How do I clean a very stong 5 year old who dosn't want to be cleaned?

[mummyloveslucy]

Hi, my daughter seems to have no control of her bowels, she soils herself sometimes several times a day. She hates being cleaned and it is becomming extreamly hard to clean her privates when she refuses to open her legs. I have to try to hold her legs open, kepp her hands out the way and clean her all at the same time, while she's screaming her head off. [aaagh]
I've tried asking her to do it but she either refuses point blank, or just wipes the front very quickly.
She's had a UTI recently, probubly due to infection. She has a bath every night, but she's still getting sore.
This is turning in to such a battle, and I'm not sure what to do. She is getting stronger all the time and showing no sign of improvement in toilet training.
I'd be really greatful for any ideas or advice, thanks.

[mummyloveslucy]

bump

[mummyloveslucy]

Anyone?

[neolara]

Sorry to hear this. It sounds very stressful for you both.

Have you spoken to your GP about the soiling? Soiling is often to do with constipation which can be managed medically.

Do you think your dd is embarrassed and that is why she is getting so upset? I remember reading a thread on MN a few months ago about someone's dd who had the same problem. Her dd was horribly embarrassed by the situation and responded agressively. When the OP was able to sit down and talk about it with her the situation changed massively. (The dd had been absolutely distraught about the situation but hadn't known how to handle it). It was a very moving thread.

[neolara]

Sorry, I've just realised this is in SEN. Is your dd's soiling related to her difficulties?

[mummyloveslucy]

Hi, yes I think it's related to her SEN's. She isn't at all embarassed about it unfortunetly She is on Movicol as the Doc thought it might be constipation but it hasn't made any difference, it just gives her the runs which makes the situation worse as you can imagine.

[annh]

Mummyloveslucy, does this also happen at school? How does she deal with being cleaned there or do you have to go in and do it each time? I just wondered if she reacts better at school but as I type I am thinking that school probably won't deal with her soiling constantly anyway so my question is probably not even relevant!

[mummyloveslucy]

She does sometimes do it at school and they'll clean her up. She dosn't make a fuss when they do it. She does tend to hold it at school though and she'll poo in the car on the way home often. I've talked to her about it before and have asked why she does it at home and not school and she said "because my friends will laugh at me". So she does have some understanding of what's socially acceptable.
She also wets herself quite a lot and will do this just as much at school as she does at home.

[mummyloveslucy]

bump

[mummyloveslucy]

bump

[thisisyesterday]

i would definitely talk to her about it and ask her why she doesn't like it,
then explain why you need to do it, and see if she can come up with any ideas of how to make it nicer.

maybe there are certain things she particularly dislikes? ie, do you use wipes that are cold? perhaps a warm flannel would work better?
maybe she doesn't like lying down, so doing it standing up might work?

[mummyloveslucy]

Thanks, I'll try. She is like it standing up, lying down, in the bath etc. It's a nightmare. I can ask her how she prefers to be cleaned and see what she says.
I've tried telling her that the poo will make her sore if I don't clean her, and she said "good, I want to be sore". and

[hairymelons]

Stuff I would try: definately second asking her how she would prefer it done, then just do it that way every time;
pretend that I am not bovvered that she has soiled herself or that she doesn't do it at other times & clean up as nonchalantly as poss;
beyond original chat about how shall we clean you up, never mention the soiling; distraction with chat about nice/ fun stuff during clean up;
outright bribery for co-operation.

Not that I've had much success with any of the above (mine is 20mo and violently opposes nappy change unless barraged with distraction) but might be worth a try.

[mummyloveslucy]

Thank you, I'll give it a try.

[ommmward]

Is she really ready to be out of nappies all day long? How about having a nappy ready that she slips on when you get into the car to go home? THen she can let go on the way home and it's nbd