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New government law for 16 year olds

(38 Posts)
melrob62 Fri 07-Feb-14 22:18:29

What does everyone think of the new laws introduced which means 16 year olds finishing school this year will have to stay in some sort of education until they are 18?

Dreamgirls234 Fri 07-Feb-14 22:21:37

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

tiggytape Fri 07-Feb-14 22:33:05

They don't have to stay in education as such. They can get a job which has approved amounts of training attached to it.

But yes, basically, they have to continue learning in some form until they are 18. Which is probably essential nowadays anyway - there are very few options anymore for someone to leave school at 16, get a job and work their way up.

KatyMac Fri 07-Feb-14 22:35:36

I'm more concerned about the ones that have to stay in formal education until they get English & Maths; for some children this is prolonging the agony & won't achieve anything

wannabestressfree Fri 07-Feb-14 22:38:08

Katy they don't....
If they get a D or just miss the D they do gcse resit. If there is no chance of passing or they are particularly weak they do functional skills in the subject.

KatyMac Fri 07-Feb-14 22:42:31

Oh thank goodness - it was upsetting me. I took 3 goes to get my O level English & tbh I was near the end of my tether; if I'd had to keep on & on at it I'd have had a break down

I wish there were more realistic options for teenagers; I think I said on MN before I'd quite like them all to leave at 14 and do mind numbingly awful jobs for 4 years or so, then start them back with free education and see how they did then. I do feel that education can be wasted on teens who don't value it then when they have a a change of heart it's almost impossible to 'get back in'

KatyMac Fri 07-Feb-14 22:43:08

Of course is that had happened my daughters career path would have been completely stuffed but....

tiggytape Fri 07-Feb-14 22:45:10

I think the message has got lost a bit with many people believing 17 and 18 year olds are going to be forced to stay in school wearing blazers, studing A Levels and doing endless maths resits when in fact vocational and alternative routes outside school are equally acceptable.

In reality the changes just mean 16 and 17 year olds won't be able to opt to get a job 5 days a week that has no traning attached to it at all (and how many can do that anyway now?) and can't opt to leave school and do nothing at all either.

plum100 Fri 07-Feb-14 22:46:17

I thought the kids that leave this year just have to sty on for 1 yr - two years from school leavers next year- hve i got that wrong? X

melrob62 Fri 07-Feb-14 22:49:13

Yeah agree with you Katy, my son does not want to go to college, at the moment he doesn't really know what to he wants to do and I think spending another year at college just plodding along is not going to do him any good.

melrob62 Fri 07-Feb-14 22:51:36

Plum, I thought the same but according to info on ukgov kids who started year 11 in 2013 will have to stay in education until they are 18.

tiggytape Fri 07-Feb-14 22:54:12

I thought the kids that leave this year just have to sty on for 1 yr - two years from school leavers next year- hve i got that wrong?

Sort of. You are right about the ages but they don't have to "stay on" at school. The school leaving age isn't being raised and they won't be forced to go to 6th form or do A Levels or anything like that.
They simply have to continue in some sort of education (or formal training if they get a job). They can do this at school or at college or in approved training.

If they haven't achieved a C grade in English and maths there is also extra provision so they can retake that (or do an alternative if the GCSE C Grade would be unobtainable)

melrob62 Fri 07-Feb-14 23:01:07

tiggytape, would they be able to carry on with their education by doing home study online?

tiggytape Fri 07-Feb-14 23:06:45

The RPA (Raising Participation Age) doesn't explicitly mention that as far as I've seen. On the one hand it says:

Young people have a choice about how they continue in education or training post-16, which could be through:
• Full-time study in a school, college or with a training provider.
• Full-time work or volunteering combined with part-time education or training.
• An Apprenticeship (http://www.apprenticeships.org.uk).

but the guidance notes say:

What happens if my child doesn’t participate?
The law has changed, but there will be no action taken against any young people who don’t participate. We want to encourage your child to participate because of the benefits it will bring – this is the reason why the vast majority of 16 and 17 year-olds already choose to continue in education or training. By changing the law, we have made sure that all young people have the opportunity to access the learning option that’s right for them and improve their long-term prospects.

