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What is Mumsnets definition of transphobia?

(266 Posts)

MNHQ have commented on this thread.

TheRealPosieParker Fri 08-Jul-16 13:32:11

That's it really.

Mine would be hate or violence against trans people. Mine would not be "misgendering" or acknowledging transwomen are male and that they are not women.

Egosumquisum Fri 08-Jul-16 14:34:28

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

BeyondVulvaResistance Fri 08-Jul-16 15:15:05

I agree with all those instances being dodgy ground that probably need deleting, but we are frequently getting 'transphobic' thrown at us for, to pick a random example, refusing to be happy with identifying as cis. There's a thread locked at the moment for mn to look into transphobia in it (the one about the piss test), and I've looked and can't see anything that hasn't been left to stand before - no comments about chopping off of bollocks or men in dresses. But a lot of posts (often from new names) shouting how transphobic even having the discussion at all is, throwing insults around and whatever. But now it's locked and discussion has been successfully shut down.

So as I understand it, as we currently have a rule on misgendering (directed at an individual = bad), we currently have rules on transphobia that i think (?) are fair on both 'sides'. But that doesn't stop the constant accusation of mn being the most transphobic place on the Internet on every thread even vaguely related to trans-issues. And rather annoyingly, it's always from 'others' - any time I have seen someone who identifies as trans on a trans thread they have been perfectly reasonable!!!

Good luck for your surgery ego, I hope it goes well flowers

TheRealPosieParker Fri 08-Jul-16 16:06:24

Ego. I hope the surgery gives you the peace you seek, however I've read that that is really a huge step in a very hard journey and the next are not so easy either.

I suspect what's happening is that women are getting pig sick of being told that we are merely a state of mind and that brings anger.

Egosumquisum Fri 08-Jul-16 16:13:04

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Egosumquisum Fri 08-Jul-16 16:22:19

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

VestalVirgin Fri 08-Jul-16 17:19:59

Message deleted by MNHQ. Here's a link to our Talk Guidelines.

TheRealPosieParker Fri 08-Jul-16 17:23:41

Ego I would of course not misgender a transsexual or any individual to cause harm, in a discussion though I may refer to a group of transwomen as male. And I would not use "they" for a non binary snowflake.

I can respect that if someone is living as a man/.woman then I'm not going to further the gender critical movement by calling them the wrong pronoun and besides it's rude.

But I will not lie about thinking that trasnwomen pass as women, as they don't, none do. I think being a trasnwoman is a worthy identity.

Egosumquisum Fri 08-Jul-16 17:25:20

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

TheRealAdaLovelace Fri 08-Jul-16 17:28:35

Posie first you say, " in a discussion though I may refer to a group of transwomen as male."...

then you say..." I'm not going to further the gender critical movement by calling them the wrong pronoun and besides it's rude. "

so what is it you are trying to say exactly?

TheRealPosieParker Fri 08-Jul-16 17:31:42

One is in a discussion and the other is to an individual.
So I would use the words male bodied, because 70% of transwomen are male bodied and in a discussion about sharing private space I would probably say male, discussing crime rates? again male. I think it's important to reiterate certain aspects of male priviledge, growing up male etc.

But when I meet MTT I say she/her.

TheRealPosieParker Fri 08-Jul-16 17:34:00

Saying that MTT don't pass as "women" they look like Transwomen is not transphobic! Surely that's reality?

Most women recognise women.

As an example. Last night my nine year old DD and I were watching five minutes of Americas Got Talent, she asked why that man was pretending to be a lady and she expressed disbelief when the panel apparently hadn't noticed.

Egosumquisum Fri 08-Jul-16 17:34:30

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

TheRealPosieParker Fri 08-Jul-16 17:34:49

When someone is a size 26 I don't see a thin person either.

I am genuinely confused if you think it's transphobic to recognise my own sex.

TheRealPosieParker Fri 08-Jul-16 17:35:53

Ego. Are you wishing that everyone just lies and say that transwomen are women? You know that's really insulting to women right?

It's not transphobic to understand difference, surely?

Egosumquisum Fri 08-Jul-16 17:36:29

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Egosumquisum Fri 08-Jul-16 17:37:23

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

milkbottle Fri 08-Jul-16 17:37:56

Are you trans? Unless you are then you have no right to decide what is and is not transphobic.

Egosumquisum Fri 08-Jul-16 17:38:51

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

BeyondVulvaResistance Fri 08-Jul-16 17:41:05

Well, there's one example of something know could clarify as there's clearly a disagreement!

Mnhq, do you consider the statement "I think most transwomen don't pass" (do you both agree that is a fair representation of what posie said?) to be transphobic?

BeyondVulvaResistance Fri 08-Jul-16 17:41:56

'Know' should be mnhq! Stupid a/c

Egosumquisum Fri 08-Jul-16 17:43:15

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

TheRealAdaLovelace Fri 08-Jul-16 17:48:11

Posie if you read back through your thread, you will find that in fact, Ego has not said very much at all. You seem to have a bit of a bee in your bonnet tbh.

Lets just let transwomen be women if that is what they want.

TerrificHons Fri 08-Jul-16 17:48:26

The thing though is that due to biology and sociology, trans women are different from women. That is not a slur. It is merely fact. I also resent the term "cis". I don't need to be redefined. I am a woman and that suits me fine.

TerrificHons Fri 08-Jul-16 17:49:31

ego you seem to be keen to get your own way but don't want to answer any questions in relation to it.

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