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appeal entry into end of yr 7 yr 8

(13 Posts)
dadbrighton Sun 17-May-20 12:14:33

Hello, I have found mumsnet threads have the most information re school appeals so am asking the hive around our specific case.

We have returned abruptly from 19 months overseas, my work took us away. Our 3 Children were all in an excellent ,very close, Primary school in Brighton. We are applying to same Primary school for the two youngest. Eldest (E) will be going back into year 8 or end of yr 7 if they go back before the summer.

School A, Our first and only choice for E has no spaces. And is over PAN by four children. The other school we perhaps would consider for E, school B, is over PAN by 18 children. Both also have waiting lists. We have been offered a place in other schools in the area (C and D) which are not terrible schools.

E suffers from anxiety. First and only choice school has the good friend E has stayed in contact with, is not overly large and has a good reputation for SEN/ Pastoral care. E is not statemented, we have had consultations with a clinical child psychologist whilst overseas, which has been very helpful.

Our options are to appeal for a place at School A for E, accept other offered school or home school. From ltd research appeal seems small chance but probably worth it for us
My questions are;

1) If we appeal is the best possible outcome getting to front of waiting list or can E take school A from 4 over PAN to 5 over PAN?

2) If E's appeal fails I assume we can still be on waiting list for School A? we are considering home schooling, with my partner taking the lead on this. And then hoping for getting in school A at a later date. Either through waiting list OR as E's eldest sibling, U, returns to yr 6, on an upwards Sibling Link if U gets into school A (or B). Does this sound even possible?

3) We think we need to speak to E and go through choices (C and D or homeschooling) with her now. As need to get a decision letter from admissions. As we can not appeal without the letter. And appeals are happening around now(I think)? If we put homeschooling can we change to school C or D at a later date? Feel need to get decision made now to start process but may take a long time for E to input into school C or D decision.

sorry long one. Helps talking. Thanks in advance

OP’s posts: |
Malmontar Sun 17-May-20 12:29:29

@admissions might be able to help.
You are in the very unfortunate position to be appealing for a year group that's been really effected by the mid 2000s baby boom, especially 2007-9 babies.
All I know is if you do win an appeal they go over PAN. Possibly why those schools are over PAN. There's also schools that have accepted bulge classes which will put them over PAN.
The fact it's already 4 over PAN and fine, you could argue that 1 more won't put undue pressure on the other kids education. But saying this, I'm not expert.

Bakeachocolatecaketoday Sun 17-May-20 12:35:44

Have you asked where on the waiting list you are? do you "just " have to wait for 5 kids to leave? What is the turnover like at the school - at Ds's school with 60 per year they usually lose 1-2 per year group per year (mostly in summer) So potentially "turning over" 10 places per year, and thats a small school.

titchy Sun 17-May-20 12:42:57

If you win your appeal you're in. You appeal for a school place not a waiting list rank. If you lose you should remain on the waiting list.

Often the sibling priority only applies to older siblings, so check the admission criteria to see if a younger sib is treated the same.

You're not appealing for a transfer year so don't worry about the fact that other appeals are currently being heard.

If you change your mind about homeschool you can of course apply again and hopefully C or D will still have vacancies.

I'm sure the proper experts will be along soon with their invaluable advice.

PlainJane21 Sun 17-May-20 13:03:18

Hi everyone
The admissions appeal for my child is due soon and although we have a good medical case, we know the authorities stance will be that admissions are full and admitting more would be predjudicial to other children etc
How do you challenge this?
Can you get technical info from the school or the LA on , for Example, on what happened last year with the over subscribing
Any help greatly appreciated
Thanks

admission Sun 17-May-20 15:43:46

Coming from overseas you should always appeal for your preferred schools as you have nothing to lose. If you happened to be military or crown servant then there are some helpful points in the admission guidance, which could give you some advantage.
Given the timing it normally be expected that you would start school before the end of the term in late July but times are not normal, so I suspect that most admission authorities would be happy with a September start.
Think the most important decision to make quickly is whether you will home-school or not. If the answer is yes then you can reject the offered school and try for a place in school A via waiting list and appeal. If the answer is no, then I think you need to make a decision as a family which of C and D is the best option and confirm the place. You need to grab a place whilst it is available.
The waiting list and appeal are separate processes, so a decision to appeal has not bearing on where you are on the waiting list, whilst in most appeals it is usual for the panel not to know where you sit on the waiting list. To get a place off the waiting list, in effect 5 pupils have to leave and you be at the top of the waiting list before a place can be offered. An appeal has no such restriction and you do not know where the 4 over PAN came from - they may well have been all from appeals. In the circumstances, the appeal process is still going to take a while but may well be the quicker process. You can confirm the place at C or D to start in September and it also has no bearing on the appeal. Actually saying you have a place but prefer school A is a better situation to be in for appeal purposes , than be saying you have not accepted a place. It tends to come across as trying to force the appeal panel into agreeing the appeal.

TW2013 Sun 17-May-20 15:56:56

Do bear in mind though that the friend may have moved on and have new friends who won't take to your E. They may also be in different classes- if they are 4 over PAN with 5 classes then even if she wins the appeal she will go into the smaller class. On the other hand some areas have a culture of going to private schools for yr9. I think that you can appeal once per academic year per year group. You might manage an appeal for school A for yr7 then if rejected you might be able to appeal later on in yr8. You could accept a place at one of the other schools as all school is homeschooling at the moment, and then make the decision whenever they finally go back to school.

dadbrighton Mon 18-May-20 17:44:52

Thanks everyone.

We are not military or crown servant.
We are awaiting news on waiting list length of School A
We have gone through options with E, she found it a bit too much to deal with and has said home schooling only, as anticipated - we are about to put down school B as no pressure to go anywhere yet due to COVID, E may want to get out and be with peers when finally allowed to and if she is not able to we will be homeschooling anyway and will have tried what have been offered.

OP’s posts: |
dadbrighton Mon 18-May-20 18:05:51

@admission can I ask is the waiting list purely just ordered as to when joined or linked to need for place. e.g. Brighton and Hove have Sibling Link above Catchment area in priorities when giving places. So if someone has the sibling link they move above someone on list that doesn't? or does the priorities have no indication on the queue? or does it depend on the Local Authority?

Thanks

OP’s posts: |
PatriciaHolm Mon 18-May-20 19:16:36

The waiting list, by law, must be administered by admissions criteria - so you can move up and down it, if someone in a higher up criteria joins it after you. So yes, if someone with a sibling link asked to be put on the waiting list, they would push others down the list.

LIZS Mon 18-May-20 21:39:46

It could vary by school, following the original priority order of admissions. Although iirc B and H operates a lottery for some school place allocations although possibly not waiting lists. U

PanelChair Tue 19-May-20 00:28:14

PlainJane - You'd do better to start your own thread, as your circumstances are different and it needs to be a separate conversation. That said, you can try to chip away at the "school is full" argument by asking the school/LEA for data on numbers in each year group. If any year group is above PAN, you can argue that the school demonstrably has the ability to cope with extra pupils. If you're also arguing on medical grounds, you'll also need confirmation from medical professionals that in their professional opinion your child has medical needs which this school can meet better than other schools. If you start a thread, we can discuss these issues at more length.

PlainJane21 Tue 19-May-20 11:21:39

Thanks so much Panelchair
Very helpful
This was my first post , will endeavor to open a new thread
Thanks once again

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