Time outs not working with dd

[Blossomhill]

Camhs suggested time outs everytime dd lashes out, spits etc etc

Now we have been doing this for 6 weeks and I really do not think it's working. If anything dd just loses the plot completely and we have hell during and afterwards. I have told Camhs this and they say persevere but I honestly don't think it's working.

What do I do? Is there an alternative?

Just seems that no punishments work when dd goes into a huge meltdown.

Thanks

[Blossomhill]

Was going to say what we do is put her on the stairs for 6 minutes (1 for each yr of her life) and show her a timer.

[2shoes]

not being very up on meltdowns I would say it would make it worse/ dd has cp and if she is going ito one you cannot reason with her.
can you explain "meldown" to me as it comes up a lot/

[charliecat]

Can she be trained...for want of a better to word, to lose the plot in her room and come back when shes chilled out a bit?
Maybe take the timer with her?

[Jimjamskeepingoffvaxthreads]

What;s triggering the lashing out etc?

I used to do something similar with ds1 when he hurt (put outsude the room for 10 seconds) but it stopped working. We worked out that he was pinching for interaction- to get a certain predictable interaction, so the clinical psych suggested trying to shape that movement into something more appropriate- shaking hands, round and round the garden etc. It did have some limited success.

I think 6 minutes might be a bit long for a child with complex SN. 10 seconds for ds1 was enough- obviously your dd will manage more but I wouldn't apply the 1 min for every year of life to a child with SN.

[LizLocket]

Agree with everything Jimjams has said

We now use time out extremely rarely with my
four yr old (ASD) as we found it was counter productive, he didn't really understand the purpose of it and it was simply giving him negative attention and fuelling the problem. Interestingly when we did Ealrybird the presenters said exactly the same not to use time out as a punishment but if it's used to use it as a way of calming the child down. The ASD CAMHs consultant here even says not to shout at an autistic child as it again is counterproductive though I am finding that one harder on some days!

Finding a suitable alternative though can be difficult. Sometimes if DS is really hyped up we will sit with him in time out whilst he calms downs. 6 minutes seems a very long time too and the time should probably should be tailored more to her developmental age rather than chronological age. Like Jimjams we have had episodes of pinching or hiting but it is often DSs way of trying to get attention and not meaning to hurt and distracting him away into something else like a hug or handshake has worked. Just starting to use social stories for these situations too

Lx

[Blossomhill]

2shoes - well I may be wrong as dd has only just started having them but basically your child loses it and cannot be brought round.

charliecat - unfortunately that wouldn't be the case with dd. She couldn't come out of it on her own iyswim

jimjams - the lashing out is usually triggered when she is asked to do something she doesn't want to do (am seriously wondering if she has a touch of o.d.d. as well). She loses the plot and up until recently since being on the meds she stopped. Have rang Camhs today so hopefully someone will get back to me!

lizlocket - I am not thinking that the time outs don't work and we do need alternatives. Really do need to start on social stories but no real idea how to actually use them properly!

[heartinthecountry]

BH - I have no idea if this would be appropriate for your dd but I have just been reading a parenting book where the author (who works in child mental health) suggests using 'Time In' rather than Time Out ie. sitting with your child and talking about the bad behaviour. Or, if the child is really out of control and at risk of hurting themself or others she suggests 'Holding'. The idea being that the child can actually feel quite terrified by their own state of 'hyperarousal' so you 'use your body as a safe, calm blanket' until she calms down.

As I say, no idea if either of these is at all appropriate (and I think 'holding' is quite controversial as a technique) but thought I would mention them, not really as my own advice but as I've just read about it! I know for example that Time In just wouldn't work with my dd as she would have no concept of 'why' she does/feels things.

I have more info on either technique if you are interested.

[robin3]

Fliping (being polite) TIMEOUT and that Supernanny woman...my Mum reckons time out is the solution to everything. It's not meant to be a punishment it's meant to allow parent and child time to calm down when they loose control. Most of the parents on her show are way out of control not just the kids. If it doesn't serve to calm the situation then it's not worth doing.

Rant over.

[Blossomhill]

HITC - thanks. Not sure how that would work with dd tbh. She hates being held so may flip out even more but it's worth a try?

Robin3 - that's how I feel. Why use it if it makes the situation worse?

Still not heard from Camhs so may have to chase them up today. Although touch wood dd has been good this week.

[butty]

Hi BH,

SSorry things are flaring up again, chloe had a major meltdown this morning and i'm still fuming as she hid my car keys when i had to go to work and refused to give them back, all because i asked her to get her shoes on

Anyway, back to the topic, in the book i mentioned, it states that sometimes TO does not work and if it doesn't then it advises trying to remove their favourite personal belongings for a period of time, but first you have to sit down and explain to them what will happen and how they can earn their things back.

I am starting a plan of action for chloe which involves her dancing and TV, whether it works is yet to be seen.

Also, has been reccomended to me by the adhd woman to give chloe two choices when asking her to something and she refuses like "you can either do X which would be really good" or "you can't have/do Y if you won't"

It is working slightly which i suppose is better than nothing.

Take care for now, speak soon.

Butty.xxx