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Needing to live on my own

(39 Posts)
aroomofmyown Thu 20-Jan-05 15:09:36

I am a regular poster who is feeling very disloyal writing this and have only spoken to one other person other than dh about this.

Dh and I have decided he is moving out. We are going to remain a couple but I cannot live with him anymore. He is controlling (with money) and he has lied to me in a big way & in little ways in the last year (largely money related) but I feel as if I no longer trust the man I once trusted 110% . This morning I found myself close to tears on the phone to the Student Loan co as I heard myself say to an incredulous and unsympathetic adviser "but I don't have access to any money other than child benefit if you increase my payments I am not going to be able to meet them!" The crunchpoint has come because rather than debt manage dh is continuing to deal with money his way and this includes paying credit cards before the rent! I feel like a freud; a feminist who has become a stepford wife

I am culpable here too. I do accept this. Over time I have let this happen. I am still not in a position of independence Which I hate. I work p/t but it pays for the childcare only & is really about stopping me going completely mad. (Not sure it's working) Anyway, Dh has agreed to move out (we privately rent) but it is such a huge cloud to be living under. Today I just feel like screaming or crying. I feel so sad.
Dh does not want to move out and frankly I can't bear the thought of him not being here or what it could do to our ds and dd. Because of lies I now mistrust him terribly and have become a paranoid, insecure, lunatic on occassions. Which I also hate.... who have I become, I don't recognise me? I feel crushed and out of control of my own life and feel I have no power to deal adequately with my childrens lives. Having compromised and compromised until there is nothing left to compromise (and until I feel that I am not being true to myself even) I can't live like this anymore. Meantime our lives plod on. We do all the things we usually do as a couple and a family. We have a nice time together. So we are both really, really sad, bordering on depressed (& we both feel we have failed the children and each other) & although dh has agreed his moving out is the only way to go now neither of us want to live apart and nothing is actually moving forward. (Although I know it has to happen.) I am insisting that we have relationship counselling asap and dh has agreed although he feels the money would be better spent on our going out together. I am not really sure what I am asking, just need to offload and wondered if anyone else has been in a similar situation that has worked out? Dh wants us to agree to a time when he will be moving back in but I can't atm, how can I when I am having to put so much on the line to regain some stability and control? I certainly can't until I have regained my trust and faith in him.

galaxy Thu 20-Jan-05 15:18:04

I don't really have any advice but wanted you to know someone had read this. Is it really what you want to do? Surely if money is a root cause of the problem, your dh moving out and incurring extra cost is going to compound it, not help.

I'm not an expert (we've got money problems atm) but it sounds like this is an act of desparation and not one that either of you are really certain you should be taking.

Sorry, I don't think that will have helped you but I don't really know what to suggest.

kernowcat Thu 20-Jan-05 15:19:47

I know how isolating it can be when your world is falling apart and you can see no answers so be assured that your no alone. I think the counselling idea is a must, have you spoken to your Doctor you should be able to get a referal. You need to take back control of you life but this will be difficult if he fails to understand the importance of team work as a couple.
Do you enjoy your work?
Do you have friends nearby with children, maybe you could look after each others children to enable the money youearn to used on something other than child care.
Have you applied for Child Tax credit? They help with child care cost depending on your situation and income.
I hope this helps even just a bit?

spacedonkey Thu 20-Jan-05 15:20:34

Sorry to hear about this AROMO - would it be possible to go to relate first, before taking the step of separating? I would have thought you'd both be financially worse off in separate homes. On the other hand, from what you have said it sounds like you do need some time of your own to regain some strength in yourself. I think you are being very brave and really hope it all works out well for you X

spook Thu 20-Jan-05 15:22:28

Hello honey. Your post made me so sad but the very fact that your getting it down and asking for advice is a HUGE step in the right direction.
You have both decided that the only way forward now is for him to move out. OK-well done. Thats Stap One. It's not permamnent,you're not splitting up. You obviously need some space and room to breath and look at things from a distance.
Use this time to do just that. Baby steps OK?
Keep talking,keep seeing him and make sure he remains hugely involved in the childrens lives too. And never lose sight of the fact that you want to make it work so much you are going to get some counselling. A very very good move and worth every penny I'm sure.
He needs to know why you have lost your trust and respect for him and what is to be done to earn it back.
I'm fairly sure that is a long waffle but your post really touched me.
Good luck honey-remember-tomorrow is another day and you can get through anything.I did and you all will
((((((((((((big hugs)))))))))))

secur Thu 20-Jan-05 15:24:51

Message withdrawn

aroomofmyown Thu 20-Jan-05 15:43:00

Galaxy, you are so right, this is definitely an act of desperation but I am at the stage where although I don't want to do it I know it is now my only option.

