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Do they still?

(28 Posts)
Ohfrigginghellers Fri 29-Nov-19 13:39:35

Sit pupils in tables of two at high school?
I never liked it as you could end up sitting on your own if uneven numbers even if you are friends with people.

Witchend Fri 29-Nov-19 14:03:29

Surely that is going to depend on the school?
They didn't at my secondary as a standard thing. The teachers generally chose how they set it out, and I can't think of any who just had them in pairs.

noblegiraffe Sat 30-Nov-19 12:54:10

It’s a classroom not a social arena. I don’t care if you’re not sat with your mates and indeed will arrange my seating plan to avoid this if you just want to chat.

dootball Sat 30-Nov-19 12:56:47

Some people need to be sat on their own!

MrsFoxPlus4Again Sat 30-Nov-19 12:59:20

Yup, some of my classes were 4, 2 or singular seating.

Pipandmum Sat 30-Nov-19 13:00:37

In my kids school it varies from class to class. Some have tables of four, some individual desks, some in rows some in a U shape...
In my high school we had those combined table with small desk attached. Just enough space for a pad of paper. They could be easily moved around to any configuration.

Ohfrigginghellers Sat 30-Nov-19 13:58:34

It's not about being sat with your mates necessarily it's about not being sat on your own all the time and feeling left out!

PaquitaVariation Sat 30-Nov-19 13:59:51

Yes, usually for good reasons. Classrooms are not for socialising. It shouldn’t matter who you’re sat with (or not).

Ohfrigginghellers Sat 30-Nov-19 14:02:05

Well I'm sorry but I disagree. I think it can affect confidence and I think there should be a little bit more understanding of how people might feel if they are constantly sat on their own in a classroom where everyone else is paired up.

LolaSmiles Sat 30-Nov-19 14:02:55

Depends on the room layout.
If there is an odd number then a group can be a 3 for paired work.
Nobody is left on their own for tasks requiring discussion and collaboration.

General chat on the other hand...

LolaSmiles Sat 30-Nov-19 14:05:21

Cross posted with this:

I think there should be a little bit more understanding of how people might feel if they are constantly sat on their own in a classroom where everyone else is paired up
A typical secondary student has 10-12 subjects.If a student is constantly sat on their own then I would imagine that the 10-12 teachers probably have a reason and that reason is likely to be that the student has shown to 10-12 teachers separately that they don't focus or behave in a way that's conducive for learning.

helloisitmeyourelookingfor Sat 30-Nov-19 14:11:26

My dd was sat on her own across multiple subjects and it was because she was the least likely to speak up about it

I know this because I addressed it at parents evening with every single teacher -they view was 'she's a good egg and won't mind!'

She was socially isolated and this made it worse as it was picked up by the others and she was the subject of much 'banter'

couldn't possibly be bullying because bullying doesn't exist at her outstanding school

Horrible practice

chantico Sat 30-Nov-19 14:11:29

"how people might feel if they are constantly sat on their own in a classroom where everyone else is paired up"

Some classrooms are two-by-two, others aren't, and I don't think I have ever seen a lab or art room that is.

Given that subjects are taught by teachers in that department and that every teacher will have their own preferences about seating, and that pupils move between classrooms for each subject; the chances of one DC always being alone is vanishingly small.

Ohfrigginghellers Sat 30-Nov-19 14:12:11

That wasn't true in my case. It's a long time ago now but I was sat on my own in a lot of classes (not all) and it was because most of my friends were on the other side of the year and everyone else just decided to pair up with others. Not necessarily cos they didn't like me just because they were best friends with someone else. I think it's probably worse for girls.

LolaSmiles Sat 30-Nov-19 14:17:01

OP
What you're describing are situations where STUDENTS are pairing up.

Generally these days most teachers will allocate the seating plans.

Helloisitmeyourelookingfor
As long as she had people for discussion tasks and group work though (usually moving across or turning around) then that's reasonable in a multiple subjects. Or are you suggesting that your child should be exempt from sitting alone, whilst it's fine for the other students in your DC's classes where there's an odd number?

