Feeling trapped

[Libby65]

I don't know that anyone can help me but I just need to get it out. I don't love my husband anymore. Problem is, I have a child with him whom I adore, and I love that child more than anything else in the world.

DH travels quite regularly, and I am finding that I look forward to when he goes away - I don't even miss him when he's gone and to be quite honest, I feel a bit disappointed when it's time for him to come home. I don't feel any sexual attraction anymore, it's like I just see him as a friend and that's it. All I can put this down to is that over the long course of our relationship, I've had many ups and downs with him, and the downs have been so severe for me that I think I have slowly lost my feelings for him. Strangely enough, he seems to think everything is ok and still has feelings for me. I think another problem is that whenever I've told him that I'm unhappy about something, and would like things to change, I see an improvement for a little while but then he just goes back to the way he was. He also has quite a bit of baggage from his first marriage which has caused a lot of problems too. I just know I would probably be happier living on my own right now.

If I consider my religious beliefs in this situation, I feel that I am bound to him by marriage and that I have an obligation be with him because he is my husband and the father of my child. In other words, make the best of the situation. But I feel like I have nothing left to give and I just wonder how long it can go on like this. I truly don't want my child to go through a marriage break-up and I don't know if my feelings in this matter can be salvaged. I sometimes wish I didn't have my child because he is just the innocent third party who didn't ask for any of these problems.

Thank you for listening.

[WideWebWitch]

libby65 I'm about to go to bed but have some thoughts quickly and may post more tomorrow if I get time. Is there anything salvagable from your marriage do you think? If he changed certain things or you went to counselling and talked about it, might it help? I'm separated and it is possible to be happy after a marriage break up I think. I am now anyway and so is my ex and our ds. I do think it's possible for children to be unscathed if handled well. Sorry you're having a hard time. I'm sure you'll get some good advice here. Welcome.

[WideWebWitch]

libby65, hi again. You say you don't love your husband any more and it sounds as if some (all?) of this is as a result of his behaviour. If the behaviour permanently changed and you could sort out the issues (including those from his first marriage) might your feelings change? If there are a lot of things wrong with your relationship it's not surprising you don't feel any sexual desire for him. If you really are on the verge of leaving him then it might be worth trying to tell him how you're feeling first to see if he thinks it could be resolved. You say he usually does change when you've talked about it so he seems willing. It's a shame though that he always reverts back to doing whatever it is that makes you unhappy. You don't say what it is he does though so only you can know whether change is feasible.

On the other hand if you are sure you have reached the end of the road then I would say, again, that it is possible to be happy and raise happy children having left a marriage. Many people do it and I don't believe in staying together for the sake of the children on the whole. I think parents deserve happiness too and that happy parents make better parents. Children do usually have an idea that things are wrong in a bad relationship too. Anyway, good luck whatever you decide.

[Libby65]

www and sobernow, thank you for your comments. It really is a shame because when we first met, I was really in love with him but after a while we started experiencing one problem after another. He is very career-oriented and has to be pushed into giving our relationship the kind of dedication he gives to his job. Even when we go on holidays, he is constantly on the phone and is always preoccupied with work matters. It drives me crazy as we can't really enjoy ourselves and I don't know why we even bother trying to get away. I also take most of the responsibility for my ds, while dh always sleeps in (I never do) and doesn't really do anything towards caring for ds. He doesn't take any initiative at all in helping me, I constantly have to ask if I want something done. Guess this sounds familiar to some people?

Also over the many years we have been together, we have paid child support and school fees for his two previous children, and a few years ago we took them on an overseas holiday with us, even though it cost us thousands. Then when I finally dared to fall pregnant after years of being married to him, he was furious and made my pregnancy hell. He even stopped telling me he loved me and I had PND for about 9 months after the birth of ds. He has since admitted his behaviour was bad during that time, but I feel that the damage has been done. Basically he can be very self centred at times, and won't do something unless it suits him. He's also capable of being very caring but I guess the bad times have had more impact on me than the good.

