Seperation anxiety and sleep

[Polly12345]

Does anyone have similar problem? DS is 9months. Terrible sleeper but I have recently night weaned and things have improved tremendously to the point where DS now sleeps 7/8pm- 6am with maybe 1-2 quick settles with dummy Even slept through completely on 1 occasion!However, this is only if he is in cot attached to my bed which is not ideal in the long run (once I return to work I will be working shifts, including nights, so won't always be here).
So he goes to bed in his cot in his own room...no problems..self settles with dummy. But for 3 hours max then once he wakes that's it, he will not settle unless I move him into cot in our room.
He's a clingy baby in the day and suffers terribly with separation anxiety if I try to leave him with family etc.
It's as if he knows how to sleep, can self settle with dummy etc but just can't cope unless he's next to me?
Don't know whether to persevere and have a few rough nights making sure he stays in his own room? But then don't want to upset him too much & feed his anxiety if that makes sense? Any thoughts?

[FATEdestiny]

Why not keep the cot in your room (for now) and move away from your bed? See how that goes.

Changing rooms part way through the night will create a reason for your DS to wake up, at a time he should be focusing on resettling and going back to sleep. It's something he could well still be doing at 5 years old.

If your aim is independant sleep, then he needs more consistancy in where he sleeps, not chopping and changing. If you go for his room, stick with his room right through to morning, every night.

If he sleeps better in your room in his cot, and with you going back to work so being more knackered any way, it's a no brainer for me.

He's only 9 months old. It's not really "clingy", it's just that babies (and he is still only a baby) have a strong attachment to their primary carer. He'll start noticing other important people in the coming 12 months.

[Polly12345]

Morning Fate. Thanks for replying. I actually wrote that post last night as I knew things were on a slippery slope to deteriorating again and I was right So last night he went to bed at 8pm and was up every 2 hours ish most of the night (in my room) and up for the day at 5am! I fed him and he dosed on bed until about 5:45.
I don't have a problem with him sleeping in cot next to my bed, in fact I was thrilled we had got to the point of sleeping! Felt human again and didn't mind at all, but as with everything with this baby, it only seems to last a short time then stops working. So to me there's not much point him 'sleeping' next to me if h a still up most of the night? If that makes sense??
What to do tho? So you think move cot away from bed and put side up? He will cry a lot as he basically only sleeps if I have my arm across him, and actually this last few nights it has got worse where he only goes back k sleep if he's holding my finger. Or do I just go for his own room now and accept a few rough nights until he gets the idea? The problem with his own room is I could be standing there over him all night, which is fine for a few nights 'teaching him' but I just worry this won't really achieve anything as I'm still there with him, if that makes any sense??!
Arghhh sleep deprived mess today and HV is coming for his 9month check

[FATEdestiny]

So to me there's not much point him 'sleeping' next to me if h a still up most of the night? If that makes sense??

Is it better that he's not sleeping in his room, and you are sat/stood in his room (rather than lying in bed under your duvet) hour after hour? Or in and out all night? If that's better for you, go for it.

Are you thinking you are waking him and that in his own room he won't wake at all? If that's the case definately time for his own room. Not waking at all is the aim. But if he does wake, see the paragraph above.

Or were you thinking of just leaving him to it in his own room, regardless of crying? I couldn't comment on that, not something I'd do.

You could gradual withdraw the touch reassurance he needs at night, I'd if that is the problem. That does not involve denying him touch reassurance if he goes to sleep better feeling you there.

Have you considered why he wakes so frequently? Because it sounds like he has in-cot settling methods, needed for linking slerp cycles through the night.

The simplest reasons for frequent wakes are low level hunger or over tiredness. Fixed by more daytime calories and more daytime sleep. You can't sleep train an over tired baby or a hungry baby.

