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Meeting with EP - is this right re statementing

(21 Posts)

Apparently in our LEA, in line with government recommendations, from 1st July children will only be given a statement if they need a special school or a unit.

We had a really annoying meeting with the EP prior to him hopefully assessing DS this morning where he outlined the statementing process and what the document would look like etc, and then said that there are these changes coming in that meant that DS would never qualify for a statement as his needs are not great enough.......

I feel that he was just going by what the SENCO had told him. He even said that all of the behaviours that the Paed is investigating him for ASD for are expected from all 6 year old children. Why would she be assessing him then??

Don't get me wrong, I don't want him to have any needs at school or to need any additional support but what we do know is that he has dyspraxia, poor social skills, visual problems (tracking, convergence etc), huge discrepancies in visual perception, auditory memory issues and a lot of other problems that work better if we treat him as a child with ASD - visuals, giving lots of notice of change in routine, trying to avoid anxiety-increasing situations etc etc. Both of us came out feeling that he had told us that there was nothing wrong. I don't want to apply for the statement until I know whether there are any academic issues as his levels are appropriate for Y1. Hopefully the testing will indicate whether his levels are as expected. I know that I can apply on social and emotional needs alone but am hoping that if he gets put in the Y1/Y2 class when he is in Y2 as I have requested that he will be able to socialise with some of the younger children.

This is just another of my ranting outpourings...........

Sorry, there was a question in there somewhere! Is this right???

from 1st July children will only be given a statement if they need a special school or a unit

catherinea1971 Tue 21-Jun-11 15:21:58

Not got much time for a full reply but afaik they're taling crap......

catherinea1971 Tue 21-Jun-11 15:23:17

talking even, I have just had a statement for my ds and could have named mainstream had I felt inclinedsmile

AttilaTheMeerkat Tue 21-Jun-11 15:28:52

"Apparently in our LEA, in line with government recommendations, from 1st July children will only be given a statement if they need a special school or a unit".

Blanket policies such as these are still unlawful.

Am sure IPSEA or SOSSEN would be delighted for you to name and shame that particular LEA and I would be informing one of these particular organisations about their actions. Also your MP.

I'd also give the EP a kick up the behind as well because it is not his decision to make. However, EP is employed by the LEA so are under pressure anyway not to readily statement. Apart from anything else if I had £1 for everytime I had read something on these lines on these boards i.e "and then said that there are these changes coming in that meant that DS would never qualify for a statement as his needs are not great enough......" I'd be quite wealthy by now!!!.

Ben 10 - you need to think longer term as well. He may not cope particularly in secondary school without a statement, I would ignore the naysayers and apply for one asap. Delaying applying for the statement for whatever reasons will do neither he or you any favours.

They are talking out of their collective behinds again but how many parents will actually believe their lies?.

Thanks ladies. He was very careful to tell us that he wasn't telling us either way whether to apply or not hmm but if I didn't come on here, I would definitely have believed him.

I have just found out that he didn't assess him today and just looked at his science work. Now, I'm angry........

I'll give Parent Partnership a call tomorrow I think

TheNinjaGooseIsOnAMission Tue 21-Jun-11 16:07:56

my impression was that nothing changes until they've finished their consultation on the sen green paper, not heard anything different yet. Sounds like a line you're being fed, follow this up with a letter asking if you understood correctly, get it in writing.

Great idea Ninja. Will do that now.

Thanks

AttilaTheMeerkat Tue 21-Jun-11 17:19:48

Speak to PP by all means but do bear in mind that they can work very closely with the LEA so they may not be fully independent or impartial.

I would also be talking to one of the fully independent organisations out there who help parents (e.g IPSEA, SOSSEN, ACE etc).

Understood Attila. Just wanted to find out from the PP whether the line re the 1st July is being spun across the whole of the LEA. Will definitely give one of the independents a call too. Thanks

dolfrog Tue 21-Jun-11 20:31:34

Ben10isthespawnofthedevil

Just me seeking some clarification regarding the diagnosis you already have for your DS. (probably my Auditory Processing Disorder (APD) that is causing my confusion)
So you have existing diagnosis for
Dyspraxia
Visual Processing Disorder (visual problems (tracking, convergence etc), huge discrepancies in visual perception)
Auditory Processing Disorder (auditory memory issues)
All of these can be issues can be contributory underlying problems that make up the multiple issues that cause some of the behaviours, as a coping mechanism, included as criteria for a diagnosis of ASD
as outlined in Identification and Evaluation of Children With Autism Spectrum Disorders

Our DS1 was assessed for some years for ASD, but the final out come was Dyspraxia and Auditory Processing Disorder. These issues are not as cut and dry as many would like to assume as there many areas of overlap.

I suppose what I am asking is do the other issues which you did not mention make a diagnosis of ASD more likely.