I really don't feel right leaving, I feel that I have to be committed to him and to keeping my family together, but I wish I felt more towards him than I do. Even if things changed drastically now, I don't think I can ever feel the way I did in the beginning. I think I've probably allowed him to treat our relationship a certain way and now I'm the one that is paying for it! Will have to give this more thought... sorry it's long.

[mckenzie]

hi Libby65, so very sorry to hear what you are going through. I was in a similar situation some years ago and was given a book called 'Too good to leave, too bad to stay'. Some of it I found rather heavy but the gist is that the relationship shouldn't just drift along, it's either worth saving or it isn't (your local library might have a copy. You might find it useless but it helped me. My then partner and I embarked on some counselling with Relate as well and this really worked for us. I think even if you go on your own it can be helpful.
I wish I could say something more profound to help you Libby65 but I can't. I'm sorry. Keep posting here if it helps.

[Clarinet60]

mckenzie, this book sounds good. can you manage to post ant gems from it?
libby, I'm sorry for what you are going through, it sounds bad. I'm in a similar situation, although we are going through a better phase at the moment.

[Rhubarb]

Could you post the author of that book McKenzie? I'd like to get it.

Libby, I feel trapped too, but for different reasons. I love my dh and dd dearly, but she was a shock to us and I have not gotten used to my roles in life yet. I find that I am a full-time mum/housewife/home-owner all of a sudden. I long to break free sometimes, I hate being labelled and put into a corner, and I feel that is what is happening. Husband goes to work, mum looks after kid, does housework, husband comes back, has tea and does DIY, dd goes to bed and husband falls asleep watching telly.

My escape was to take on other roles. So I became a student, a volunteer, a website builder, but I took on too much and recently broke down with it all. I have had to ask for outside help. I just feel that I am losing my own identity. I'm sorry I don't have any answers for you, only empathy.

[tigermoth]

libby, no words of wisdom, but hope you find a way out of your dead end.

Rhubarb, sorry to hear things haven't been too good for you recently. You must have been so busy with all those activities - what a lot of energy you must have with this get up and go attitude, I can't imagine you feeling very trapped for long. I hope this set back is temporary and you feel happier soon.

[mckenzie]

'Too good to leave, Too bad to stay' is written by Mira Kirshenbaum. It has Michael Joseph, London on the inside cover and spine but it says that it's published by the Penguin Group.

The text on the back reads..

'Your relationship is either too good to leave or too bad to stay in. But it can't be both.'
If you've picked up this book the chances are you're trying to make a decision about where your particular realtionship is going at the moment. Help is at hand. Drawing on her years of experience as a counsellor, psychotherapist Mira Kirshenbaum presents you with a series of straightforward questions that will help you discover what is precious and lasting in your relationship and what is hurtful and destructive.

All you need to do is answer the questions truthfully and allow yourself to be guided by the answers. Waste no more time in ambivalence - make a well-informed, carefully considered choice with the help of this invaluable book.'

As I mentioned in my other posting, some of it was a tad too heavy for me but I still found it very very helpful. If you can't get hold of a copy for some reason, let me know and you can borrow my mine.

[Clarinet60]

Rhubarb, I don't want to pry, but I have also felt close to the edge since ds2 was born in May. I have tentatively enquired about outside help, but haven't got very far. Has it been a success, and what form does it take? I'll understand if you don't want to say.
Best wishes too, by the way.

[Caroline5]

Libby, your situation sounds so familiar to me. Over the years, I've gradually grown less in love with dh, mainly as all the bad times have just worn me down. He seems to conveniently forget them, but they have just ground me down. He's been an increasingly heavy drinker since we married, suffers badly from stress and is moody. At times, he becomes aggessive and even violent (there, I've admitted it). At other times, he is caring, helpful and considerate and gets on especially well with dd1.

I too am torn over the effect leaving would have on dds and feel a similar "moral" commitment to my marriage. I feel disloyal even writing this message. Tbh, I don't really want to leave and face all the insecurity and instability, but at the bad times, I know that my dds may suffer if we stay.

