Vomiting with controlled crying

[greenreen]

DS2 is 6.5 months & has never slept well. We co sleep but not through my choice, its just been the only way we get sleep. He can only fall asleep by breastfeeding, & feeds every hour through the night. He wakes up every 45 mins or so from 7pm. Have been doing this for 3 months now so its a habit not a phase I think! When I've tried not to feed him or DH to settle him etc. he gets so worked up he is sick. He is a happy settled baby in the day but rarely naps for long no matter what I do. So for all of our sakes in the house we want to try some sleep training. Advice from HV over vomiting is to clear it up & carry on. Has anyone got any similar experience of trying controlled crying when this has happened? Or any other suggestions?
I know controlled crying is controversial, but we have tried lots of gentle techniques & I need to get him sleeping just a tiny bit better for lots of reasons.. other DD, going back to work with lots of motorway driving, general household sanity...you get the picture.

[Peggotty]

What does your instinct tell you? I did controlled crying with ds and I regret it. Yes, it worked (although he wasn't crying till he was sick). But I just regret it now.

[Flojo1979]

I wouldn't be happy controlled crying til he was sick. Controlled crying is where u leave them. Leaving a baby so young whilst vomiting would be too much of a risk for me. How would u know he'd been sick? If he's in such a state hes sick, could he be in such a state he inhales the vomit?

[greenreen]

I did it with my DD but it worked in 2 days & I never felt cruel in any way. I have to do something now for his sake & I don't know how to avoid him being sick whatever I do as I can't continue to feed him 10 times a night, so he needs some help! I will initially try not leaving him but not feeding, but he will still probably be sick as he seems to have a weak gag reflex when he cries. I just wondered if others have any experience as the HV said it was common..

[Flojo1979]

Is he feeding for food or for comfort?
Will he take breast milk from a bottle?
Is he being weaned?

[greenreen]

To be clear I will of course be making sure he is not left in sick, choking, etc. But he has been sick in DH's arms within 30 mins of crying as he gets so worked up about not breastfeeding. I need to help him have a different way to fall asleep.

[LittleBearPad]

Do you have an evening routine - bath, feed, bed etc?

[greenreen]

He is being weaned. He is ok with food but not very hungry as he gets so much at night I think. I need to switch it round a bit so he has less at night. It's clearly for comfort & every sleep cycle, but he sometimes has long feeds too.

[greenreen]

Yes, we have bedtime routine.

[galwaygirl]

What about giving him a soother?
Has to be better than leaving him that upset?

[LittleBearPad]

A dummy may help if he needs the comfort. It may be worth a try

[ElphabaTheGreen]

Hi greenreen - we'd be glad of your input here if you'd like to join us.

[greenreen]

Thanks for input so far. I have tried a dummy & it was useful for a while but then he started rejecting it. Suppose I'm just interested to hear from anyone whosebaby was/is easily sick if upset. Did they grow out of it etc... I'm not def doing cc right now, but will consider it if I can't get some improvement soon.

[Flojo1979]

My DD vomits easily when fretful which I why I never left her when upset.
When I was a baby my mum did controlled crying on me and I vomited and was so upset I inhaled my own vomit and my lungs collapsed. I was pronounced dead to my parents and taken away, only to start wriggling when being laid out.
Sorry went off track, but thought I'd share that one.

[EdsRedeemingQualities]

It's possible he's teething and just wants to be close to you and comforted...that's normal.

I wish I knew a way to make your nights easier for both of you. I just went with it with my two, co slept, let them suck/drink whenever they wanted to and gradually they slept better.

6.5 months is very, very little still. I wouldn't think this can go on for much longer, not every 45 minutes.

I'm sorry you are feeling so desperate. Much sympathy, and it WILL pass, he's just so tiny right now. It must feel interminable but it will end. I promise x

[Seriouslysleepdeprived]

Flojo that's awful - your poor mum.

My DS choked on his own vomit at 6 weeks for no reason at all & we ended up in A&E with a baby that couldn't breathe. It was the most terrifying thing that's ever happened to me.

I would complain about your HV tbh, a qualified nurse should know better.

[greenreen]

Thanks, I know he is still little, but it has been going on for 3 months now! I'm pretty upbeat generally about sleep deprivation. I don't mind cuddling him & am generally with him all the time & thats fine with me but I do need to encourage him to fall asleep in a different way. I know it passes as my 3 yr old is peacefully sleeping now & I never thought that would happen.

[fraktion]

DS is 18mo and vomits within a couple of minutes of full on crying. We've not dared try any kind of sleep training which involves crying (not that I'm a particular fan of CC/CIO but sometimes even with gradual retreat he will cry until he's sick. He cried himself sick when DH left for work the other day despite being cuddled...

So he may grow out of it, but it may take a while. We haven't found a solution.

[RubyrooUK]

I think if a child is so upset they vomit, the only thing to do is wait. But then I am not very good at sleep training.....:-)

My DS1 used to do the vomiting if I didn't bf him, even when cuddled all the time by his dad. My DH took over doing night wakings at 16mo and amazingly, once he accepted DH as an acceptable alternative (not saying that was easy, but DH didn't leave him at all so he was cuddled all the time even while furiously upset) he quickly settled. He gradually slept for longer and longer periods. Now he is two and wakes once or twice a night but is in his own bed.

The big difference is that my DS didn't really need the food at 16mo - he definitely did at 6mo - so it was possible to stop feeding so much at night. And we realised he likes to be close to people at night so we accepted he wasn't going to self settle any time soon.

Now one of us lies down with him till he goes to sleep - it's not perfect and he still can't self settle before bed (although he is improving in the night, waking and then dropping off back to sleep sometimes). But he is never upset at bedtime and given that we both work and are exhausted, the easy route works for us. (Plus we both secretly love the cuddles when he says "mmm my mummy" or "oh daddy" as he snuggles up to go to sleep with us.)

Sorry I don't have a simple solution. DS did that 45-minute cycle of breastfeeding all night too, so I know how hideous it can be. Until the 16mo point, DS would wake eight times or so at night to feed, so I know it can be brutal.

Just wanted to say you're not alone. Those tricky vomiting-when-crying-so-much babies are very hard work. I never found a good way to deal with it except time, so now I'm having DS2, I shall see if anyone on this thread does have any great tips.

[NomNomingiaDePlum]

you've probably come across this already, but i think that elizabeth pantley has a technique for teaching them not to feed to sleep which is quite gentle and might not cause the distress and vomiting? i can't remember what the technique's called but you basically gradually start moving him off the nipple when he's really sleepy and increase this till you're putting him down awake. my dd is 11 months and we used it fairly successfully, so dp was able to put her to bed, i think we did this when she was about nine months.

(sadly dp then went away for a few days and in the interest of coping with older dd too i fed dd2 to sleep for those few days - now she is rejecting dp's efforts again and is older so goes ballistic when i try to detach her from the nipple - cautionary tale, i call this: when you've managed to stop feeding to sleep, don't take it up again)

[BlingLoving]

When ds vomited during sleep training we decided to pause a but and go back to gentle techniques. They didn't work for us overall but allowed us to take a breather.

Try not to let the sleep training get you down. Take whatever small victories you can.

[greenreen]

Thanks for sharing other vomity baby experiences. Amazingly tonight DH has managed to put him back down with no crying for an hour so far... Small victories like you said! I will keep trying gentle ways for bit longer.