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Notre Dame High School for Girls

(31 Posts)
dancemom Fri 24-Feb-17 15:34:02

Did anyone see the article on the BBC today about the campaign by the Parent Council of a feeder primary to make the school co-ed?

WankersHacksandThieves Fri 24-Feb-17 16:49:21

I saw it on the website - I presume the school is running at 50% under capacity then?

Boiled7Up Fri 24-Feb-17 18:58:21

The roll is about 600 AFAIK. No idea about capacity.

I am torn. I think it is a historic school and it would be a shame for it to lose part of its identity, but then if there is a demand for spaces for Catholic boys then....

It would be a massive transition process anyway. Interesting times.

WankersHacksandThieves Fri 24-Feb-17 19:10:21

I'm not catholic, not in Glasgow and don't have girls.

I can see why parents who have mixed sex children might want them all to transition to the same High school from the primary of the same name. I don't have any issue with single sex schools per se, I'd be initially getting rid of all religion in schools so that the concept of "Catholic School" didn't exist. And that shouldn't be taken as anti catholic, i'd feel the same about any system which divided children by religion.

After that then I think the natural move might be to get rid of single sex schools however if all the children have fair access to decent education it really isn't too much of an issue.

Unless the school does have massive under capacity, I presume it would mean moving a proportion of the current girls into other mixed catchment schools to accommodate the boys from the closest primaries? Or simply starting with the next available S1 intake and not taking those girls in the first place.

I can see this not being popular with an element of those parents of girls already at the school, particularly those who like to keep their girls segregated from boys.

dancemom Fri 24-Feb-17 19:50:20

Given the large percentage of multi faith girls who attend who come from strict religious families who would be removed from the school if it became co-ed I would hope that any change to its status would be timetabled for 6years + time so their education isn't affected.

Boiled7Up Fri 24-Feb-17 20:26:10

There should be concern about where those girls would go too.

Beebeeeight Fri 24-Feb-17 20:31:52

I think every local authority should have a single sex school for parents who want that.

WankersHacksandThieves Fri 24-Feb-17 20:35:25

To be honest, I wouldn't be concerned about that in the slightest but that's just me as I don't think religious views belong anywhere near state education. If someone feels strongly enough about single sex education they are free to pay for it, otherwise they are welcome to apply to any co-educational school on a placing request or attend their catchment school.

I don't believe in pandering to religion where education is concerned, but obviously they are rightly perfectly welcome to practice their religion at home and places of worship.

I guess it comes down to whether there are more parents who want their differing sex children to attend the same school or more people who want to keep their girls segregated though. Was there not study results that indicated that girls do better in single sex and boys do better co-ed? If that's correct then I think it may well simply come down to demographics within the school population in terms of how many of the girls have younger brothers.

WankersHacksandThieves Fri 24-Feb-17 20:40:53

beebeeeight how would that work in councils that have only a few schools servicing a larger area? Presumably they would need to have one for boys and one for girls? And then one for RC children? Would the councils also have to pay for school transport to facilitate parental choice? What if you couldn't afford to pay yourself but your nearest school was a boys school/the RC school and you had a non catholic girl.

Far easier to just have schools - no religion, no sex divisions.

What about somewhere like Clackmannan that only has 3 schools?

Boiled7Up Fri 24-Feb-17 22:09:12

I can see both sides of the argument.

If denominational schooling is to continue, I'd argue that it woud be fair to look at proposals for Islamic state schools too.

ExNDPupil Fri 24-Feb-17 22:20:39

A similar issue arose for Notre Dame around 10/15 years ago and it was unsuccessful.

Notre Dame is unique being free & same sex so I would be sad to see it change. I was a pupil there years ago and loved it. I was accepted despite staying out with the immediate catchment area & not being at a feeder primary school. At the time Notre Dame out-performed many other free high schools which was the reason I applied. For others it being single-sex will be the main reason

MoreProseccoNow Fri 24-Feb-17 22:21:51

Totally agree with you wankers, I can't believe we still have denominal schools. It's so divisive. I think if parents want any sort of religion involved in education, they should send their child privately & pay for it.

