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(302 Posts)
helenjackson2 Sun 17-Mar-13 21:10:11


exoticfruits Tue 19-Mar-13 14:54:13

It is often a complete waste of money too. I have a friend who wanted to work with horses. Her parents 'insisted' she did something sensible first-'to fall back on'. She did the something sensible and then went off to the depths of the country to work with horses, married a local farmer and has lived happily ever after with her horses-she never 'fell back' on the something. Her DS, however went to Cambridge and has a glittering academic career, so no doubt her parents are happy. The friend also had an expensive private education that she 'wasted'. She also refused to wear dresses-all in all she wasn't the DD her mother wanted-BUT why should she have been? You give birth but you have no idea what you are getting-they are yours to influence and encourage-they are not yours to plan their life, when they may not want anything remotely like you envisage.

MrsHoarder Tue 19-Mar-13 15:38:39

And I am fascinated by the way people seem to think solutions one-size-ft-all.

I'm fascinated by the level of control people are trying to exert over nearly-adult offspring to make them follow the "ideal" path of a-levels. Once they're past GCSE age its time to realise that they could legally leave home if they want and to trust in your parenting thus far in choices as much as you can. Obviously discourage dossing all day or illegal activity but if there's a productive route they want to follow they should be supported, not pressured into doing something else.

Make sure they don't close doors by all means, investigate and discuss the costs of sitting A levels as an adult should they change their minds, but ultimately its their life and their choice.

But I'm looking at this from an angle of the damage emotional pressure can do. And telling your DC that you spent the cost of a house on their education and they are wasting it is a lot of emotional pressure for a teen to handle.

exoticfruits Tue 19-Mar-13 15:48:04

* And telling your DC that you spent the cost of a house on their education and they are wasting it is a lot of emotional pressure for a teen to handle*

And nothing to do with them-it was your choice.

outtolunchagain Tue 19-Mar-13 17:29:03

This scenario has happened with two families I know . In one case the girl fled back to her day school after one week at college and in the other she didn't make it past registration,where they asked her to confirm that she had maths and English at F or above before reaching the conclusion herself that this was not the right path for someone with10 As and A*s.

One is now at a top art school , the other sits a levels this year .In both cases the parents were very supportive,they didn't cajole or force and they made it clear they would support their child's decisions . They let their children make their own decisions, and yes they were there to help them pick up the pieces .

Maybe this is just that she wants to come back to day school , perhaps a local sixth form college or day school would be a solution .

Schmedz Tue 19-Mar-13 18:07:54

My friend was Head Girl at a super selective grammar. Wanted to quit after GCSEs to go and study acting but parents insisted she did A-levels. Lots of pressure from school to go Oxbridge route. She studied a performing arts degree and is working on the West End and abroad now.

Importantly she says she thanks her parents every day for insisting she finish her A-levels. It is much harder to go back to studying after working or to combine work with studying (fees can be high for FE). She is grateful that she has the good qualifications for the future, even if she never uses them, she thinks it is good to have them under her belt. Knowing her chosen career path may potentially have a limited lifespan possibly is different to hair/beauty career potential.

Given that even graduates have problems gaining work, those 2 extra years of schooling are a short amount of time to spend to ensure you have covered all your bases.

sweetiepie1979 Tue 19-Mar-13 18:43:37

Stupid and idiotic? That's a bit harsh! Let her do it, it's her decision I'd be as supportive as you can. You sound very snobby miss Helen. Get over the money you spent on her education there was no guarantee she was going to do what you wanted her to. And get off your high horse about hairdressing I'm sure your post has managed to insult a lot of people on here. Have to stop there, I'm fuming at your post!

