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DD told by teacher to 'get over it' ....

(55 Posts)
frazzledbutcalm Thu 21-May-15 13:20:57

Briefly, dd (asd) has to play what shall we do with the drunken sailor on a keyboard in front of the whole class ... all the class have to do this. I emailed senco and wrote music teacher a note detailing how this is traumatising for dd, how much worry and stress it has caused. Music teacher saw dd and talked at to her about her anxiety then told her she has to get over it, gave her a stern talking to and said she must go to her with any problems and she will be expected to perform all other pieces in front of the whole class as it's not fair on the others if dd is the only one who doesn't perform.

We're furious at the teachers comments .. dd masks her autism and I strongly believe the teacher would not have spoken to her in this way if her autism was easy to see. I have a meeting with the senco tomorrow to discuss this and other issues.

<<quietly fumes>>

PolterGoose Thu 21-May-15 14:02:27

I shall fume on your and her behalf alongside you angry

Being more practical, my ds has an exit pass which I encourage him to use in such situations, it's a good way to provide an 'escape route', he also has a mentor LSA who is a good advocate for him and deals with this sort of issue.

frazzledbutcalm Thu 21-May-15 14:10:32

Thanks polter

I wasn't sure if I was being over sensitive. But I really don't think I am. You've confirmed I'm not. wink

Dd doesn't have an LSA yet ... I'm back to senco tomorrow to chase things up. She has promised x, y and z but none are happening as staff aren't following through on her instructions. It dawned on me the other day that I'm telling dd that me and senco are putting things in place to help dd but actually from dd eyes NOTHING is changing ... dd must be so confused and disheartened. sad

We're in the process of band 3 of help ... next step is EHCP if this doesn't work. I know it won't work but I'm not entirely sure how an EHCP will help either.

Our household is now just a constant misery ground sad
I don't want it like this any longer. I'm just not sure how to change it because it's all related to school issues. sad

LoupDeLou79 Thu 21-May-15 14:58:29

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

PolterGoose Thu 21-May-15 15:00:37

Ds doesn't really 'have an LSA', but has a 20-30 minute 1-1 session with the most perfect LSA first thing every Monday, which also means he misses an assembly so it kills 2 birds with one stone wink He's also got 'special permission' to turn up in the SEN block any time, only 3 kids in the school have this. That helps, and costs nothing but a bit of trust.

I accept it's hard for all teachers to know all children's needs, and I think it's worse for more peripheral lessons where the kids have maybe an hour but the teacher teaches a lot more of the pupils so has more to get to know, eg ds's school is quite small so the music teacher takes every music class for every year group. Luckily ds has been put in a teaching group with a girl with Down's so for non-setted lessons there's always at least one LSA in a lesson, plus he's quite vocal and will assertively say 'you do know I've got Aspergers don't you? hmm'

AliceDoesntLiveHereAnymore Thu 21-May-15 15:26:00

Polter Okay. I want ds1 to get his diagnosis simply so he can say this to clarify sometimes (as I get tired of saying it). 'you do know I've got Aspergers don't you?' grin

youarekiddingme Thu 21-May-15 15:53:16

Your totally not over reacting.

What benefit to her life (or other students having to do the same in that fact) does this public keyboard playing have? It sounds to me like another case of "we always do this, this is how we deliver this nit of the curriculum/ tick this box". One of those exercises that causes unnecessary stress in the first place.

Then added on to the fact you emailed and so the school should have got back to you.

DS also has exit if needed and sees ELSA when he needs a session to help him regulate. He starts secondary in September and they have already discussed exit pass and how he is one of a few 'vulnerable' students who have access at all times to a room where only these students are allowed. These things can make all the difference when they are anxious as its the chance to go somewhere and calm when they can't just suck it up hmm

Ineedmorepatience Thu 21-May-15 16:13:00

Yes you are thats exactly how it read to me too.

Dd3 deals with similar everyday frazzled its awful and soul destroying isnt it sad

I am done with it to be honest!

ouryve Thu 21-May-15 17:01:16

Not over-sensitive. Music teacher sounds like an utter twat.

frazzledbutcalm Thu 21-May-15 20:11:16

Thanks everyone. Dd had an English test a few months ago and it was to talk about something in front of the whole class. This stressed dd so much that she developed another bout of 'globus hystericus' ... the gland in her throat gives the sensation of something being stuck there - there's actually nothing physically there but stress brings it on to such a degree that dd can't swallow, can't eat, and can point to exactly where the 'lump' is. It's such a horrendous condition. It's flared up twice now. As a result of this, the senco arranged for dd to do the English speaking test in front of the English teacher only. Lump went away fairly quickly once dd knew this.

Anxiety is a horrible horrible thing.

Youare .. the senco emailed back to say she'd passes the message on to the music teacher, but as happens so often, teachers don't understand autism the way senco's do.

