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The Green Paper and the school's interpretation

(24 Posts)
Claw3 Fri 23-Sep-11 19:49:25

Ds came home from school with a standard 'dear parent' letter in his book bag, it reads:-

Following new Government guidance on SEN in the form of The Green Paper, X Borough have issued new guidance to help with the id of children with SENS and the support they should receive in school.

As a result of this guidance, there have been changes to the children who need to be listed on the SEN register. This has meant some new children now need to be placed on the register, some children need to be removed and some children need to be transferred onto a medical needs list.

Children may now be identified as needing Class ation
These children require arrangements to be made in class to enable them to learn more easily such as different approaches and strategies. These may be as a result of Assessment and recommendations by other agenceis. They are 2 or 3 NC sub levels behind expected levels for thier age and are likely to receive more targeted and focused work from the class teacher

School Action children who are following programmes which have been recommended by an outside agency as part of intervention groups within the school These children will be 3-5 sub levels below age expected levels in the Core Curiculum Areas

Ds is in year 2 and his sub level are 2's, the average for a year 2. Does this mean he will now receive no help?

Is this right?

coff33pot Fri 23-Sep-11 19:55:57

eh? confused

ok so are they saying that if you got a statement..........because your child is the expected NC level you no longer get the help and the kids get "struck off"???

Claw3 Fri 23-Sep-11 20:07:13

Oops sorry there was more on the back, i only read the front.

School action plus Children 5 or more sub levels below expected age.

statemented These children have a statement issued by LA and often have complex and considerable level of need.

School action plus and statemented children will have an IEP which is evaluated every term and will be discussed with you during parents evening.

StarlightMcKenzie Fri 23-Sep-11 20:08:05

Claw's ds doesn't have a statement.

The green paper is not the white paper. Statutory obligations still exist.

What you have written their is nothing but wooly waffle and means nothing to me.

Expected levels in what anyway? SOcial skills? Anxiety?

May I refer you to the AET document that the government commissioned (I think) stating that children with autism require an autism specific curriculum as academic levels are irrelevant.

Claw Please don't worry about this letter. What difference will it make to your ds' shoddy experience anyway. It doesn't make the mountain any bigger, or any different as the statutory process is exactly the same.

Claw3 Fri 23-Sep-11 20:20:04

Thats very true Star, it explains their comment in their letter to me "February's IEP was continued due to the changes in SEN categorisation"

Although they even f*** up on that too. According to this letter only children on Action + and statemented children get IEP's, so the fact that ds has an IEP would put him on Action + and his IEP should be evaluated termly, not 'continued' according to their calculations.

Apparently this guidance was issued in 2010, they have taken their time. I did all my requests for files a few days ago. Maybe ive set a cat amongst the pigeons.

coff33pot Fri 23-Sep-11 20:20:33

Ah I see............well no I dont actually with the letter apart from it seems to be even more paramount that parents apply for a statement to secure any help.....

Claw3 Fri 23-Sep-11 20:27:36

Coff33, letter seems to be also telling parents in a round about way, your child wont get a statement unless your child is more than 5 sub levels behind. There are lots of parents who dont know about the statementing process (i didnt and still wouldnt, had i not found MN)

coff33pot Fri 23-Sep-11 20:47:54

Yes Claw it does read that way to me too. So are they now only going to consider a statement by assessing how far the child is behind. A child could still have extreme anxiety issues or such and run off into meltdown but because he can still read and write at a good level that is ok??? I dont even know what level is what to be honest DS is P8 in terms of Literacy and 1b in terms of numeracy. He has a bad tripod grip and struggles to tears with writing...

coff33pot Fri 23-Sep-11 20:48:49

He has just started Y2 by the way. I am off to scout the NC levels on the net

StarlightMcKenzie Fri 23-Sep-11 20:49:54

yep. Blanket policy by stealth.

It is also implying that the system is incredibly complicated and that hardly any children will ever get a statement so don't bother even trying.

Claw3 Fri 23-Sep-11 21:05:21

Coff33, I dont think anything has changed, only reasons schools have ever applied for a statement is if they made their league tables look bad or the child is disruptive and causing them difficulties. I dont think many schools actually have the child in mind when applying for a statement, just themselves.

I dont see how this 'guidance' is going to help schools with the identification of children with SEN's at all, if anything the opposite, if the criteria is now based on 'sub levels' in NC alone.

I suspect this is just ds's school interpretation, but very misleading advice to be giving to parents.

Ds's sub levels change to suit, at Tribunal he was 2a in science, school report which came 2 months after he was 2. So bumped him up for Tribunal.

He was a 2a for reading in Tribunal, Feb's IEP he was 3. Bumped him down for Tribunal.

