Stuck without proof

[comfortablynumb1]

I would be grateful for any advice.

Been with my husband 22 years.
We have two children in their teens.

Over the past 22 years I’m not aware of any cheating but I’ve caught him a few times messaging other women.

Once in the early 2000’s he was on a pen pal site and struck up a friendship with a woman up north.

Messages back and forth about each other then he was making arrangements to go and stay there. Of course when I found the emails I immediately left and took my baby with me.

I was pressured to take him back he didn’t mean any of the messages he wasn’t going to actually do etc etc

The next time I found messages were emails to female work colleagues talking about nothing really but nothing similar to male work colleagues.

Then he added someone on Twitter she started messaging her seemingly very innocent like saying she was pretty but not making solid plans to meet but equally no mention of a wife and kids. He said that the messages are fantasy, he would never cheat, he was lonely and I was being cold.

God I’m such a mug writing this out but honestly if I had found concrete proof of any wrongdoing I could show him and have strength to leave and stay away.

Fast forward to now, he passed out one evening after too many beers a few weeks ago and I had a quick look at his phone.

New messages to two women in the office. Again seemingly innocent.
He had filmed a video of the empty office and sent it to them and said something along the lines of feeling like nothing will go back to normal for a long time.
Then him and one of the women I’ll call J started a private conversation about how their kids are coping etc. no mention of me being furloughed and at home full time with the children or any mention of her husband.

The other afternoon when he got home from work to go for lunch with me for the first time in months.

I saw him engrossed on his phone and I said ‘texting your girlfriend?’ He just laughed and said ‘you’re mad’ so I asked what her initials were and straight away he said J.

I was gobsmacked that it came out so easily. So I said her full name to him and the colour drained out of his face and he started backtracking. Said I was ruining our afternoon etc.

Last night he went to bed early and left his phone in the drawer in the kitchen like he usually does but came back down and actually hid his phone. It was nowhere to be found.

Again all I know is he has been emailing her. There is no flirting from what I can see but it’s not right is it? I don’t trust him. I’m not even 40 yet, I want out of this. I just know without actual proof of cheating it’s easy being manipulated into thinking it’s innocent.

Our son absolutely adores him and I know will be broken by us splitting up especially if I don't have proof of why I don't want to do this anymore. I feel trapped.

[NotSuchASmugMarriedNow1]

You don't need proof. If you dont want to be married to him anymore you can just end the relationship.

Don't tear yourself apart trying to get evidence. You know in your heart this relationship is over.

[Windmillwhirl]

It looks like he has been deceiving you for tears. Sounds like sneaking around is what he does.

The trust is gone so what are you going to do?

[Ging7878]

What he's done is enough already. He's completely disrespecting you by messaging other women, saying they look pretty etc. Once your at the stage of checking phones as soon as they are asleep or having to hunt round for it, you know in your gut that it's not right.

[category12]

You don't need proof. You don't need a big dramatic reason to break up the relationship. You're unhappy and you don't trust your husband. It's an unhealthy dynamic between you where you're policing and snooping, and he's gaslighting and having inappropriate relationships with other women. Those reasons are enough.

Your son won't be "broken" by a split if it's managed well. He can still spend lots of time with his dad. You'll both still be his parents.

Surely it would be far worse for your son to have his dad revealed as a faithless schmuck?

[Aquamarine1029]

After all these years of his deceptive behaviour, I don't understand what more you need to know honestly. You don't trust him, nor should you. Is this what you want for the next 20 years?

[user135664323455]

You don't need proof.

And even if you had it he would deny and undermine it, which would start a cycle of needing more and more proof of an ever higher standard.

Meanwhile you stay and continue being mistreated.

Your son won't be "broken" by the relationship ending. He will have a temporary emotional response and then adjust.

What you need is to decide how life needs to be and take the steps within your control to change what needs changing.

[ilikemethewayiam]

Why do you need proof of anything? Why do you feel you need a reason to leave him? You can leave him just because you want to. Just do it.

[booboo24]

I can see why you're struggling. The ones arranging to meet are more cut and dried and I'd have left then, but the ones to his colleagues seem normal to me, and they wouldn't bother me in the slightest....or is it that you think he's leading up to more woth J?

[iano]

I agree with Booboo. BUT you can end a relationship for whatever reason you want. If him texting his colleagues makes you uncomfortable and you no longer trust him then you must leave for your own sake.
Your teenage son will be fine.
Be happy OP. Life's too short for checking phones and driving yourself mad.

[Bluntness100]

I’m also not sure why you are so focused on proof.

If you’re not happily married and don’t trust him then end it. You don’t need proof he cheated as some form of justification to do so. Simply being unhappy is justification in itself.