I truly don't understand why schools fail our adorable, different, vulnerable children the way they do. sad

polter .... I'd LOVE it if dd could say that!!! But she can't. She doesn't even speak up when she's supposed to.

Ineedmorepatience Thu 21-May-15 22:05:08

No frazzled Dd3 wouldnt be able to say that either sad in fact she was recently able to write that when she is stressed and wants to talk the words get stuck in her mouth and cant come out! sad

frazzledbutcalm Mon 25-May-15 16:25:17

Well I've had a meeting with the senco ... she was absolutely appalled at teachers comments, she said I should write a letter to the Head. She said all staff that teach dd are fully aware of her needs, she has an IEP(?) which is reviewed every 6 weeks with staff. All our meetings/discussions are emailed to staff. So the music teacher should never have said those words to dd. She was appalled at the ramifications for dd.

On a separate note, senco told me in confidence that she is leaving and won't be here for the new school year in September. She felt she had to tell me as she knew I was only keeping dd there because of her. We think dd now may be having panic attacks as a result of school. Senco recommends we look for a different school as this one is great, but doesn't seem to be suiting dd. I've rang LA who have said dd won't get into a special school, or a mainstream with autism unit attached without a statement. Dd doesn't have a statement yet as we're only currently trying for tier 3 of top up funding help. If tier 3 help doesn't work, then we apply for an EHCP.

I don't know where to go from here. Dd can go to a middle school here where a couple of her previous school friends attend so at least she'll know someone. The school is a lot smaller than her current school. I think this would be ok but I don't know if I should be looking at a school with a proper autism unit.

Any ideas/advice?

PolterGoose Mon 25-May-15 16:38:16

How about moving her to the middle school while you apply for an EHCP?

Ds's wonderful secondary is small and for him it makes a massive difference I think.

frazzledbutcalm Mon 25-May-15 16:52:31

I thought that too polter ... dd doesn't want to move, but then she'd say that no matter where she was. I'm going to ring the middle school after the holidays and see if I can visit and speak to the senco. I'm not sure what questions I should be asking - I figured I'd just tell them how dd is and ask what they can do to help support her. At the moment her school days are 8.25 til 3.45 and she gets 3 pieces of homework each day! The middle school would be 9 til 3.30 and probably 3 pieces of homework each week. I'm worried we change her and she doesn't settle. Her existing school is very strict and rigid (which suits dd very well), the middle school isn't so structured. Existing school is VERY big, middle school not. Because she has social problems, her existing school is probably a bit better for her as the pupils have to sit alone at a desk and face the front. Middle school is 4-6 children sitting round a group table. But the pressure of work at her existing school is massive.

Senco and LA says we can't apply for an EHCP until school has been allocated the tier 3 top up funding. If this funding doesn't help dd then we can apply for an EHCP.

PolterGoose Mon 25-May-15 16:55:51

The senco is giving you advice which is inaccurate, you have the right to apply at any time. LAs aren't allowed legally to have policies that state otherwise.

Current school sounds very high pressure shock

frazzledbutcalm Mon 25-May-15 17:05:27

Senco and LA both said the same polter ... you have to go through 3 tiers of extra funding to help support the additional needs. If after tier 3 the child is still not doing well/coping etc then you apply for EHCP. I don't know anything about these, but, from reading on here and everyone having so many problems getting them, I wonder if it's partly because the tier process hasn't been gone through ifswim?

Current school is VERY high pressure ... dd is extremely academic and copes well with the learning - and her general knowledge is massive because of how they teach. BUT I don't agree with all the homework and the long days. That's the pressure that's causing dd anxiety/panic etc.

Ineedmorepatience Mon 25-May-15 18:06:12

The LA are not following the law frazzled that is not unusual but the legal test for a child being assessed for an EHCP is that the child "May have special educational needa which may require special educational provision to be made" or words to that effect.

Many LA's try to apply their own criteria for this kind of things and they will tell you about their "policy"! The law always trumps their policy!

If you put in a parental request and it is refused you can appeal!

Take a look at the IPSEA website if you need more info!

pannetone Mon 25-May-15 18:15:42

polter is right - you can apply for an EHCP at any time. My DS (HFA, anxiety, Y8) didn't manage the transition to his very large secondary in Y7 - he was too anxious to attend after the first term. He had no top up funding but we applied for a statement last May and he got it in December. The criteria for the ECHP are no different from those that applied to statements.

I agree with looking at the middle school for DD - TBH it doesn't sound even if your DD got the highest tier of top up funding available, it wouldn't necessarily help her in that school. Our LA made a feeble suggestion that DS could be supported in a state mainstream with top up funding but all the reports pointed to DS needing small classes in a smaller school. They agreed to name a mainstream indie on his statement - DS needs mainstream as he is very academic and this indie has the small classes he needs - about 15 in a class - and only 160 in the whole school (secondary with sixth form.)

frazzledbutcalm Mon 25-May-15 22:27:21

Thanks Ineed (and your post on other thread) and panne ...
You're right panne, I think dd will not settle even with the extra help top up funding will bring. She's also very academic so I think mainstream would be best. Although I don't really know anything about all of this! What is a mainstream indie? Also, what exactly is in an EHCP?

senvet Tue 26-May-15 00:07:53

OK - EHCP is a Statement of Special Needs but with a new name for the new law brought in recently.