As Star says it wont change the statementing process, the SEN COP will still apply and things like anxiety, social skills, OT needs, SALT needs etc will still be the same. Just really misleading to be sending to parents, i feel like disputing this, but i have to pick my battles.

Claw3 Fri 23-Sep-11 21:09:06

Coff33, ds has just finished year 2. NC sub levels as far as i am aware are 2, by the end of year 2, with 2a being a high average, 2b, then 2c, then 2. 2 being the average level.

Claw3 Fri 23-Sep-11 21:18:52

Found this

Key Stage 1 Ages 5-7 Years 1 and 2
Key Stage 2 Ages 7-11 Years 3, 4, 5 and 6
Key Stage 3 Ages 11-14 Years 7, 8 and 9
Key Stage 4 Ages 14-16 Years 10 and 11

Im confused now!

coff33pot Fri 23-Sep-11 21:19:02

Just scouted net and yes he is well behind really according to their level choices. So yes by their letter he would stand a chance. To be honest I think you are right as it wasnt till DS physically tried to throw a chair at 3 teachers gunning for him were they even interested in applying for a statement. I was told in so many words "perhaps its just that we have to "contain" him during the school day" my retort was a little bit of education just might go a long way too angry

I thought someone said there was a choice somewhere of opting out of this pilot scheme thing?

coff33pot Fri 23-Sep-11 21:21:16

what I have looked at it says P1 to P8 and 1c to 1a are below expectations for year 2 if that helps lol

coff33pot Fri 23-Sep-11 21:22:27

funnily enough it does mention suggested help in Key Stage 1 so yes its 1 up to the end of year 2

Nigel1 Fri 23-Sep-11 21:30:21

The Green Paper is a Green paper. It is a proposal. There is no legel merit in what the LA is suggesting. Please foward your details separately to me and I will take it up.
Until the new CoP / law is issued / debated etc the current law stays in place. To put it another way they are trying it on.

Claw3 Fri 23-Sep-11 21:45:24

Nigel, its not the LA that have suggested it as far as i can tell, its the school. It also appears to be in response to some questions i have been asking of school and after i have requested all of ds's files.

Sounds to me like school are trying to make it sound 'official' to cover themselves. I cant help thinking, this letter, although no specifically addressed to me, is for my benefit.

Nigel1 Wed 28-Sep-11 09:17:37

LA or school it makes no difference. Stick to the existing law and Code of Practice.

Hassled Wed 28-Sep-11 09:23:20

What Nigel said. It's only a Green Paper, the consultation only ended fairly recently. These changes probably will go through but they haven't yet.

In your shoes I'd identify the Governor who has a responsibility for Inclusion and ask them if they realise this. It does make me wonder, though, what the LA in your County is telling the schools.

AttilaTheMeerkat Wed 28-Sep-11 10:52:44

Claw3

Think your school wrote some real crap here to the parents; god help those who don't have internet access or enough time/effort to do their own researches.

The current system is still applied; I would put this into the recycling as there it would actually do some good!.

jandymaccomesback Wed 28-Sep-11 11:02:14

I suppose this is meant to show that class teachers have responsibility for children in their class who fall behind.
As has been said it is only a Green Paper so shouldn't make any difference.
My DS has just left school with 5 A-Cs and very good value added on the part of the school. That would never have happened if he hadn't had a Statement.
Claw 2b, 3b, 4b etc are the "expectations" at each stage for an average child with a being above average and c being below. A Year two child who was five sub levels below would have to be working on P levels. a child who was three sublevels below would be 1b. But as has also been said there are far more reasons for intervention than just academic achievement.

appropriatelytrained Wed 28-Sep-11 19:29:22

As others have said, this is a Green Paper - a consultation paper. It has not even been put in Bill form, let alone become legislation.

The LA have to apply the law not a Green Paper.

To be honest, if you can't be bothered entertaining another exchange with school, I would write to your local county councillor with a copy of this letter and point out your concern that the LA seem to be trying to change the law of the land all by themselves by issuing a blanket policy document in the hope it will confuse schools and parents alike.

I would also send a copy to IPSEA.

It explains alot about your LA though.

appropriatelytrained Wed 28-Sep-11 19:50:01

As others have said, this is a Green Paper - a consultation paper. It has not even been put in Bill form, let alone become legislation.

The LA have to apply the law not a Green Paper.

To be honest, if you can't be bothered entertaining another exchange with school, I would write to your local county councillor with a copy of this letter and point out your concern that the LA seem to be trying to change the law of the land all by themselves by issuing a blanket policy document in the hope it will confuse schools and parents alike.

I would also send a copy to IPSEA.

It explains alot about your LA though.

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