Sorry Libby, no answers - let us know how you get on.

[tigermoth]

these messages are so moving - that feeling of losing yourself I know too well.

can I just say this: Excuse me if I'm wrong, but most of you have very young children. IME toddlers and their demands can put a big strain on your relationship with your dp and the dependence of toddlers can wear you down no end, even when they are being at their sweetest. For a few years there is just so much you cannot do, unless you can get some time alone, and spontineaity goes out the window. I felt much more 'me' again once my son was older and this helped me get on better with my dh, too.

I think my feelings of being trapped stemmed more from my children than from my husband, but because I loved them so much, I didn't want to admit I wasn't always the great mother I wanted to be.

[Lil]

I sympathise with the feelings on this thread and guess that we've all been there, to varying degrees. The only answer I can suggest is to reinforce the need to get some of your life back. The single YOU (insert maiden name!)that has vanished under the weight of pre-school children and unhelpful fathers. You have to do something for yourself. I found going back to work the soln, even tho' I didn't want to admit it, as it means I failed as Earth mother. But whatever you choose as long as it gives you an excuse to standup and force husband and child to recognise you are not just a mum/wife/dogsbody - its worth trying.

[Rhubarb]

Droile - I don't mind talking about it if it helps someone else. I contacted Home Start who are going to send a volunteer to me every week, just someone to talk to as I tend to bottle everything up. My HV has also been alerted and she is popping in every now and then. Also my GP surgery does counselling sessions so I'm on the waiting list for that.

Admitting that you need outside help is often the hardest thing to do. Especially for me as I was/am in the position of helping others, I have a website that deals with ante/post natal depression and I volunteer for a local charity. I also help out at a school, doing one-to-one support for a little boy with learning difficulties. But it's these kinds of roles that lead to me breaking down. I think I took them all on to reassert my own identity, but I couldn't juggle them all and keep all the different roles going at once, something had to give eventually. I won't stop doing what I am doing, but I do need to find out who I am in a sense and where I am going. I'm hoping the counselling will help with that. I also need to learn acceptance. I tend to fight against things, instead of making the most of them. A kind of rage against the machine if you like. But very often it's my family who bear the brunt of my rage, so it's not very productive.

I hope you can find your own answers soon. Do you have support at home? If you want to email me, please ask netmums for my email. Good luck.

[Clarinet60]

Thanks rhubarb, I might do that. I have no help and no family and a DH that works 500 hours a week and I work p/t myself. So I'm in a bit of a way with myself.
Thanks for the contact.

[aloha]

Caroline, I'm concerned about you. I honestly don't think you can stay with a violent spouse, especially with a daughter. She will be aware of what is happening, eventually. Violence is not acceptable - ever. You are worth much more. Nobody should tolerate violence. Please see a solicitor. You can get out of this with your home in your name and an income. Please don't be too afraid to leave. The younger and stronger you are when you go, the better. Your husband's behaviour is wrong, bad and unforgivable. He may be a great father (though a great father does not behave like this to his child's mother) but he's a truly terribly partner and as he's not your father, I urge you to get out of this situation before anything even worse happens.

[aloha]

BTW, to all those who fear the effect of a breakup on their kids, my parents had a lot of angry conflict, and I wish and wish my mother had gone solo much earlier. Like you she though that she was duty bound to stick by her marriage vows and keepthe family together etc etc, but honestly, living with a calm, happy, loving single parent would have been utter bliss by comparison to my family life as it was.

[Clarinet60]

I would second aloha's point (tho' have no personal experience as a child). I don't think there is any way forward when a partner is violent. I'm so sorry, caroline, this must be hell for you.