I wonder how many millions are spent duplicating teaching, resources & building maintenance for Protestant & catholic schools? Surely combining school rolls is cost-effective. In an increasingly secular society, there must be a reducing demand for separate education.

dancemom Fri 24-Feb-17 22:37:51

The majority of pupils at Notre Dame are not catholic

dancemom Sat 25-Feb-17 08:35:38

Agree Boiled7up very concerning

Boiled7Up Sat 25-Feb-17 09:49:04

I think the SNP are in a bit of a sticky wicket with denomimational schooling.

Glasgow and the central belt are overwhelmingly SNP and the majority of denominational schools are there. All you ever hear is about rising rolls.

It's not the case in most catchments, that there are two schools, one denominational, one non-denom, both built for 300 and both actually at 150. It's far more likely that they're both at 300!

WankersHacksandThieves Sat 25-Feb-17 14:48:38

But if they were both non-demon then they'd still be full so I'm not exactly sure what point you were trying to make there Boiled.

I'm clearly biased, but I don't think what religion your parents happen to worship has anything to do with school and education. Parents are quite rightly free to educate their child in whatever brand of voodoo they are into and also to take them to worship that in the hundred and forty or so hours out of 168 per week when children are not in school.

Schools are there to educate children, not segregate them and feed them unsubstantiated rubbish.

Boiled7Up Sat 25-Feb-17 15:16:49

I disagree. I think a substantial percentage of parents would go private if all schools went non-denom.

I also don't think the segregation argument stands up when so many Catholic schools have such diverse populations.

WankersHacksandThieves Sat 25-Feb-17 15:21:36

If they want to go private then let them. Councils should be supplying a consistent fair education for all.

I'm aware that lots of other religious people choose catholic school over non denom but if it didn't exist then they'd either need to pay or have the same as everyone else.

Why do you think we should retain segregation in the education system.

Boiled7Up Sat 25-Feb-17 15:31:26

I think the education system should be about choice.

If choice of language (Gaelic) is acceptable, then so is choice of religion. Catholicism has had a far greater impact on the Central Belt than Gaelic!

I also think that having state religious schools is a good moderator.

WankersHacksandThieves Sat 25-Feb-17 18:33:27

We are going to have to agree to disagree as I don't think that it's possible in a country this size to offer everything that people might want in the state system by whole school. That's not to say that there shouldn't be options within schools for stuff such as gaelic provision or whatever.

I also think that having state religious schools is a good moderator. Not sure what you mean by this unless you are implying that going to a religious school makes you a better person or some other nonsense?

I think it's ok to have religious education in schools, but nothing that implies that god exists or that one religious book is better than another.

If people want those things then they can source them outside the state sector as far as I am concerned. It's a ridiculous situation to have children being bussed at some cost to the taxpayer, past a perfectly good school to go to a different school simply because of what church they attend (or more likely don't).

prettybird Sat 25-Feb-17 19:43:06

I agree with Wankers. I think the very fact that many of the pupils at "Catholic" schools are not Catholic belies the need for "choice" based on religion confused

The "Catholic" hmm primary closest to me is 80% Muslim/Sikh, yet the priest has a right to be on the Parent Council confused

Boiled7Up Sat 25-Feb-17 19:48:09

I place Gaelic provision in the same bracket as religion. Neither of them makes a difference to me, but if one is a valuable choice for parents, so is the other.

By moderation, I mean I think it is better that there is an element of state control over the curriculum.

Boiled7Up Sat 25-Feb-17 19:48:43

valid, not valuable.

WankersHacksandThieves Sat 25-Feb-17 20:11:38

Ah see what you mean about moderation. No religious schools private or otherwise is clearly the way to go.

I agree re Gaelic provision but it is at least part of our Country's heritage for some areas and at least there is evidence that it does exist in contrast to the religious premise.

However, apart from areas where Gaelic is clearly a first language then gaelic provision can be made available within the curriculum of general schools and therefore doesn't require segregation. We have a local school that provides education in a gaelic format within a normal primary so it can be done.

MygirlKeith Sat 25-Feb-17 20:18:04

Regardless of whether or not it should exist as a state school the option is there for opposite sex siblings to attend the same high school. They just send the girl to St Thomas's which I know a fair few parents of Notre Dame primary girls do anyway. Equally, why send them to the associated primary in the first place if you feel so strongly about it? There's not a lack of primary schools of both catholic and non-denom in that area.

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