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Child's views - help - letter received from LA this morning

(40 Posts)
bjkmummy Mon 03-Mar-14 11:37:07

They phoned me a few weeks ago re the views and I wrote and asked them to send me the paperwork so she could do them over half term. Heard nothing, 2 weeks came and went so got her to do the,, then got a letter last Monday saying school was approached and happy to take her views. Anyway got my daughter to d them ourselves and views handed over at the meeting last week, they are quite powerful in what she wrote.

Got a letter now saying the following - thank you for the completed pupil view pack which you sent to e authority on the 26 February 2014. ThenLA did contact you and also write to you stating that the school would collect the views on our behalf for the send tribunal. The authority still request that this is done and seek your permission for this at the beginning of next week.

Now I know that the class teacher will be called as a witness for the LA! Also my daughter won't be honest with her teacher as she won't want to upset her! Can I tell the LA to poke off! I don't know why they want accept my daughters handwritten views - could it be because she has hand wrote them and they can barely read them! Call me a cynic. Why do they need the school to do it and like I said the school will be giving evidence that she's fine etc! I need to respond ASAP.

wasuup3000 Mon 03-Mar-14 11:44:27

Just refuse permission as they already have her views now. The LA EP sent in after a reusal to assess by the LEA because the school needed more support took my son's views/feelings and said he liked lunchtimes the best and chocoalte and crisps....YUP that's helpful for the tribunal!! (not)

lougle Mon 03-Mar-14 11:52:20

Hmm...I'm not sure. Never been to tribunal, but wouldn't a radically different account to a teacher strengthen your case that they're not meeting needs because she can't even express them accurately in the school environment?

wasuup3000 Mon 03-Mar-14 11:56:43

Lougle has a point as well - might be like my son and say something random and not very useful.

bjkmummy Mon 03-Mar-14 12:07:23

No my daughter would be very compliant - she would never want to say anything that would upset her teacher so her views would be everything is rosy and dandy.

I've just spoken to ipsea, they've told me to submit her views that I have now - which I will do and also to write to the LA stating her views have already been given, and that as we are aware that the LA have asked the school to attend as a witness to the tribunal then there is a conflict of interests. Any further views need to be done by someone independent. The LA should also state why they are not accepting the views the child has written herself.

bjkmummy Mon 03-Mar-14 12:08:12

Sorry lougle, just re read what you wrote, brain freeze here and I see what you are saying now.

I think it safe to say they are fighting this!

AgnesDiPesto Mon 03-Mar-14 12:09:25

I would let them do them. If they differ for yours the question will be why. That's for tribunal to decide. You need to add yours to your bundle as it doesn't sound like LA want to. The duty is on the LA to get the views so it may just be them showing they have done this, or it may be because the school will be pressured to ask leading questions. I would let them do it, see what comes out of it and then deal with that. You can presumably ask to be present when they do it, given the pressure on her to improve on her last piece of work for sen officer you would be justified in asking to be there to make sure similar pressure to write the right thing isn't put on her.

AgnesDiPesto Mon 03-Mar-14 12:10:20

Oops cross posted. I can see the point of someone indep. But who? SLT Etc are not really indep.

bjkmummy Mon 03-Mar-14 12:14:56

if you remember last time they got some counselling service to do it who dealt with children who were abused and they point blank refused to let us as parents in and in the my friend was allowed to go and support our son. that was madness as he had extreme anxiety!!! I don't know what to do for the best - just seems a lot of stress for her views and feels very wrong that the very person who they will call to give evidence against us gets to take her views

AgnesDiPesto Mon 03-Mar-14 12:39:50

Well do what IPSEA says and see what response is first. They may back down.

bjkmummy Mon 03-Mar-14 12:46:52

I have done - emailed them and said her views already been done and its her views - have said if the LA want them taking again then has to be someone independent and a parent to be there . I copied in the tribunal as well - next job is to now serve her views on the tribunal and the LA officially so if they do go and try and get an order the views will be there already for the judge to see and read. like I said last time the tribunal ruled it had to be someone independent. the LA don't want her written views anywhere need the tribunal but how they expect them not getting before the tribunal I don't know - my concern is that the school try and take her views today before I've had chance to reply but I think that would be stupid of the LA to do that

StarlightMcKingsThree Mon 03-Mar-14 13:36:20

Get your daughter to write to the class teacher telling her that she has already submitter her views and is getting anxious about being asked to do it again.

Either her views are valid or they're not. If they're not, there is no point doing it at all. If they are, they should respect that she has given them and added that she does not want to repeat the traumatic event.

StarlightMcKingsThree Mon 03-Mar-14 13:37:46

Having said all of that, I can't see that school getting her views will actually make much of a difference to your case, except used as an attempt to intimidate.

bjkmummy Mon 03-Mar-14 13:44:12

that's it star isn't it - its to intimidate and also how the LA letter has been written makes it sound like the LA had lots of contact with me - they phoned me and then remember I posted on here about it - I then emailed them that night and asked them to send the paperwork through as it was half term the following week - that email was never answered and ignored for 2 weeks until the sen officer boss turned up at the door last week with the paperwork and a letter about the meeting - at the bottom of the letter it said school happy to take her views but by then she had already done them - then handed them over at the meeting 2 days later to the sen officer. shes sat and brooded about it after the meeting and then wrote this letter today - they have just dillied and dallied - they never responded to my email so they never say no you cant do that and they never at that point said they were going to get school to do it - after 2 weeks of silence I assumed it was okay and at the end of the day she is 10 and half - what she has wrote is very powerful and that's the issue here - its not all happy happy happy which is what they wanted her to say and I can hand on heart say that I did not help her to write it - I explained what the question was and then left her to it. I had no idea what she was about to write

zzzzz Mon 03-Mar-14 13:56:07

"until the sen officer boss turned up at the door last week with the paperwork and a letter". shock

StarlightMcKingsThree Mon 03-Mar-14 13:58:12

You know you could write to the LA and ask them specifically what is wrong with the views already submitted as well as what benefit they feel it would give your dd to do them again?

