7wk old not sleeping or napping

[GingerBeverage]

7wk old is described as 'alert' and hasn't slept all day today

We try:
pre-empt tiredness, put down as soon as an hour awake
feed with breast or bottle
wind
swaddle
white noise
shoosh
rock
pat
dark room
pacifier
sling (hates it)

eventually closes his eyes and 'naps' for 2min-10min. When he wakes his eyes ping open and he resumes looking around for stimulation. This also happens if he is moved at all. If he doesn't get any stimulation or we try to leave him/pat shoosh get him back to sleep he will cry.

Today he woke (ie we gave up trying to get him to sleep) at 5:30am and he's still fighting sleep now at 8:30pm.

At 6:30pm we started evening routine with a bath, then feeding in dark bedroom. All lights low, no big noises or excitement.
He liked the bath but continued to refuse sleep.
More feeding, which he started to refuse as well, crying when either bottle or breast offered and crying when either taken away.

He is also a bad night sleeper, waking every 2 hours on good nights and every hour on bad ones. He used to only sleep in arms but recently accepted sleeping in his crib. Now he refuses both.

Daytime he doesn't generally cry but just yawns and keeps looking around at things. Nighttime he grunts, makes dolphin/dinosaur noise/farts a lot and rouses himself straining and kicking.

Weight gain is fine, seems healthy. Currently taking infacol and Nystatin.

TL;DR baby fights sleep day and night

Any thoughts?

[Pantheon]

Hi, my dd was very alert as a newborn too. You say you try to put him down but would he sleep if you held him for a nap instead? My dd went through stages of not liking the sling but it did help massively in getting her to sleep at that age

[notmytea]

My first was an awful sleeper and my newborn second child who is 10 weeks wakes every 2 hours in the night and here I was thinking that was GOOD so I guess first must have been truly awful!

Have you tried a sling? I certainly wouldn't bother with shush pat or trying their own bed, I'd just sling as much as possible and co sleep, whatever works

[notmytea]

Just seen he hates sling! Have you tried it for at least 10 mins of big bouncy walking outside? That's the main way my kid settled.

Could he have reflux or cmpa?

[ParadiseLaundry]

Is he waking up when you try to put him down or is he refusing to sleep in your arms too?

[LoisLittsLover]

Have you tried getting him to sleep in the pram?

[burritofan]

Also had an alert newborn.

Pram with SnoozeShade works; basically a moving sensory deprivation chamber.

Sling outside – outside was key! – ideally doing Ministry of Silly Walks level motion, plus woolly hat yanked down over eyes. A carrier with a "stop looking at things" hood also works, like an Ergo.

I recall, through the fog, 7 weeks being particularly difficult and DD only managing micro naps like this. It passed.

[GingerBeverage]

@ParadiseLaundry - both

Re using pram- I forgot to mention that he gets hyper alert in it - eyes almost falling out his head with all the looking around

We have ordered a new sling that we got to test him in and he didn't seem to hate it so hopefully that + going outside will be a winner

He had a good night last night when he eventually got to sleep around 9pm and has had a morning nap of an hour so I'm hoping these sleep strikes only occur now and then.

'Alert' certainly keeps us on our toes!

[sarahc336]

My dd was very much like this but it kinda calmed down a bit around the 10week mark and she would then be rocked to sleep for a nap and then she kinda fell into a semi decent routine but it defo took a while for her to accept having a nap. Fingers crossed for you too, alert babies are great but they can be hard can't they

[GenevaMaybe]

Where is he napping in the day?

[notmytea]

This time around we've decided not to stress about doing an early bedtime with ds, so we let him nap in the evening and then all go up to bed at 9 or 10pm to watch TV in bed for a bit. This means we get 10-1am before first feed (he's 10 weeks old). If we were putting him down to bed at 7pm then we'd lose that good batch of sleep as we'd still be up.

We will begin to bring his bedtime forward gradually after 8 months or so but I'm not stressing this time around and it's so much better than my DD who I was obsessed with having a bedtime at 7

[SundayMorningSun]

Our 10 week old is very "alert" too - loves looking at things and people, difficult to get her to nap.

We've had some success with a few things, no idea if these will work for you:

• ergo carrier. Weirdly she hates it inside but will drop off as soon as I step outside. The "blinkered" view seems to help.

• darkness at night. Also I have to lie down next to her and close MY eyes. If I look at her she just stares back.

• the other day I was literally feeding her with my hand over her eyes (not touching her face) to get her to chill out enough to nap

• the pram kind of works as long as the hood is up

Reducing visual stimulation does seem important for us!

[peachgreen]

Crying when feeding was one of the key signs of CMPA for DD. She was also described as "alert" because she liked to be upright and looking around all the time but that was because she was in pain from silent reflux. She was also a terrible sleeper. Might be worth checking out.

