Please could we have a trans issues sub board in feminism?

[DeviTheGaelet]

The feminism chat board is getting overrun by trans threads at the moment and becoming the de facto trans board as a result.
I understand people want to discuss this and also that some people want to be able to hide it, but there is a lot more to feminism than trans issues.
If we had a sub board then feminism chat could go back to being, you know, feminism chat.
What do you think?

[OurBlanche]

Can of worms...

[DeviTheGaelet]

I know
I'm not trying to stop people discussing it, it's just turning the feminism board into something else and it's making me a bit sad as I love FWR

[WhisperedLoudest]

I think there's a lot of feminists who don't understand how you can be a feminist if you're prepared to throw women under the bus.

Threads relating to the same are part and parcel of FWR

[DeviTheGaelet]

whispered That's fair enough which is why I want a sub board on FWR.
I don't know where to put threads about other feminism, it just falls off the board very quickly atm.
Looks like I'm in the minority here though so I'll shut up

[Lessthanaballpark]

I agree. It's interesting to discuss of course and means a lot for feminism but it has taken over.

[daimbar]

Good idea OP

[LassWiTheDelicateAir]

You will likely end up with another section on FWR which nobody posts on. These are on 2 of the sub forums - as you can see the interest was underwhelming.

Daughter started working as a lap dancer HELP | Mumsnet Discussion
www.mumsnet.com/Talk/feminist_support/2848663-Daughter-started-working-as-a-lap-dancer-HELP

FGM | Mumsnet Discussion
www.mumsnet.com/Talk/feminist_activism/2835232-fgm

[DeviTheGaelet]

Yeah you may be right lass
Never mind. I would flounce but I cba

[FlissMumsnet]

We can't make any promises but we will, of course, pass this idea on to the MN big cheese.

[DeviTheGaelet]

Thanks Fliss

[NormaStanleyFletcher]

Please don't make a separate board.

Trans activism is a valid topic for debate on the feminism board (and elsewhere)

[Rozdeek]

No this would not be ok. Transactivism is a HUGE threat to the rights of women - it needs to remain firmly in the spotlight. We SHOULD be talking about it all the time.

[NotCitrus]

It's not a bad idea. Failing that a way to block trans threads that deny the fact that trans people exist, especially as you can't hide threads in AIBU any more.

Gender is a real internal thing for at least a substantial minority of people. Some of those are trans. There are a few outspoken trans idiots, some who engage in thought experiments (like the question of whether lesbians are transphobic if they don't fancy trans women with penises, which some on MN take as trans 'movement' gospel but would be the first to defend say Dworkin's 'all heterosexual sex is rape' as a provocative thought experiment )

Yes there's some questions to ponder say about safety in women's prisons if trans women are a major group among violent women prisoners, and many other things, but so many MN threads forget there are real people diagnosed with a real dysphoria and as a group, whose suicide rate plummets when transition is enabled. Sex and gender are one heck of a lot more complicated than "there are two sexes and gender is only a social construct " and it shouldn't be people ignorant of that making policy.

I've given up reporting trans threads that (almost immediately ) cross the line from debate into pure ideological anti-trans rhetoric.

No, I'm not trans and have no internal gender, but several of my friends and many acquaintances are and/or do. And the lab next to mine where I did my PhD worked on establishment of sex - There's at least 15 sexes in mice.

[FlaviaAlbia]

No, I don't think this is a good idea. If people want to start or engage with other threads then they can just bypass the trans ones. There's already so many sub forums that are never used.

Also, the recent thread in AIBU about a 4yo reached a lot of people who wouldn't venture onto the feminism boards or a trans board and were horrified at the tack the school and parents of the child in question were taking. It's an issue that will probably happen more and more since the number of children referred to gender clinics has increased massively, so parents will want to discuss it. Especially since it's reinforcing gender stereotypes when the children have come away thinking pink + doll = girl and blue + cars = boy.

Aside from all this, a trans topic will be a beacon for trolls and goady fuckers.

[KateMumsnet]

Hi all

This isn't something that we're planning at the moment, but - as ever - if there's a strong consensus that it would be a positive move , then we'll revisit.

Thanks

MNHQ

[peukpokicuzo]

No this shouldn't be a separate board. Trans issues aren't a side issue that are only for the interested. If the concept of being a woman is either erased completely or redefined as a person who is subservient, nurturing, giggly and fixated on pinkness regardless of genitalia then the whole of the progress feminism has made in the past 200 years all comes crashing down. I am not at all sure what a feminism that doesn't want to think about such issues would be like but it doesn't seem like a good idea to me.

[BarrackerBarma]

I wouldn't want this.

The general principle of sub boards seems to be for people who WANT to discuss something to easily find a critical mass of other people who are invested in the same subject. Like style and beauty or knitting.

It isn't to produce a ghetto where people are encouraged NOT to discuss the topic everywhere else.

If the posters who care about the topic and want to discuss it aren't asking for an enclave, it's not on to shove them into one.

I understand being tired of the issue. I have to take breaks from it periodically because it's so frigging upsetting.

But there's a big difference from a single interest group wanting their own space, and advocating that people's opinions should be ghettoed so that people can avoid encountering them.

[DioneTheDiabolist]

Please, please, please please do it MNHQ. Pretty please. I'll send you .

[hazeyjane]

I think it is a bad idea to have too many separate sub topics in any of the boards, as it dilutes stuff, ends up with tumbleweed threads and because often there are crossovers with different sub topics anyway.

[ApplesinmyPocket]

No, please don't, MNHQ. This is an important issue for women. It shouldn't be sidelined.

[DeviTheGaelet]

flavia I totally totally agree it needs to be discussed and have no problem with threads on AIBU or chat. My specific issue is pretty much the entirety of feminist chat is trans related at the mo - so people can hide that board and there is nowhere to do other feminist chat.
It is a shame as there is so much more to feminism than trans issues and the board used to be my favourite. But I am in the minority obviously

[FlaviaAlbia]

Well, it is pretty topical at the moment with the debate on gender ID due last week and then postponed.

Why not start threads on topics you want to discuss? I tend to join in any I find interesting, not just trans stuff.

[ItsAllGoingToBeFine]

And the lab next to mine where I did my PhD worked on establishment of sex - There's at least 15 sexes in mice.

Really? That's fascinating! How do mice breed then?

MNHQ, please don't create a separate trans-issues board. It is a major issue affecting women at the moment, and as such there is no reason to segregate it.

If people don't want to see trans issues in feminism then they can simply hide the threads.

[IrenetheQuaint]

I'd be in favour of a separate board - I used to be on FWR all the time but haven't bothered for ages because it is so trans-heavy, and the threads just go round in circles about the same issues again and again.

Trans ideology is v problematic, sure, but I'd argue that male privilege and male violence have much more of a negative influence on most women's lives, so I'm slightly baffled as why trans issues get quite so much attention here.

[Rozdeek]

I'd argue that male privilege and male violence have much more of a negative influence on most women's lives

Er....that IS trans ideology.