website. It's all very well them giving you lists of things they are going to do for him but if they don't understand your DS it isn't much use.

Does he have any one-to-one time with anybody? Is he getting any therapy?

As for the tie thing - that is petty. Don't they have a spare they can lend him? Surely they know, if he is anything like my ds, that he has trouble organising himself and keeping his things under control and he is going to need some help in the beginning. They should cut some slack.

Sorry I can't offer any real suggestions only sympathy. I think you need to go to the school and talk to them and make sure they know what they need to do. Talk to the head teacher too and find out what she observed - maybe she can help the teacher deal with him in a more constructive way.

[Niecie]

Sorry that was a bit long - I just wish I could help. I just feel very blessed that my son is OK at the moment.

[Peachy]

he has 10 hours 1-1, but its all reading absed atm as he is so far behind.

They ahve the list of what to do- even helped us compile it, and on that list is a time ut sapce (supposedly the library), just that it ahsn't been activated yet.

[Niecie]

I think you need to go and throw your weight around a bit. Turn it on its head and say that they are letting your son down rather than letting them say he is causing them trouble.

I can say that of course here is cyberspace but not so easy in RL I know.

[totaleclipse]

Have a word with the school, tell them what you want slip in the word discrimination once or twice, then say jump, they will soon ask how high.

[coppertop]

They're thinking of excluding him already?

I would put a request in writing to ask what has actually been done wrt the bullying. The thought of having to write the words "b*gger all" (or the polite equivalent) might be enough to get them to take action.

[TotalChaos]

has school got a written bullying policy? or any other written policies they are infringeing re:SN/inclusion etc?

[Peachy]

They have a bully policy but after detailed research, they've onloy allowed one ASD child to remain beofre (our CM's)- most seem to get pushed out quite quickly. However, its ahrd to understand exactly what happened in these cases as the aprents tended to be V V angry at the way their children were treated- not exactly impartial.

Wrote a long essay in his link book today, stating I understaood the violence couldn't be tolerated and that we were working on that at home as well (pasta jar!), but that i was unhappy they were blindly accepting the word of one aprticular child who was well known for lying about DS1 at Infant school, to the point the SENCO refused to listen to anything he said- I ahve also witnessed the goading amny times myself. S1 said this child had punched and kicked him several times in the isolation of the toilets before he retaliated- now its possible surely that was self defence?

Also said that bullying isn't just hitting- and that allowing ASD children to be systematically goaded into retalliation and then punishing the ASD child because he is not as able to communicate what happened as the other children (who just say not me guv) was bullying and unacceptable. Dh and I expecting a summons in over this at any point....

Did suggest some strategies: gave the the NAS website details, suggested that although DS1 can't have 1-1 at lunchtime on hsi curent hours he could easily be given a notebooka nd epncils and allowed to find a quiet playground cornbetr, as this is a self help strategy he himself instiagtes often- he makes lists and then goes over them to try and understand what is going on.

When i left him today i was crying becuase it felt as if I was feeding him to the lions- it's a struggle to get him there on time as he is unhappy anyway. DH is miffed as wella s school said they'd replace his tie for £2.50, we sent ds1 into reception alone (so we could watch him talk to the Head unobserved) and the Head took the £5 note, ahnded over a tie and then wandered off- no change, no communication!

[Niecie]

Peachy - I know it would be a huge upheaval to move but does he have to go to this school? I am sure that you have researched it when you applied but this can't go on. The school seem disinterested to the point of negligence.

[flyingmum]

How horrible for you both. The school do sound as if they just want him out because to deal with the situation is going to take time and effort.

If they can't cope then they should be applying to the LEA for more support. If the LEA think that a special school might be involved then they will do ANYTHING rather than pay for that.

It never ceases to amaze me how crap some junior schools are with SEN kids. They should deal with some of the ones we have in secondary - the ones with diagnosis or specific difficulties are a doddle compared to the ones who have 'acquired SEN' because at least you sort of know (even though they are all different) what you are dealing with. Putting him with the kid with ADHD is not good for either of them - one presumably winds the other up.

If it is any consolation (which it probablly isn't) my chap also had a very rocky time in year 3 and was taught to swear by some particularly nasty year 5 kids who thought it was funny. The difference seems that we had very good continuity between infants and juniors, the SENCO at the time had her own SEN son so knew what was what, and the school supported us (even though the teacher was a bit crap). Things did improve but there was many a day when I considered home ed. It is early days yet in education terms - many children will be having transition wobbles still and as a teacher you are still getting to know what works and what doesn't with certain kids. I think you are taking the right stance with being pro-active. The tie thing was petty though - I would be seriously pissed off with no change, etc.

[Peachy]

Thanks for the support- appreciated!

Today was a bit better, he asked for timeout (first time he was given the chance- told them he could do it!), although he did get into two scrapes (and has been told off). the ADHD kid was waiting to jump out on Dh and I with a 'mr and Mrs peachy DS1 did this and this and this'- Dh actually found ti really ahrd to keep his temper, actually, told him he was naughty for telling tales which was a bit eeek but I amnaged to stick to my routine 'tell the teacher' I always use when we get this.
I note the school ahsn't ;isted any of the incidents this kid listed in the book.


Niecie, we have a year left ehre because of Uni, and we've just signed the lease extension- Dh is desperate to go back to Somerset then though, so we shall see, its certainly a possibility!

[Blandmum]

Would it be possible for you ds to have some for of 'Sanctuary' for the play time, lunch time slots? It sounds as if most of the goading etc is happeneing during unstructured times (which are often hard for children with ASD in my experience)

I realise that he shouldn't be secluded, as he is the one being bullied, however, if he had a safe placve to go, say the library, it might take him out of the flashpoint zones.

He might not need this sort of thing for long, but it could help to tide him over, until he finds his feet in the new system

[Blandmum]

oh and an 'exit' card to get him time out when he is getting overloaded in lessons?

Just the chance to go outside the classroom to chill out a bit....this works well with some children with ASD in out secondary school. Again, taking him away from a flashpoint situation

[Peachy]

It is uunstructured times yes MB, actually they rate his beahviour v well during structured time ( I amde a clear note that as result they should be aware that he clearly is not intending to behave badly!). There's some ibrary access available now as time out but that depends on the Librarian- not really her job, looking to get something more permanent set up, but the play space is tiny, really tiny- a yard you could walk around in 4 minutes for 300 plus kids.

[alison222]

Peachy I have no great suggestions but have been reading this with interest as we are having transition troubles with DS and he is only moving Yr 1 to Yr2.
Again it is unstructured time casing the problems.

I have been asking DS if he can't take in playing cards or other small item to play in the playground to avoid the same sort of problems.

I suspect I will be having another chat with the teacher next week and possibly the SENCO again on the same topic - so if anything useful comes from that I will post again.

Sorry not to be of any help - just sending cyber sympathy your way