Your local authority is responsible for identifying and supporting 16-17 year olds who are not participating and will be working to ensure that young people are enrolled on a suitable education or training place.

tiggytape Fri 07-Feb-14 23:09:12

Actually it is probably covered unde rthe RPA myth buster:

You will still be participating as long as you are also doing part-time training which leads to an accredited qualification. Part-time training works out as about one day a week, but you might also be able to study flexibly, for example, in week-long blocks

melrob62 Fri 07-Feb-14 23:12:19

Thanks tiggytape, that sounds better and puts my mind at rest. I was really worried with the repercussions would be.

CouthyMow Fri 07-Feb-14 23:23:55

My DD has SN's, and without spending an additional 2-3 years in vocational training, would be unemployable. She's just got a place on a Catering NVQ course with SN help. We think...

If she doesn't get on this, though, I'm screwed!

(Will have no money to feed her, and her Maths skills aren't high enough to get employment anywhere yet.)

CouthyMow Fri 07-Feb-14 23:27:04

KatyMac - I actually AGREE with continuing English and Maths. If they didn't insist on it, my DD would leave school at 16, functionally innumerate IMO (heading for a 'G' grade at GCSE, with mucho additional support over the years in Maths. A G grade seems to equate to having Maths skills lower than the average 9yo...)

It is a necessity to continue with it. DD will never get a C grade in Maths - but any improvement on her current Maths skills will be SO important to her.

CouthyMow Fri 07-Feb-14 23:29:18

Current Y11's have to stay for two years. DD's course will be at least a 3 year one. (Is intended to be a 3 year course, but pace can be slowed for the individual, so may take 4 years for DD.)

At the end of it, she will have a trade, and be able to gain employment.

KatyMac Fri 07-Feb-14 23:31:40

But is GCSE Maths the best target for her? DH did a functional skills course at 55 which was much more practically based and far more use to him on a day to day level

CouthyMow Fri 07-Feb-14 23:34:04

Thing is, it IS going to be difficult for parents on IS / JSA / ESA - if the young adult (which is what they are, post 16) refuses to do any sort of training, then the parent will lose all their CTC, Child Benefit for that child, will also lose their 25% Council Tax discount, AND lose a portion of their housing benefit.

Unlike in previous years, there will be NO PROVISION for that young adult to claim JSA.

So if you have a school refuser, who refuses to continue in education or training, then you will have NO income with which to feed that young adult.

How many of you are able to literally DRAG a 16/17yo to College daily?! And stop them from being disruptive etc, so that they get themselves kicked out?!

CouthyMow Fri 07-Feb-14 23:36:59

We are debating this currently - it depends whether she can get her grade to an F before her exams. F = retake GCSE Maths, G = Functional skills, at DD's College. An F IS now a possibility, as DD has dropped another GCSE last week, is only doing 7 now, and is using the extra time to do more 1-2-1 work in Maths with an LSA, so an extra 2 hrs a week 1-2-1.

She only has 15 marks to find across the 2 Maths papers to scrape an F...

She would see that F as a MASSIVE achievement.

starballbunny Fri 07-Feb-14 23:37:01

Given how underfunded FE collages have always been and the cuts to sixth form collages I can see a lot of DCs having no where to go.

Who is actually going to check every 16-18 is actually getting the training promised.

I fear many vulnerable DC will fetch up working in very poorly paid jobs while not bothering to attend unsuitable training.

Given the choice of 1/2 a days extra wages under the counter and £5 bus fare to sit in collage I know what lots of DCs will choose.

TrampledUnderfoot Fri 07-Feb-14 23:40:13

I think some of the training will be crap and will just give some employers cheap labour.

tiggytape Fri 07-Feb-14 23:47:03

Who is actually going to check every 16-18 is actually getting the training promised.

The LAs. Although their are no penalties as such for pupils who won't take part, LA's absolutely must ensure every eligible student can have a place at college or school or in training.
Colleges are encouraged to also tell the LA about anyone who drops out early so something suitable can be found for them

The students can wriggle out of it if they really want to but the LAs can't.

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