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Compulsory after school support - is it legal?

(41 Posts)
Youarentkiddingme Tue 01-Mar-16 17:12:30

If a school offers enrichment activities after school and can detain a child after school as a punishment (detention) - can they insist that a certain population have additional support after school which prevents them having a free choice to enrichment activities?

And can you then remove the item that population uses if they don't attend the compulsory course related to it?

Sen related.

BikeRunSki Tue 01-Mar-16 17:20:02


Stompylongnose Tue 01-Mar-16 17:30:06

Do you mean if a school runs extra after school maths classes for SEN pupils but it clashes with after school football training can the school insist the child does maths and not football?

Youarentkiddingme Tue 01-Mar-16 17:40:13

Yes that's what I mean stompy - can they make it compulsory and for example if the child has a special piece of maths equipment can they then remove that if they don't attend the sessions?

Youarentkiddingme Tue 01-Mar-16 17:41:32

But it's more that the use of the equipment is necessary for the Sen and the support for it is only offered outside of school hours and labelled as compulsory.

TeenAndTween Tue 01-Mar-16 19:26:10

I have no idea.

But, I think extra support can be difficult in Secondary, as to get tailored support for one subject you often have to miss another. So I can see how doing it after school might make sense for them (even if it turns out not to work well for you/your DC).

Youarentkiddingme Tue 01-Mar-16 19:50:43

It's not that the support doesn't work timing wise - DS already stays after school that evening to do a club. The club is open to all students and DS is the only one who can do the particular skill he does in the club.

He has been told he has to attend the Sen support instead or lose his Sen aid.

But yet children without Sen can continue the club

noblegiraffe Tue 01-Mar-16 19:56:53

So essentially the school are offering equipment and support and your DS basically is saying 'nah, I want to play football instead'? (Or whatever).

If the support were 1-1 then I would ask if it could possibly be rearranged, but if not, do you want him to have support for his SEN or not?

TheHatOfDoom Tue 01-Mar-16 20:20:52

I'd be screaming disability discrimination if he meets the legal definition of disabled. But I suspect that might be a hard battle to win.

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

noblegiraffe Tue 01-Mar-16 20:48:22

Where's the discrimination? The club is discriminating against people who can't make it that evening as they have other commitments?

blaeberry Tue 01-Mar-16 21:21:01

Noble the school is saying he can't go to football because he is disabled (and therefore has to attend another session). They are also saying that unlike non-disabled children he must attend an after school session in order to be able to receive an education (for which he needs his aid). Seems clear discrimination to me.

noblegiraffe Tue 01-Mar-16 21:26:45

Or from their point of view they are offering the support but you don't want it because it's inconvenient? Presumably he'd have to miss something for the support even if it was in the school day.

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

tethersend Tue 01-Mar-16 21:48:11

They are threatening to remove a learning aid? They do realise that it's not a privilege to be revoked, right?

Are they removing glasses from other children who don't attend the club? Wheelchairs?

Shineyshoes10 Tue 01-Mar-16 21:57:52

I'd say they are on thin ice by not giving him the same opportunities as everyone else because of his disability.

What would they do if a child that needed to attend the SEN support had transport provided by the LA? Remove the learning aid?

noble it is good the school are providing support. However sometimes socialising is just as important, if not more so, for children with SEN. OPs DS could benefit greatly by attending the club.

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

NotCitrus Tue 01-Mar-16 22:16:37

Is it that the child should be using some aid but will only be allowed to do so if trained first? I guess it would depend on whether the training is really necessary and if so, whether that is the only time it can be arranged - if there are only a couple people in the country who can train the kid on that widget, and only one can travel to you only on that day, then it might be reasonable, but otherwise it doesn't sound fair.

Youarentkiddingme Tue 01-Mar-16 22:29:26

No they are saying he has attend this minimum of 6 weeks session as a compulsory thing to retain his Sen aid.

What's annoying me most is that I've been asking how they are going to monitor the effectiveness of the aid - as its replaced human support (which obviously has interaction with him) since before he started the school. It took 4 months of him attending the after school club that provides the same input for them to agree to monitor the progress - it forms part of his Sen support. He still attends this club (open to all students who use the aid for education or personal use) but now he also has to attend the other support.

I've never come across the situation where Sen support can only be outside of school hours before and can prevent you attending non Sen clubs.

There is no choice here.

I'm also cynical that I spent 8 months saying use of aid should be monitored and this materialised the day after an Ofsted inspection

Noeuf Tue 01-Mar-16 22:31:39

You've posted about this before, what answers did you get last time?

amarmai Tue 01-Mar-16 22:34:20

gov legislation makes schooling compulsory from age x to age y . It also legislates # of days in the year and hours of the school day. There is also legislation regarding identification of sens and provision for the education of those identified as needing xyz. Education is for the WHOLE child and for the sen identified espec , it is more important that they be able to enjoy the extra curricular activities that they can excel in for the sake of self confidence, status in the eyes of peers and enjoyment of a more difficult life. If a student requires item A to fulfill the math goals laid out in his program , then there is no benefit or connection to threaten to remove item A and deny this student enjoyment of a very important to him after school activity. It wd be illegal to follow thru on that threat IMO. I wd consult an edu/human rights lawyer if this actually happens.

Youarentkiddingme Tue 01-Mar-16 22:37:41

No it was other support I posted about before. That was moved to another evening and then to during day after I raised it. But that support didn't have an effect that he would lose his aid if he didn't attend.

DS has a myriad of Sen needs as well as a disability. He's always had support within school before and a tailored timetable that worked well for him. Now he's expected to go to every lesson unsupported as they are an 'inclusive school' and attend Sen support after school when other pupils are choosing clubs to attend or going home.

I'm not against having support or doing things that are needed to support him outside of school time - DS attends sessions through NAS at weekends. But I think within school he shouldn't have different opportunities due to his needs.

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

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