Ohfrigginghellers Sat 30-Nov-19 14:17:41

She was socially isolated and this made it worse as it was picked up by the others and she was the subject of much 'banter'

^ this is my point. I wasn't the subject of banter but I did feel socially isolated at times

Papergirl1968 Sat 30-Nov-19 14:29:35

Me too, Op. for year three, I think it was, at secondary school. I used to turn around for group work as my friends sat behind and I pretended I didn’t care but inside I felt humiliated.
The other thing I look back on and flinch at is that thing PE teachers love to do, when they choose a couple of kids to pick a team. I wasn’t ever last but I was towards the end to be picked. Vile practice.

Ohfrigginghellers Sat 30-Nov-19 14:37:09

Papergirl

Yep!

titchy Sat 30-Nov-19 14:54:33

Generally they're sat in boy/girl pairs anyway so no chance these days of being identified as the kid no one wants to sit next to.

LolaSmiles Sat 30-Nov-19 15:06:02

I don't even do boy/girl pairs with most of my class once I've got to know them.

I tend to :
1. Identify any SEND seating requirements eg. TA space needed, hearing impaired students front centre, students with SEMH who might need to enter/leave at times, anything in their profiles that I need to address.
2. Look at who will work well (not be friends with) with who and loosely pair/4 people off.
3. Allocate the pairs/4 around the room
4. Make sure the students who would benefit from additional subtle support are on my typical walk around route so it's not obvious they're being targeted
5. Do a quick check to check I've not got any obvious pockets for disruption

helloisitmeyourelookingfor Sat 30-Nov-19 15:29:54

@LolaSmiles

At what point did I say my child should be exempt from sitting alone whilst others had to sit by themselves?

If there is an odd number and seating is in pairs then clearly someone needs to sit by themselves

But when it's the same person in English, maths, French, history, RE, geography and form time for a whole year -it's hardly fair

Especially when teachers had seating plans, vocal pupils complained about them and then 1 pupil had to swap to sit alone to accommodate them

I also get that different subject teachers don't sit in the staff room comparing seating plans -but in a time when we know more and more students are suffering with their mental health, I would expect teachers to listen to parents' concerns

LolaSmiles Sat 30-Nov-19 15:36:58

You said they're sat on their own in multiple subjects and then were complaining about it. It's not every subject and ultimately that's life at times. Even when classes have odd numbers, students can work in 3s etc for tasks that are normally paired. The single student doesn't exist entirely on their own without interaction.

Ultimately, there are loads of factors that go into a seating plan and the ability to chat outside of tasks isn't a priority.

The mistake the teachers have made from your update is adjusting the seating plan in light of louder/vocal students putting their requests in.

helloisitmeyourelookingfor Sat 30-Nov-19 15:57:14

@LolaSmiles

I am astounded by the level of compassion you are displaying

It's quite clearly the bulk of her timetable

Some days she doesn't sit next to another person all day

Would you be happy seeing everyone else being sat together whilst you sit alone?

LolaSmiles Sat 30-Nov-19 16:05:38

My point is there is a massive difference between sitting on your own and not having any interaction with anyone and being isolated, and sitting on a 2 person desk alone with regular discussion in 3s/group work (which is fairly typical in secondary lessons).

I'm not saying it's fine to have someone on their own all the time not engaging with anyone, more that unless you send your child to a minority of schools who focus on total silent independent work then sitting on a desk alone near others isn't isolating (and if you did go to one of those schools then nobody would be doing group discussion anyway so it wouldn't work).

Considering I've listed what goes into making my seating plans, I'm not sure how you can argue that I don't care about students.

WeePinklet Mon 02-Dec-19 13:23:08

@Ohfrigginhellers

Well I'm sorry but I disagree. I think it can affect confidence and I think there should be a little bit more understanding of how people might feel if they are constantly sat on their own in a classroom where everyone else is paired up.

FWIW, I agree, OP.

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