You can use their own 'we only care about your child' stuff to make an assumption that in that context they will agree that they now have the views they seek.

The LA's responsibility iirc is to ensure that the child's views are sought, not to actually action it themselves. They can delegate this if it is in the best interest of the child to do so, and so you can call their bluff (and dare them to make implications about you) and ask them why what she has done isn't good enough for them.

DS' school sent me home a form and asked me to complete it with him away from school as they thought this would get the most honest views.

MariaNotChristmas Mon 03-Mar-14 14:06:45

You know you could write to the LA and ask them specifically what is wrong with the views already submitted as well as what benefit they feel it would give your dd to do them again? and cc the judge grin

It's what IPSEA said, but in a beautifully 'less-is-more', very subtly passive-aggressive, bemused-reasonableness-face way

MariaNotChristmas Mon 03-Mar-14 14:08:36

You know you could write to the LA with an attached copy of her views, naturally, in case they have somehow mislaid hmm them

bjkmummy Mon 03-Mar-14 14:26:21

Hmmm I've already sent an email but I suppose a follow up question as above wouldn't go amiss I guess because they haven't said what is wrong with the views

MariaNotChristmas Mon 03-Mar-14 14:38:04

Uber-polite, naturally.

Worth doing, as it gives the LA a chance to pretend to overlook or resolve some minor technical query, and then review their position back down without losing face

MariaNotChristmas Mon 03-Mar-14 14:40:32

You could offer them an audio recording and transcript of your daughter haltingly reading out her own dyslexically expressed powerful views

KeepOnKeepingOn1 Mon 03-Mar-14 14:40:59

I thought that the tribunal expected the LA to obtain the child's views. If that is the case, you will have to agree but could insist on someone independent. I just let the teachers take DS1's views whilst at school and the LA EP whilst out of school and submitted my own dictated version at each stage.

DS1 would not give any more accurate views to an 'independent' person but if I had kicked up a stink about it I might be open to the accusation that I had something to hide, was exaggerating or putting words in his mouth and might lead the panel/judge to believe that any views then given were the gospel when the they would be just as likely to be what DS1 thought the school/LA wanted to hear. The trouble is the question is always 'what does the school do to help you?' If DC pretend that everything is fine and give the 'correct' answer, the ordeal is over. Otherwise the child is asked what the school can do to help. Being asked a question he does not know the answer to, by a stranger, is DS1's idea of hell and he will say anything to make it stop.

MariaNotChristmas Mon 03-Mar-14 14:54:35

But the LA has obtained the child's views.
In a document which the child has independently written.

If the views said 'school is amazing, I'm not actually dyslexic and my mum is a manipulative witch', you wouldn't be having this problem.

If more is needed, then there should be a conversation at which you are present, which is recorded and transcribed verbatim.

So if it goes:
[favourite teacher] Dc, you are happy here, aren't you
[Dc] incoherent mumbling
[fav teach] Can you read the level 1 reception stories ok now?
[Dc] Oh yes, we've done them so often, I know them all by heart now
[fav teach] Do you want to stay in every lunchtime for extra literacy?
[Dc] Not really
[fav teach] Are we kind and helpful to you?
[Dc] Yes miss

it can't become "Dc is happy at school, feels she is making good progress, doesn't want additional assistance and finds staff kind and helpful" <voice of bitter experience>

bjkmummy Mon 03-Mar-14 16:41:51

okay - this is what she wrote = like I said this was totally independently written with no help from me - I think you will guess what the problem the LA are having when you read it:-

this was for where the question was - do you have any questions for the tribunal

why cant I have more help? do you want me to have no help? please can you help a child in need, can you do that? xxx sec school isn't helping me but im not in there yet. if you were like me and I was you and I said she or he is doing fine and that's not true you would be doing this now so im writing to say help a child in need

this next bit was for her to tell the tribunal anything else shed like them to know

you don't know that I am having trouble with my work. when my mum was trying to help for my brother * my brother was having a hard time to learn and grow to be a man.* my elder brother he has troube but * does have help. But what about me, will I be left out and struggle with my work? Mum doing this for me to have a good life before I move on. soon she will be gone. And I will find things on my own so like I said,, help a child in need. And don't waste your time saying no, just help me please.

Sometime when I have to read to the class when I don't want to my teacher reads it sometimes but my classmates just don't know how hard it is. They just don't understand what I have

she then goes on to draw a picture of her class and class mates basically showing them being mean to her because she wont read out aloud. her spelling is dreadful, writing awful and its very difficult to read - obviously ive just change all the misspellings so that its readable

lougle Mon 03-Mar-14 21:40:22

That is heartbreaking sad

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