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Here are some suggested organisations that offer expert advice on special needs.

SN children

IEP targets

21 replies

inappropriatelyemployed · 04/02/2013 20:37

Can you have a target that a child 'enjoys' something? For example, participating in a group activity.

Seems a bit flaky to me

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Ineedmorepatience · 04/02/2013 20:52

How are they going to quantify "enjoys" IE

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LIZS · 04/02/2013 20:53

Not very SMART

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Ineedmorepatience · 04/02/2013 20:54

"Participates in" or "tolerates involvement in" would be better wording I would have thought.

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Grockle · 04/02/2013 21:08

I don't think that's a great target... I don't think you can teach someone enjoy something & it isn't measurable, is it? Our IEP targets have to be SMART (Specific, Measurable, Attainable, Realistic and Time-sensitive).

E.G

X will take turns with a peer when playing a predictable game on 60% of occasions presented.

And then explain HOW it will be done, broken down into small steps.

What is the target you are looking at?

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TICKLETUMBLE · 04/02/2013 21:19

DITTO all above...it has to be something that can be measured and shown to improve (or not) with the stated strategies designed to support the goal.

DS had 'will be happy to lose games' by making him play games and set them up so he loses lots,,,,,, um............no , and no........ changed to when asked to play games, will play by the rules and take turns ...and sometimes he does not win and that is OK. he has to do this half the time to be meeting target

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AgnesDiPesto · 04/02/2013 21:25

I can't remember but I think we have tolerate, motivating activities and highly motivating activities
or low, medium, high interest activities
And I think you can build interest in activities eg from low to high. we have done this by persevering with activities ds initially found hard but once he had been taught to do them (breaking them down) they came to be favourite activities.

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inappropriatelyemployed · 04/02/2013 21:40

Thanks. There are only two targets but they don't even cover the difficult and important stuff. One poorly duplicates what our SLT is intending to do long-term - 'enjoy group work'!

The other mixes mastering touch typing, increasing touch typing speed and generalising touch typing.

DS get feed back on the last IEP targets which basically said he didn't feel anyone listened to him or understood AS but we've just ignored that and set fresh targets!

I've spent an hour and half re-writing everything.

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moondog · 04/02/2013 21:41

We use a colour coded system for every activity to denote leel of engagement/interest. The goal is to get the reds (no engagement) to turn into oranges (medium engagement) and then greens (maximum engagement).
We cna only change the situation by a
a. counting how often some specific activity happens over a period of time
b. noting engagement.

That's a meaningless target without a record such as the above.
Who set it?

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inappropriatelyemployed · 04/02/2013 21:46

SENCO. Thanks Moondog. Very helpful idea.

I think schools just find these things really hard but I suppose, because we really care about the outcome, it is easier for us to be very specific about what we want to see happen.

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PolterGoose · 04/02/2013 21:56

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

inappropriatelyemployed · 04/02/2013 21:58

That is really helpful thanks. I have just suggested a similar type approach to at least getting DS's views on things.

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moondog · 04/02/2013 22:00

IE, anyone can point out what needs to be worked on.
That's the easy bit.
People are then given considerable amounts of money to address them and bring about improvements.
If they can't/don't, it needs to be asked what they are doing there in the first place.

I ruthlessly excise all people form my child's life who are unable to perform these basic duties.

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inappropriatelyemployed · 04/02/2013 22:33

I can't really expunge the SENCO! I have never met one who can set a decent target. At least, she usually listens to what I say.

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moondog · 04/02/2013 22:35

Listening is easy too.
Adopt sympathetic smile, nod occasionally (intersperse with puckering of brow in concerned and mildly patronising fashion) and jot down a few notes.

Voila!

Sorry-I am sure this is not helping.

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inappropriatelyemployed · 04/02/2013 22:38

To be fair, she'll change the targets not just note things down

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StarlightMcKenzie · 04/02/2013 23:22

Moondog

How does this colour code work? This is exactly the thing I need to talk to ds' school about. They are REALLY trying but are stabbing in the dark.

What I love about that system, is that already, without knowing a thing about it, I understand that it is for the person delivering the activity to 'get' the engagement from the child rather than the child being graded for making themselves engage!

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StarlightMcKenzie · 04/02/2013 23:23

4 schools and i have never seen a SMART target that I haven't written myself, and even then, they haven't been as SMART as I would like because of protests that 'measuring' takes away valuable teaching time from the child

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tryingtokeepintune · 05/02/2013 00:30

Moondog please can you add color code to the workshop later in the month.

Agnes please can you tell me what types of activities you worked on. I am trying to get ds engaged in some activities but he shows very little interest in most. Also, I have to say when I read, in another thread, how your tutor got children in to help your ds play eg. what is the time Mr Wolf etc. my heart broke as school could have done that with my ds - there were enough interested children and he was interested - but no, untrained TAs, CT more interested in using 1 to 1 to help her etc. Missed opportunities.

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moondog · 05/02/2013 07:27

Colourcoding is a big part of the training day.
It's an essential tool in our work that is so useful.
Staff, kids and parents love it.

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moondog · 05/02/2013 07:30

'protests that 'measuring' takes away valuable teaching time from the child'

Star, if I quoted that to any of the scores of teachers and LSAs I work with, they wouldn't believe it and would laugh. They wouldn't even countenance donig something that couldn't be measured.
Otherwise what is the bloody point?
It's the equivalent of spraying a room with gunfire in the hope of killing the ant hiding under a floorboard somewhere.

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inappropriatelyemployed · 05/02/2013 07:58

In my experience, it has been more like poor training and little support in setting concrete targets.

There is a complete failure to factor in the child too. DS is nearly 10 and capable of sharing his views.

We had an ABA intervention to support this type of thing but that was not very helpful and ended up being diverted to 'compliance' tasks like sitting on the floor. He is 10, they sit on the floor about once a week and wont do this in secondary. who cares? i suppose these obvious things that can be seen are easier to address even if they are of littel benefit.

No one seems really to know how to address the issues which affect him most.