timeforachange12 Tue 19-Mar-13 19:30:08

HI this is Helen jackson i lost my password so i created a new name. people on this forum asked how i was affording a Public School Education for DD. The truth is I could not It was MUM AND DADS ESTATE I SAY ESTATE IT WAS A 4 BEDROOM HOUSE IN KENT BOUGHT IN RIGHT TO BUY COUNCIL HOUSE IN THE EARLY 1980s BUT BECAUSE OF HOUSE INFLATION WAS WORTH 425k. DDS Head at Primary School told me that DD was very bright and would fly though the 11+ she did she got 420 Kent test that should have been good enough place at G.S but not for Sister who said the best for DD and said lets put 200k in a bank account for DDS Education i Agreed.SO off we went to every Boarding School in the South East DD Taking the Entrance exams passing the lot we were offered academic scholarships everywhere. Sister said we wont ask for anything so did not take scholarships.So off to School went DD Years7,8,9,10 Top of the year then she came home last Summer and i thought DDs not the same but i dont know why. When DD came back from the Fe College she said to me i have met three Girls who are like me but they have not had the chances i have had. They are now friends of DD and are very nice. One day watching DD playing Lacrosse A parent came over to me and started asking me "WHAT SCHOOL DID DD COME FROM" When i said a State School She said "SHE MUST BE BRIGHT" Assuming that DD was on a full Scholarship when i told her that "WE PAY FULL FEES" SHE SAID I DID NOT KNOW WORKING PEOPLE COULD MAKE THAT MUCH" Regarding The OXBRIDGE POTENTIAL COMMENT THAT WAS NOT Me DDS HOUSEMISTRESS . DDS House Mistress Telephoned me and said it was my fault the Hair and beauty BTEC BECAUSE OF THE PEOPLE SHE KNOWS WHEN SHE COMES HOME TO ME.

PoodleChops Tue 19-Mar-13 19:30:45

cory said "My FIL thought dh was making a hopelessly stupid and romantic choice when he decided to become a field archaeologist: they ranked in those days somewhere between road menders and representatives of the hippy convoy, the job was totally insecure (still is) and extremely badly paid.

Poor FIL did everything to make his son see sense and go in for a proper job like his brother. 30 years later dh is still happily employed in archaeology and his brother has been out of work more times than I care to count. "

You made me smile a very knowing smile thanks
Funnily enough, last night I was going to cite archaeology as it's something I know about, too. I hear a lot of "minimum wage" "sweeping floors" on this thread - blah, blah blah ad nauseum. Archaeology is something you can do at degree level at UCL (albeit the Institute of Archaeology) - heck you can even do a BSC in Archaeology, note: not your common-or-garden BA wink But and here's the rub, as Cory has said, you can be really badly paid and most Field Archaeologists are on short-term contracts. The wage is barely above minimum and in fact, hairdressers after two years, earn more than a degree-toting archaeologist with a host of A* GCSE's and "A" Levels. And you still get to do what some feel are crappy tasks - every single day, like clean out the on-site portaloos and dig through ancient "shit-pits". Your chances of returning to it after having children are severely hampered as you often have to chase employment all over the country. Added to that your unit may decide to send you to a site 50 or 60 miles away, maybe more. On the wages you get, paying for childcare is crippling. But hey, you gotta degree!
BTW - archaeology is in my blood; it's my passion but an academic qualification isn't a passport to money and escaping crap tasks, in the same way as doing a vocational course doesn't consign you to low wages and a life-long career of menial tasks - both are generalisations.

Lighthousekeeping Tue 19-Mar-13 20:06:24

this post is a wind up, isn't it? It's a p take. All the typical DM references re Buy to Let houses, the implied North South divide etc. all in capital letters. Why is it important to know the sister is in Sunderland or wherever? Seriously, it has to e a joke.

BoringTheBuilder Tue 19-Mar-13 21:06:38

MORE FOOL YOU OP, if had the chance to go grammar school or have scholarship but didn't accept for pride and chose to pay full fees. If you daughter is so bright she will do well in whatever path she chooses and specially if she is doing something she is passionate about. It doesn't sound you chose a good school after all since the headmistress is so negative, intolerant and discriminates you and your dd so openly. I guess your dd is fed up with bully from her UC colleagues and don't want to be seen like them and that is why chose friendship with those other girls...

BoringTheBuilder Tue 19-Mar-13 21:32:46

And you didn't need to get another account, could just get a password reminder and keep the original nickname.

Yellowtip Tue 19-Mar-13 22:45:33

Of course it's a p take.

exoticfruits Tue 19-Mar-13 22:46:44

I should always go with my instincts in the first place and not waste time.

sweetiepie1979 Tue 19-Mar-13 22:48:15

Who asked OP? I can't see anyone who asked. Weird!

Lighthousekeeping Tue 19-Mar-13 22:55:39

It is quite funny, though.

Kez100 Wed 20-Mar-13 10:33:15

I think it's probably a wind up, given far more detail, but it does open a great debate on happiness versus money plus control of children versus good parental guidance and it is interesting to read where different people pitch the importance of each of these.