kernowcat, we are in receipt of tax credits but are not entitled to childcare element. You ask if I like my job... I love my job but the chance of a full time position coming up in this area is highly unlikely. I've been endeavouring to start my own business for a long time at the same time as working p/t but it never really gets going because of lack of support from dh. I do feel that if I was on my own I would be able to pursue this and make it work. Which is an odd position to be in.
Spacedonkey, to be honest the money situationis at crisis point and if dh refuses to do what needs to be done we will be heading for eviction in 8 weeks Relate have a waiting list so I've been looking into private counselling so we can start asap.
Spook, thanks for such a positive post What you've written is how I feel when I am feeling positive about it
Secur, dh will not open a joint account and he certainly wouldn't hand everything over to me. Which is why we are now at the last resort stage

Thank you all for your thoughts. You've all made me feel a little better just having other peoples thoughts helps. Thanks.

secur Thu 20-Jan-05 15:45:52

Message withdrawn

aroomofmyown Thu 20-Jan-05 17:04:03

Thanks secur.

To be honest I am very up and down about it my emotions range from anger to despair to sadness to relief to a certain level of positivity (although the positivity doesn't ever last long) and I know that my disappointment with dh for not being prepared to do what it takes to keep us all together is great. I think I have given in for a quite life, the kids sake, whatever dh thought that is what I would do this time I have done evening and weekend work to increase our income but it has never worked out partly because I've been doing jobs I loathe an dpartly because dh's support has been lacking. I did have what was the start of successful self employment for a year but dh didn't didn't think the effort I put in was worth the monetary rewards. I have also turned down one offer of full time employment & one offer of part time employment because dh has not felt able to compromise his job in any way so even if we both work fulltime my employment has to be based around the fact that I am the one taking the responsibility for the children. Writing the above has made me very cross with myself for allowing this to happen. When we met I was a fulltime working mother who'd just completed a part time post grad course. Now I feel virtually unemployable!

aroomofmyown Thu 20-Jan-05 17:07:55

Am wondering if dh has forced me into making this decision because he doesn't want to be the one to do it but separation is ultimately what he wants.
(Not that he is saying that. He is saying that he doen't want to move out but accepts that as I feel as I do that is how it has to be.) I am feeling all wobbly again

spacedonkey Thu 20-Jan-05 17:09:05

Not surprised you're feeling wobbly, it's a big decision to make It does sound like he has been totally unreasonable tbh. Do you think he might be willing to change?

aroomofmyown Thu 20-Jan-05 17:15:26

spacedonkey, that is a very good question and possibly the crux of everything. I don't suppose I think he is willing to change at the moment which is why I have decided he has to move out. As I have said he is not willing to debt manage although it would keep us all under the same roof. However, he has been making a huge effort in the last few months in various ways and he has agreed that we go to counselling so that he can learn not to be so "pig headed" and "selfish" (his words).

spacedonkey Thu 20-Jan-05 17:17:45

His words do seem quite accurate! But it's really good that he is willing to see a counsellor, I suppose that in itself indicates a willingness to change. It does sound like you're at the end of your tether with the situation and could do with some breathing space for yourself, so bearing that in mind I think you're doing the right thing

aroomofmyown Thu 20-Jan-05 17:21:57

Thanks Spacedonkey

aroomofmyown Fri 21-Jan-05 08:24:38

I am feeling completely shattered this morning after a third night with very little sleep worrying about everything. Dh told me last night that we need to talk at the weekend and sort out what is happening as we can't afford to separate... but we can't afford to stay together!!
And this is not his decision. Obviously I want him to want us to be living under the same roof IYKWIM but not in the present circumstances!
have to go into work this morning, must get a move on, any suggestions on how to stay strong?
Thank goodness for mn as a place to rant

galaxy Fri 21-Jan-05 08:39:17

Really sorry this is causing you so much stress. No advice I'm afraid but just sending good thoughts your way.

tribpot Fri 21-Jan-05 08:52:30

Aroomofmyown, I think you need to spend today getting a handle on your financial situation if you can - a lot to achieve in a single day I will admit! Then you and dh will be able to talk factually about whether you can afford to have him move out at this stage rather than the situation at the moment, where it seems that dh 'controls' a large aspect of your relationship because he controls the finances.

See if you can work out your incomings and outgoings in detail, along with your debts and their APRs - have a look this Statement of Affairs Calculator to get an idea.