BialystockandBloom Tue 21-Jun-11 20:33:20

You could call up the Head of SEN and confirm this, but I would seriously doubt this to be the case.

In any case, it's not up to the EP to decide whether to assess (for statementing) or not. If you apply for a statement and the SEN dept decide to go ahead with statutory assessment, this will include EP assessment (for statementing purposes).

If you want to get ds assessed first to help you decide whether to apply for a statement, I second what others have said, get an independent EP for this.

Btw don't listen to SENCO or anyone else from LEA either if they try to put you off applying for statement. We were told the same thing by paed, SENCO, and early intervention officer ("ds too high functioning") and have been awarded 25 hours a week 1:1.

Thanks Dolfrog. We have had our first paed appt in May at which I asked her to assess for ASD.

She does agree that there are enough markers (other issues including behaviours, literal thinking, lack of imagination, routines, collections etc) to warrant a multi-discliplinary assessment and we are now just awaiting the appointments for the various assessments. Apparently just the fact that he had a whole conversation without looking at her was enough of one by itself to warrant an assessment grin

B&B

Private EP - thats an idea as I don't trust this guy one little bit. Any ballpark figure on an assessment? We have had a £430 grant for a private OT assessment already due to NHS being crap already.

Aero Tue 21-Jun-11 21:02:32

I paid £430 for private EP Ben10 and I'll say no more re the other one - suffice to say we're likely to have come across the same one and possibly paed too (who is very good).

Agnesdipesto Tue 21-Jun-11 21:11:51

I am not aware of any new govt recommendation and have been on some training courses recently on sen

I suspect its their policy being passed off as a change in the law / guidance. As i have found out the hard way LA policy and the law are rarely the same thing

Whatever their policy they must always consider whether to exercise discretion in an individual case

If it reassures you we were told DS would never get more than 75% of his nursery hours with 1:1 as they never gave more than that - we appealed and he got 100%
That he would never need a place at special school - he got a LA EP recommendation for both special school or ABA programme
And we would never win at Tribunal as their mainstream provision was so top notch and they 'had never lost one of these' and he won 35 hours a week ABA 48 weeks a year.
His package was £4000 a year and we won more than 10 times that
And he is far from being the most severe ASD child they have

I would just write to the EP summing up what he said and asking for him to forward you a copy of the new law or guidance to which he is referring

I suspect if you go on your council website and look at minutes of meetings for childrens services or executive or schools forum you will find changes to the amount the LA intend to delegate to schools in an effort to cut statements. Our LA has been delegating more money to school for years but requests for new statements keep going up as few parents see much evidence the schools are equipped - even with more money - to deliver services necessary. If you search things like 'high needs statements' or or 'delegation+sen' + council name you might dig up something.

I find you can do the application for an assessment and appeal the inevitable refusal to assess yourself (use the IPSEA advice pack) as they often back down on this - I wouldn't necessarily get an EP until you know they are going to fight you on just the assessment. Save your money for getting the statement right.

Aero - grey beardy and annoying knowitall ring a bell?! Could you PM me the details of the private EP you used as could probably manage £430? Thanks

Agnes Thank you. Once again the MNSN ladies come up trumps with the info that I need. I will write to him tomorrow as you indicate and then I think do the SA request based on the social and emotional issues alone and see what comes of it. Can then get the private EP lined up ready!

Agnes I found it:

6.1 LA will move towards an increasingly inclusive framework, giving more children with Special Educational Needs (SEN) the opportunity to participate in educational experiences in mainstream schools.
6.2 The LA holds the view that mainstream schools should enable most children with SEN to be educated with their peers in their local community, within the framework of the whole school policy for the inclusion of pupils with SEN, accessing the whole of the school’s delegated budget.
6.3 LA will work with mainstream and special schools to develop collaborative inclusive practices in support of children whose parents wish them to be educated fully and appropriately in their local school. This will involve differentiating, modifying, or in some cases, misapplying the National Curriculum, and providing or securing professional development for staff.

8.1 Local Authority (LA) looks to:
preserve the principles and safeguards of the SEN Code of Practice;
renew the emphasis on provision under the school- based stages, i.e. School Action and School Action Plus;
improve overall provision, including early intervention and prevention strategies, so that the proportion of children who need a statement will be 2 per cent or less.
8.2 The reduction in statements will come as a result of appropriate intervention and resources being provided when a child's special educational needs have been identified, so that parents and schools do not feel they must secure them through a statement. The reduction is not intended to reflect political or educational dogma, nor to meet an arbitrary quota for SEN.

Tiggles Wed 22-Jun-11 10:29:41

Certainly within Wales there is a big push to put children onto 'extended school action plus' rather than a statement unless they have physical disabilities.

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