Sets out all (theoretically) difficulties that dcs have under education, health and medical headings, and also the provision - education, social services and medical.

Look at IPSEA website. The main thing is to be sure that everything that is relates to dcs learning is in the education sections. eg most dcs learn to walk without extra help at school, but dcs with a high level of dyspraxia may well need extra help to learn to walk fluently, and so it is educational not medical.

Only the educational sections are enforceable via Tribunal so it is well worth staying on top of this.

Mainstream= anything nit designated as a special school. Mainstream could be a local authority school, an academy, or a private school (private school=indie)

Special School has to be designated as such, and can be private/indie eg the NAS schools, or can be maintained by a local authority or academy.

Hope this helps

AttilaTheMeerkat Tue 26-May-15 07:47:32

"Senco and LA says we can't apply for an EHCP until school has been allocated the tier 3 top up funding. If this funding doesn't help dd then we can apply for an EHCP"

No, no and no. These people are giving you duff information and in the meantime your DD is still being failed by these people who are supposed to be helping her!. Her current school also sounds v pressurised as well.

www.ipsea.org.uk is the website you also need to look at as it is a mine of information, knowledge is power!!!.

frazzledbutcalm Tue 26-May-15 10:00:46

Thanks sen and atilla ...
So is indie a private school that charges fees? The school dd currently attends is a private academy but doesn't charge fees. It is privately funded/managed, is NOT governed by local authority. Would this class it as still just mainstream? (just so I can get my head around school terms in general!) What's NAS schools?

Senco (who really is lovely) said if we apply for an EHCP now it would be rejected as we haven't yet gone through tier 3 top up. LA also said the same thing - LA's words :- we have to go through tier 3 top up 'for a while' and see if that helps dd. If not, then we can apply for EHCP .. If we apply before tier 3 it will automatically be rejected because you have to try all 3 tier top up funding first. EHCP will take 20 weeks, it's pointless applying now as there's 6 weeks summer holidays, 1 week may holidays so there's 7 weeks lost there.
I replied that in the meantime all this is happening, my dd mental health state is dwindling rapidly. She just kept saying that we have to go to tier 3 first.

This all made me wonder if that's why so many are having trouble with EHCP's ... is it because they're applied for too early or does LA just not want to issue them no matter when they're applied for?

frazzledbutcalm Tue 26-May-15 10:06:46

Oh and I'll have a good read through the ipsea website, thank you. I've considered home schooling, possibly using inter high .. is it possible to get LA to fund this?

pannetone Tue 26-May-15 10:46:15

I'm back but I see senvet and attila have stepped in with good info in the meantime.

I'm afraid the SENCO and LA are spouting nonsense - it may be how they want/think the system should work, but it is not the law. Many applications for statements and now EHCPs get rejected because it is a fantastic delaying tactic for the LA, and, (even better for them) some parents may give up at that hurdle. If you made an application for an EHCP and it was refused, you could appeal to the tribunal who would give short shrift to the LA's unlawful criteria that a child needs 'Tier 3 top up funding' before an application can be made.

So see an 'automatic rejection' of your application as a way to actually get past your LA's unlawful policy, and get the decision from a tribunal who will apply the law. (Though in practice many LAs change their decision not to assess once you take out a tribunal case and they actually have to defend their refusal.)

The LA get 6 weeks to decide on your request for your DC to be assessed for an EHCP so if you did it now (!) there are still 6 weeks til schools break up for summer. I think it is only the long summer break which doesn't 'count' in meeting the 6 week deadline.

Yes, an indie is a private school that charges fees. It sounds as though your DD is in an academy, so not LA controlled but still state funded. Yes, that would class it as 'mainstream', in that it is not a 'special' school specifically for children with SEN. A NAS school is a National Autistic Society school and they are fee paying special schools.

Ds was out of school because of anxiety after his first term of Y7 and at the start of his Y8 (last sep) he started at Interhigh. It worked fairly well for him at that point but he really needs a wider curriculum than it can provide and although he can find it challenging, he also needs the social and academic stimulus of a 'brick' school. Some LAs will fund Interhigh ( as part of an EHCP) and some LAs have their own online learning 'platform' for DC who can't attend 'brick' school. Our LA wouldn't fund Interhigh, but by this time DS wanted to look at going to 'brick' school again.

Schrodingersmum Tue 26-May-15 11:40:36

Would agree with all the other posters, went straight from nothing to EHC after failed transition from primary for DD who is being assessed for ASD. Even without EHC In place our LA is funding Interhigh and selfharming anxious DD is finally thriving and stimulated even as a multi exceptional

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