Looking at your numbers will tell you if there is enough surplus to pay for a second flat. If there is - presto, his argument falls away. If there isn't - well, you need to address that between the two of you. If you feel that it is vital to the future health of your relationship to get some breathing space (which it sounds like it is) then you can jointly agree how that's to be funded.

At a minimum, having an overview of the finances gives you a measure of control back. If he's going to move out, you will need this anyway to keep the house running. If he's correct that you really cannot afford a trial separation perhaps you can agree a shorter-term measure, like him staying with friends for a week to give you some immediate head space.

aroomofmyown Fri 21-Jan-05 15:05:21

Tribpot & galaxy, thanks for your kind words.
Tribpot, to be honest I have done an income and expenditure sheet and I know we can't afford for him to move out. However, as he is not prepared to debt manage we can't afford to stay together either as it will mean we will end up evicted because for some bizarre, crazy reason dh seems to think the best thing to do, whilst I look for more employment in order to increase our income, is not to pay the rent but to pay credit cards!!!
I can't trust him any longer to do the right thing It's not ideal but the plan is that he stays with a friend until I am in a position to support myself and the children more. Which, I have to say, will be easier to achieve without him being here. Furthermore, and I know it sounds selfish, I don't want him here just because its too much hassle to sort anything else out. I want him here because this is what we both want and we have regained some equilibrium in our relationship. I feel sick thinking about this as I have a feeling it is going to result in my having to say we are over

aroomofmyown Sun 23-Jan-05 09:48:02

Dh has told me how hurt he is that I have said I can't live with him anymore. He does seem distraught We are just going around and around in endless circles and constantly coming up against a brick wall. Feel so very sad
but have no idea what to do and inaction is just compounding the situation.

galaxy Sun 23-Jan-05 09:51:27

I can imagine he's feeling hurt but what has he suggested he can do to help you overcome your problems? It's about him making changes and not just you.

aroomofmyown Sun 23-Jan-05 09:57:05

He is coming up with reluctant compromises. i.e partly debt manage for a period of time. I think what he is most shocked by is the fact that the financial situation has become (almost) secondary.

tribpot Sun 23-Jan-05 09:58:59

It's awful you're in limbo waiting for the counselling to start - is there any way of moving that up?

In terms of your previous posts, if I had to guess why dh wants to pay the credit cards and not the rent it's because he's thinking of his credit rating - late payments on cards will start showing up immediately whilst rent arrears won't appear (I think) until you end up with a county court judgement demanding the dosh. Could you and he agree to talk to \{\Payplan}? Obviously they're not there to resolve conflicts between the two of you but if you could get into a debt management programme with your interest frozen and reasonable repayments, there should be enough money for both rent and credit card repayments. It will involve damaging his credit rating though - but most people think that's a good thing as it means they are less able to obtain credit (read: debt) in the future!

I think on an emotional level I would avoid trying to do anything definitive whilst you're waiting for counselling start. Yes, you're in a 'holding pattern' which is difficult for you both, but try to hang in there for now.

weightwatchingwaterwitch Sun 23-Jan-05 10:00:57

It's a complete no brainer though isn't it, aroomofmyown, paying the rent has to come before paying debt, why can't he see that? Can you get anyone from outside to talk to him about that? It's just so obvious that without somewhere to live you can't function, it's so basis. I can't imagine why he can't grasp this. You could always come to compromises with cc companies, not necessarily so with landlords. Sorry, I know this isn't much help. What do you think is at the root of his view on this? It's SO bizarre. Is he ashamed of debt? Is someone else influencing him (parents or something?) Sorry, don't know what else to suggest but I do think you sound like the sensible one here and I do think he has to let you deal with the financial situation. Not sure what's to be gained by his moving out tbh, but will read thread again and see if I've missed somethnig.

aroomofmyown Sun 23-Jan-05 10:02:20

Tribpot, thanks for the link, I will look that up Agree we need to get counselling asap & am doing something about that too.

weightwatchingwaterwitch Sun 23-Jan-05 10:07:50

No, the money wouldn't be better spent on going on together imo since you'd only be in the same situation. You need a third party so counselling is a much better use of any cash I think. I think relate only charge what you can afford so it might not be as much as you think. Why won't he open a joint ac? This is all about control isn't it. Hmm. And WHY won't he accept equal responsibility for the children. In fact equal responsibility is completely the issue here isn't it, sorry, hadn't read your other posts when I posted first. Have you asked him how he would feel if it were the other way around, if you were working, he was p/t and you wouldn't let him have any say in joint finances? Sorry I can't be more helpful, it does sound to me to be about control and inequality and I'd be spitting mad in your position too and would also consider drastic action. Wish I could be more helpful.

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