[hodgepodge21]

We had similar issues with feeding when our little boy was around that age and it turned out to be silent reflux. Also made putting him down difficult and sleeping was terrible - very similar to you. He is now 14 weeks and on medication, and with a bit of routine and some handy sleep aids, he generally does 4 hour chunks at night and manages 3 or 4 x 45 min naps a day! Worth looking into reflux, it doesn't need to involve spitting up. But also agree having a super alert baby definitely makes it more difficult!!

[GingerBeverage]

@SundayMorningSun yes! I have noticed that he loves the feedback or seeing my eyes, so that I have to close them when I want him to do the same. He is very drawn to light, fixating on the smallest crack in the blackout curtains.
He naps in a moses basket in his room, blinds drawn, white noise on.
Our new carrier arrived today, a harness one instead of the wrap he dislikes. I'm hopeful!

We asked the HV about reflux, explaining his hatred of lying flat etc but she seemed to think it was nothing unusual. It'll read more about CMPA but neither of us has any allergies so hopefully he doesn't.

I'd love to know the average amount of sleep an alert baby gets, because I just don't think they're easily compared to other types of baby.

[peachgreen]

I don't have any allergies either. I'd speak to your HV about the behaviour when feeding.

My DD went from napping for no longer than 20mins and getting broken 2 hour chunks of sleep to sleeping through with only 1 wake up at about 3am and napping for 1.5 hours (admittedly always on me). She's now 22mo and she sleeps 7pm-8am with a 2-3 hour nap.

[GingerBeverage]

Just wanted to add that he seems better now. We had 3 visits with cranial osteo and whether it was the natural course of development or she helped release his tension he is going down for naps and sleep a lot better.
We have also started a routine with swaddling, bathing etc. He's still a wakeful and alert baby but it's progress.

[GingerBeverage]

Oh lordy, I spoke too soon.
He's barely sleeping day or night again. OH and I are ragged.
Trying infant gaviscon tonight.

[Hazzy135]

Hi @GingerBeverage. I've just found your post and your baby sounds very much like mine! I'm struggling with any naps at the minute and nighttime is a huge fight!
How old is your baby now? How are you getting on?

[thunderthighsohwoe]

Mine is still alert at 12 month and has 2 x half hour naps, sometimes only one. Does sleep ok at night; 6.30-5.30ish, sometimes one wake.

Although she did have silent reflux, she was well on meds before 7 weeks and much more comfortable and it was the visual stimulation that was the issue. PP mentioned buggy+white noise+Snoozeshade sensory deprivation chamber - this is still the only thing that makes her nap! Bedtimes always have been no issue for her, since 5 weeks luckily.

She’s still described as alert, always on the go, never been a cuddly ‘lap baby’. Goes nuts if she doesn’t get out and about at least once a day.

I’m hoping it’s a sign of intelligence but I’m thinking it’s just bad luck!

[GingerBeverage]

@Hazzy135 wish I could say things are fine now but it's as bad as ever.
LO is 10 weeks now. He still is a poor napper and poor sleeper - rarely going longer than 3 hours, usually sleeping 1.5-2 at night and usually 20-30min naps during day.

We had one glorious day when he ran to schedule for everything, never repeated.

He still doesn't sleep in stroller, but we've got a more rigid harness now and he'll eventually drop off in that (but only if we keep moving).

Anything stimulates him and he loves looking around.

What is yours like?

[GingerBeverage]

Also he has just gone to sleep after fighting it for 4 hours.

[BonnieSeptember]

Just regarding the reflux - my HV also brushed off reflux symptoms as usual, i.e., not indicative of reflux. However I took my little boy to the GP after persistent symptoms and she said he did sound quite refluxy so prescribed gaviscon. May be worth a shot.

[Hazzy135]

@GingerBeverage very similar! I can't take him anywhere too stimulating! I went to a big shopping centre and he wouldn't sleep the entire time we were there and cried and cried and cried. He stares at everything but then I think it's all too much for his little head.

The other day he was awake 10 hours as fighting his nap turned into fighting bedtime! When we do eventually get him to sleep at night time sometimes he's doing 3 hours now but it takes a few hours of putting down and waking up to get to that point! I feel like I spend half my life trying to get him to sleep!

Today, I got him to sleep by bouncing on a yoga ball in a dark room with white noise and then slowly carried him downstairs and rebounded on the yoga ball in the dimly lit living room with the tv on low He'd never fall asleep in there but since I'd done the hard part upstairs I refinished the job and could actually hold him and watch a bit of tv!

We're about to order an ergo baby with a hood to see if we can block his sight and help him sleep!

He'd sleep like an angel if I sat in a dark room with him and held him any nap times/ all night! That is after the fight of getting him to sleep in the first place obviously!

All I see anywhere I go are sleepy babies too!

[GingerBeverage]

Update: 13 weeks old now and on omeprazole for reflux. A lot better!
Still doesn't sleep when there are things to look at but we even hit a 4 hour stretch at night recently.
The main thing that we are working on is increasing the amount of milk he takes at each feed, trying to stop the snacking which was probably related to the reflux and not wanting to be full (as it would hurt).
Not sure but he may have a bit of CMPA as well but we'll stick with medicine for now.