I wonder if having a Transgender topic might be useful?

[LaurieFairyCake]

It seems like a growth area and quite often discussed.

It would be helpful for the threads to hang about for longer than 30 days so people could be pointed in the direction of them
too.

[WidowWadman]

If it means that the FWR would be purged of all the transphobic threads I'd be all for it (and would simply hide the topic), but realistically that's not going to happen.

[HermioneWeasley]

I think it's important that the discussion is in mainstream areas - lots of posters on the threads have said they don't go into FWR and only found them because they were in chat, but found them enlightening.

[JasperDamerel]

I don't think that it would work. There are a lot of transphobic threads in FWR, but there are also threads for parents supporting trans children, or trans parents, or partners of trans people. I don't think that those two discrete groups of Mumsnetters should have to share an uncomfortable space.

[HermioneWeasley]

Genuine question to jasper and need - what do you see as transphobic in the current discussions? Can you give me examples of things you have seen which you would class as hateful, because I'm not seeing it (though I suspect I may be one of the people you consider transphobic).

[TiggyD]

A bit like having a "Black and Minority Ethnic" section on a BNP site? Good idea. What could go wrong?

[EhricLovesTheBhrothers]

What would be the point of that? These conversations are being had many times over because new people are joining them, because they are in high traffic areas.

[KatharineClifton]

A bit like having a "Black and Minority Ethnic" section on a BNP site? Good idea. What could go wrong?

So much this with bells on!

[HermioneWeasley]

And to Tiggy and Katharine, what has anyone said that is equivalent to the racism of the BNP?

We are pointing out biological facts and realities- that's the race equivalent of saying that some races are more likely to suffer sickle cell anaemia, or lactose intolerance or are more likely to need sunscreen. Those aren't racist dogma, they are facts.

We have been saying that trans women are different to biological women, and that presents difficulties in certain situations. I won't be silenced from saying that by you labelling me a bigot.

[KatharineClifton]

[LaurieFairyCake]

I suggested it so that people who are trans, have children who are/may be trans get proper support. Just like any 'niche' part of the board.

The SN topic gets much less ignorance/attacks/people wandering in being rude now they have their own board.

There is definitely a place to talk about trans issues on FWR but while we're all having a good old debate that might be off putting to someone who's child may be trans and is seekinb support.

I'm definitely not saying we shouldn't talk about trans issues elsewhere - just like we still talk about SN issues on other areas.

Only that those seeking support and not debate have a place to go.

[HermioneWeasley]

Eloquent and articulate argument there, Katharine

[TiggyD]

There's already a TBLG children section, and a BLTG parents one too. As the cis trans-deniers on here only really discuss in what way trans people are wrong, there's no real enthusiasm for the non-bigots to post on trans threads. MNHQ delete the worst of the abuse, but leave half the stuff up in the belief that it's the victim's job to point out that it's wrong. A bit like saying it's the bullied person's job to stand up to the 20 bullies, and if they don't it's their fault.
Mumsnet is just not a safe environment if you're trans, and MNHQ should be ashamed of themselves.

[Lovecat]

What is this abuse, TiggyD? I don't see anyone saying that trans men and women are terrible people who deserve discrimination and should be shunned.

How is MN "unsafe"? It's a website, not a RL environment and I believe that all of the posters who don't accept the term 'cis' have said repeatedly that they wish trans women who just want to get on with their lives no harm and would not deliberately misgender them.

I do, however, see concerned women who care that they aren't allowed to call FGM FEMALE Genital Mutilation because it's 'transphobic', I do see a growing concern that anyone who says they feel like a woman automatically is one. That leaves us unable to name the problem. We already see the 'oh, but it happens to men too!' crowd pile in when we attempt to discuss male violence, having to say 'lack of access to abortion is a problem for people who are able to become pregnant, be they men, women, intersex, genderqueer, you name it' instead of 'lack of access to abortion is a problem for women', because of a few hurt feelings - it's beyond petty.

[SophieHatters]

LGBT parents

LGBT children

Not sure if you are after something more political or less role-based?

[TiggyD]

And are cis people on here telling trans people how they should feel?

Cis people sharing their cissly views? (Couldn't find the cartoon.)

[MistressMerryWeather]

Oh FFS, I hate that stupid meme.

Tiggy has been on MN for a long time and has just as much right to discuss things as anyone else.

You are doing yourself no favors by dismissing him like that.

[MistressMerryWeather]

It's just what certain people reduce themselves too when they can't keep up with an discussion.

Desperately attempt to invalidate the other person by any means, in this case it's owning a penis.

It would be funny if it wasn't so bloody sad.

[VashtaNerada]

I think a trans area would only work if there was a big sign saying "to discuss practical issues only, not to discuss whether transwomen are welcome in female spaces or whether cis or non-trans is the correct terminology". Because in reality it'd be full of threads debating that, and trans people or parents of trans kids would soon get bored and leave.