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Son thrashes around most of the night! Help??

(14 Posts)
autumnmuma Sun 30-Oct-16 01:22:15

Someone please help or say you've been in a similar situation and LO has grown out of it!!
My 4.5 month old LB is an awful sleeper. Doesn't sleep much in the daytime he's just a catnapper with 2/3 small naps.
Getting him to sleep at night is a nightmare! He cries and cries until we give in and rock him to sleep.
Once asleep he will stay asleep for maybe 1-2 hours and then the thrashing begins!!
He will thrash his head from side to side and grunt. His arms with rub his face and he will rub his dummy out of his mouth. When it falls out then he will start crying. I'll put the dummy in and try hold his arms to his chest to calm him. This usually works for 5 mins and it all starts again. If I bring him into the bed with me he will sleep better. Sometimes he won't. I really don't know what to do. I need sleep so badly I feel like I'm going crazy!!
We also think he might be teething. Gave him teething stuff didn't more. Bottles work to calm him down to sleep but I don't want him associating sleep with food. He is allergic to cows milk and has reflux too. Which he is on medicine for. We are trying to see someone to sort out his medical problems but does anyone know what to do about his sleep?

autumnmuma Sun 30-Oct-16 07:23:16

Anyone? sad

spacefrog35 Sun 30-Oct-16 07:31:11

Did you swaddle him? Is it something you could try again? It sounds like he's unsettled and trying to self soothe but doesn't know how. It also sounds like he's overtired. My DD isn't great at napping either but when we're in a mess and she's got overtired we have to spend a couple of days 'resetting' so literally all I do is feed/change and spend the rest of the day putting her back to sleep. A couple of days of lots of sleep and we're good to go again. It's so hard, just remember you're not doing anything wrong flowers

CurlsLDN Sun 30-Oct-16 07:34:10

I was also going to suggest swaddling.
What teething remedy did you try? The powders are a homeopathic remedy, so no more than sugar soaked in a very very very watered down drop of chamomile - so useless. The lidocaine gels are much more effective.

KarmaNoMore Sun 30-Oct-16 07:39:42

My son does trash around all night, unfortunately it hasn't stop yet and he is a teen now.

What helped when he was the age of your child was to put him in a grobag, as that way he couldn't get his legs trapped in the cot sides, or hit himself against them and waking up.

We had to remove the dummy due to severe eczema but that really helped, he was miserable for a few days until he got used not to have a dummy. Once the dummy was out of the equation, he didn't wake up because he had lost it.

With regards to rocking him to sleep, I would say that you either do or you don't. Iif you don't want to rock him to sleep just stop picking him up, you can stay in the room, rub his tummy or have him to your side, eventually he would be able to settle down without the rocking. But if you are picking him up after he gets all upset, it will never work: he gets properly upset and then he is too stressed to calm down, which makes the night more difficult.

If you are going to rock him to sleep every night, that is ok as well, but be consistent, don't let baby cry for it, just do it and that's it.

autumnmuma Sun 30-Oct-16 09:26:04

Thank you for your advice ladies.
We didn't swaddle him but have begun doing it. Sometimes it helps other times it doesn't.
That is what I'm worried about that he doesn't know how to self soothe. No idea how to get him to do it either.
I've tried moving him bedtime earlier as he was getting very tired so now start his routine at about half 6/7.
For teething we use anbesol liquid and teething powders. The liquid helps for a short time. I think it's quite bad atm as he chews on my finger so hard.
He also has a dummy and if he's in a light sleep and it falls out he will wake. Sometimes feel it hinders us more as he can't put it back in yet.
I'm a FTM and feeling like I don't have a clue when it comes to sleep!

KarmaNoMore Sun 30-Oct-16 11:43:00

The thing is that it takes time and many tears to get them to settle themselves. Sending him earlier to bed is a great idea.

This may sound strange but it may also be a good idea not to let him have naps longer than 2 hrs during the day.

It takes a big effort to establish a routine, but once it is in place things become much easier and you will have time to catch up with yourself.

FATEdestiny Sun 30-Oct-16 11:46:14

We didn't swaddle him but have begun doing it.

It's actually dangerous and an increased SIDs risk to start swaddling after 3 months old. It is fine to swaddle a child used to being swaddled from when newborn. The danger lies with introducing swaddling late.

I would suggest a very tightly tucked in blanket or sheet instead. Not quite as effective but does have a smiliar effect.

he doesn't know how to self soothe

His dummy will do the soothing, so don't worry. Longer term (7-8m ish) he'll have the dexterity to put his own dummy in. So independent soothing will come.

thrash his head from side to side and grunt

These are absolutely classic "I am exhausted pleaseeeeee please PLEASE help me get to sleep RIGHT NOW". It suggests an over tired baby.

I'd work on more daytime naps. Any sleep anyhow. Movement helps - bouncy chair when home, pushchair walks, car rides, rocking in your arms if it's the only thing that works.

Short 20-40 minute naps are normal. ✔
Make them frequent ✔✔✔

Try to limit awake time (between waking from one nap and going to sleep the next) to about 40-60 minutes at this age.

So your day might be repeated cycles of:

🔴Wake - note the time
🔴Cuddle/play - This might just be 10 or 15 minutes
🔴Nappy check
🔴Settle to sleep (I favour foot bouncing 're bouncy chair (minus play arch ) at this age
🔴Wake.... and back to the beginning to repeat the whole process over and over again.

plonkie Sun 30-Oct-16 11:49:16

Could he be hungry though? I know you say you don't want him to associate feeding with sleeping, I understand that. But he's very young and might genuinely need the milk.

Timetogrowup2016 Sun 30-Oct-16 15:14:02

Why would that increase sids?
What possible reason does it matter as long as their not too hot

FATEdestiny Sun 30-Oct-16 15:31:40

Google the Lullaby Trust evidence base for the data the NHS used to inform SIDs recommendations. The image attached is the relevant bit

AnneGables Sun 30-Oct-16 15:36:20

Do you think his reflux meds are working, strong enough for his growth? My ds had silent reflux and really struggled at night, thrashed and cried lots.

autumnmuma Sun 30-Oct-16 20:30:54

Fate we have used a second stage swaddle so he can have his arms out.
Tonight moving his bedtime earlier worked! We had no crying before bedtime and was easier to settle. We will see how he goes tonight. Thank you for the helpful advice, I agree he needs more frequent regular naps. The list is helpful too.

Plonkie he has a bottle close to his bedtime and we do still feed him in the night. Has 2/3 bottles per night.

Anne no we don't think they are working. Trying to get omeprazole from our Dietcian. Tried before and she was no use. I'm pretty sure his silent reflux bugs him during the night too.

foximusprime1 Sun 30-Oct-16 20:46:53

Might be worth videoing it and showing it to your Dr or HV. my son had a faze of doing this, showed the Dr the recording and he said that it was his tummy making him unsettled. we raised his crib matress to 45 degree angle and it really helped. hope he improves soon x

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