[Polly12345]

Thank you 😊 Definitely not up for the putting him in his own room and letting him get on with it or I wouldn't be in the situation I am now!
I would however like to work toward him sleeping in his own room.
Maybe gradual retreat is what I was thinking of doing? So putting him to bed as normal but when he wakes at 10pm instead of just lifting him and putting him in my room, trying to keep him in his cot. Even if it meant I had to sit next to cot all night offering reassurance?
I hear what you're saying though that it's better to do this lying in my own bed lol! But was just hoping that after a few nights he might 'get the idea' and require less presence from me?
Not sure why he wakes? I assumed separation anxiety and or habit?
He eats well and has milk still etc. Doesn't seem to need milk to sleep through just me! He could be over tired I suppose but he has about 3 hours sleep per day split into 2 naps. Loosely follow the 2,3,4 routine?

[FATEdestiny]

I did gradual retreat with my youngest. We started around 3 months. She reached the 'out into cot and leave' without any years by 12 months. This is not the "few nights" of your current expectations.

Why are you fighting giving reassurance so heavily? I don't understand the problem.

The gradual withdrawal I meant was along the lines of:

• current situation, arm on baby chest at all times
  
• work towards arm on baby as going to sleep, remove when in a deep sleep, arm back when distressed. Withdraw when calm.
  
• work towards hand on baby's chest, not arm. until deep sleep then remove. Hand back if stirring, withdraw when asleep.
  
• then hand on chest just to settle baby. Remove once calm and settled, but stay right next to baby. Hand back if stirring. Withdraw when calm
  
• aim towards hand on chest only being needed for initially settling. Once settled you just stay close until asleep.
  
• then hand on chest to settle, small space between you and cot once settled. Return close with hand on chest if unsettled, withdraw when calm. Stay until asleep.
  

(You could get right to this point with cot in your room. It makes life much easier on every one because you do the waiting until asleep while you are in bed)

• hand on chest to settle initially, withdraw away from cot but in view and in room, heavy. Return immediately if unsettled, back to hand on chest. Withdraw when calm.
  
• Hand on chest to settle initially, step away from the cot and turn facing away from cot. Return if needed. Withdraw when calm. Stay until asleep.
  
• hand on chest to settle initially. Wait by open door until asleep. Return if needed, withdraw when calm. Wait until asleep before closing door.
  
• into cot standing and encourage baby to lie down by tapping mattress, stroke, blow a kiss etc to say nan night. Wait by door. Return for hand on chest if needed, withdraw when calm. Close door when asleep
  
• into cot standing, say nan night, busy yourself upstairs until asleeasleep then close door. Always go back if needed and reassure. But always withdraw when calm
  
• into cot, say Nan night, leave close door. Listen at the door. Any sound, so immediately back in (so baby knows you are right there outside the door), reassure, leave close door.
  
• into cot, say nan night, leave, close door, busy yourself upstairs for 10 mins just in case you are calked
  
• into cot, say nan night, leave, close door. That's it.
  

Easy

(Although defo won't be "a few days")

Maybe reassess how important being gentle and not creating any distress is, compated to your expected time scales and patience?

[Polly12345]

Oh ok so maybe I don't mean gradual withdrawal lol! I'll be honest, I would never have the patience for that anyway!
Also, I'm already at the night night here's your dummy and walk out of room stage, and he happily settles himself to sleep, but ONLY at bedtime Any other wakes during the night he goes crazy unless I pick him up and transfer him next to me in bed. Tried in cot settling in his own room-quite easy, but I'm no sooner back in bed and he's awake again ...wondering if I need to just keep doing this?
It maybe doesn't sound like much of a problem but in reality we are knackered. And having no evenings is getting me down. I basically have to go to bed with him when he wakes which can be 9pm. He then is waking in the night and needing me to lie on my shoulder/hip all night causing me discomfort for if I move he wakes. Then to top it off he's up for the day at 5am some mornings Regardless of all this I am also concerned about his reliance on me when I return to work. Poor DH will be having a horrible time with screaming baby 2/3 nights a week, and poor baby too! Feel I need to at least try something else to give them both a fighting chance when the time comes? It almost seems a bit cruel to allow this to go on when I know in a few weeks it won't even be an option? If that makes sense?!