Coconutty Wed 20-Mar-13 17:47:59

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

timeforachange12 Wed 20-Mar-13 21:13:30

I only read broadsheet Newspapers,Daily Telegraph, Guardian and Sunday Times.

timeforachange12 Wed 20-Mar-13 21:17:08

Well Done Mumsnet, They still Haven"t Worked it Out on 11 Plus Forum yet.

How is this still here? Wasn't it obvious it was a wind up when the other (DD jailed) one turned up with the same features?

ilovesooty Thu 21-Mar-13 00:13:46

The discussion is interesting. The motives of the seemingly rather strange OP really don't matter: she's really a total irrelevance.

TheRealFellatio Thu 21-Mar-13 04:43:38

One day watching DD playing Lacrosse A parent came over to me and started asking me "WHAT SCHOOL DID DD COME FROM" When i said a State School She said "SHE MUST BE BRIGHT" Assuming that DD was on a full Scholarship when i told her that "WE PAY FULL FEES" SHE SAID I DID NOT KNOW WORKING PEOPLE COULD MAKE THAT MUCH" Regarding The OXBRIDGE POTENTIAL COMMENT THAT WAS NOT Me DDS HOUSEMISTRESS . DDS House Mistress Telephoned me and said it was my fault the Hair and beauty BTEC BECAUSE OF THE PEOPLE SHE KNOWS WHEN SHE COMES HOME TO ME.

Okaaaay...........Er, assuming all of the above is absolutely true, which involves taking a bit of a leap of faith, (has anyone spoken so patronisingly about 'working people' since before the first world war? hmm) I will make the following points:

1) Sometimes scholarship students from modest backgrounds do feel like a fish out of water at very top end schools. Even if no-one is directly nasty to them they can often feel that they are an object of curiosity, their accent is not the same, and whether that feeling of being patronised and treated as the poor relation is real or imagined, it will have a profound effect.

They may either adapt to blend in, and end up feeling a bit embarassed by their own parents, or they might go the opposite way and reject what they see as awful elitism, and become inverted snobs who are determined to buck the system as a way of sticking two fingers up at the school and everything it stands for. Which sounds a bit like what this girl is doing.

2) You say your daughter insists on doing the 'first' Hairdressing course for the ones who don't get sufficiently good GCSE grades to do the Level 2. Level 1 courses are designed for people who need help with functional skills in English and Maths, and who would not even cope with starting on Level 2, which only requires 2 GCSEs at D grade as it is. The level 1 'normally' requires 2 GCSEs at grade G. In other words you have to show that you did at least turn up for school at least three or four times since you were 14 and knew how to hold a biro. But the 'normally' means there is room for manoeuvre even with that criterion. Anyone who as attended school regularly and still only has the ability to scrape 2 grade G's is functionally illiterate and innumerate, quite probably has an SEN and/or is somehow socially and economically disadvantaged.

I think it highly unlikely that any decent FE college would evenallow your DD to enroll on that Level 1 course. It is simply inappropriate, and deprives another young person )who may be vulnerable and have had a difficult relationship with school) of that place. Make sure she understands that the education system has not 'let these girls down' by setting entry requirements to the Level 2 course - quite the contrary. The level 1 course is designed to help and support those kids who would otherwise drop out of any kind of education/training altogether.

She would be cutting off her nose to spite her face by insisting on doing Level 1; twiddling her thumbs while her classmates are coaxed, cajoled and supported into actually turning up, and getting to grips with the most basic functional numeracy and literacy skills, in order that they will eventually cope with Level 2. It is a totally wasted year on her part.

3) The reason your DDs housemistress is so horrified, is that as a pupil from a humble background (albeit privately educated with no bursary) she will be viewed quite favourably as an Oxbridge candidate. The school wants and needs as many pupils to go to Oxbridge as it can get. They'd hate to see one slip through the net for entirely self-serving reasons, but I will assume they have your daughter's best interests at heart as well.

TheRealFellatio Thu 21-Mar-13 04:44:07

Bilmey that was an essay and a half. Sorry.

Snog Thu 21-Mar-13 06:04:17

Let her follow her own star and be supportive

bangwhizz Thu 21-Mar-13 11:58:24

Jackanory Jackanory!

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