[willow2]

Caroline5 - I have been in your daughter's shoes. If your husband is violent you need to either get professional help - both individually and as a couple - or seriously consider leaving. To be honest I witnessed my stepfather being nice as pie while promising my mother that he would "never do it again" so many times that I stopped believing him long before she had the courage to. Consequently I feel that a "truly reformed" violent man is the rare exception and not the norm. If ever history were to repeat itself my response would be to pack my bags and go - and even more so now that I have a child. Kids don't miss a trick. If your only reason for staying is your dds then I would really encourage you to look at the alternatives. Better to have a healthy relationship with your father every other weekend or so than have your image of him destroyed by living with him 24/7 in a violent home.
Sorry to be somewhat blunt - hope my comments help in some way.

[Marina]

I've been very tied up at work lately and had little chance to peruse Mumsnet. I just wanted to say how sorry I was to read some of these moving posts here...and echo Aloha's, Droile's and Willow's advice to you, Caroline, about thinking very hard what to do next. I know that on top of what most of us face as parents you have dd2's developmental delay to consider, but you have a right not to face violence in your own home.
Rhubarb, I'm pleased to hear that you've got some help at the moment and I really hope things improve for you soon - and that Droile manages to find some similar support locally. And Libby too...and Sobernow.
There's a quote by someone, cannot remember exact words, along the lines of "Why do so many fantastic women, marry such hopeless men?" What is it with these guys...they should be on their knees thanking God that a sensible woman was prepared to give them house room.

[Caroline5]

Sorry Libby, seem to have partly hijacked your thread. Thanks for your frank comments (I'd rather it was that way, and so much easier on the internet). Haven't got time to respond properly now (teatime etc), will post again later.

[Caroline5]

In response to your kind comments, I suppose I don't feel things have reached a critical enough stage to jack it all in (yet). I suppose that would be if the violent incidents became more frequent or began to really affect dd1 (dd2 is 19 months with learning difficulties, I don't think she really is aware of any of this). So far in our marriage (eight years), there have been about five "serious" incidents (by which I mean, leaving with me bruises or once a bleeding nose). I know this sounds horrendous, and it is at the time, but dh is such a Jekyll and Hyde character. Somehow I have gone along with the fact that 90% of the time, I have the nice, considerate, sober dh, with 10% of the time a drunken bully, who is to be avoided at all costs.
I suppose I'm hoping that if he stopped drinking, the rest would cure itself?? (I hear you laugh cynically...)

As I'm a SAHM, leaving would be an enormous issue, involving finding a job, somewhere to live, finding and affording child care - so far the total upheaval to dds just hasn't seemed worth it, especially as they have not really witnessed much of the "bad" dh.

I know you all think I'm just kidding myself and probably true, but I feel I'm making a pragmatic decision to wait and see. If things don't improve, then I can get a job, dd1 will soon start school etc, moving on would become easier.

Sorry, don't really want to justify myself much more, I know I have to do what's best for my dds, and this is always in my mind. Sorry Libby, this is not my thread, but your post really did sound very familiar. Hope some of this discussion has been helpful.

[aloha]

Caroline5, I'm glad you haven't felt offended. You sound like a lovely person. However, I want to clarify my post. If you were to divorce, you wouldn't have to 'leave' in the physical sense - I just used the term to mean leaving the relationship. You can quite easily take out an injunction against him and you would be able to stay in the house with your children and HE would have to find somewhere else to live. He would also have to maintain you and the children. I'm not pretending it would be easy, but I can't see this man changing. He will, I am sure, hurt you again. From my experience, children don't thrive in an atmosphere of fear and intimidation. They may copy the behaviour or seek it out in relationships in adult life. I don't want to sound like another bully in your life, but I urge you to quietly see a lawyer to find out exactly what you are entitled to and how to get it. You don't have to act on it immediately or even at all, but if you have everything in place and you know your rights, it might give you strength. Believe me, he does not have the right to hurt you. You do not 'deserve' to be hurt. You have the right to get him out of your home and your life. In the meatime, as well as seeing a solicitor, have you suggested counselling to him? What does he say? Also alcoholics anonymous - would he consider this? Does he realise that if he doesn't change he will lose his home, his wife and his children? I think you may need to tell him this before he will even consider changing in any way. After all, right now, why should he change - he's go it all his own way?