This guy is totally unsuitable, right?

[Jonas657]

Had a long phone call with my best friend of 25 years this evening. I just do not know how to handle this or what to say to her but I feel I have to say something.

Bf met a man who she briefly knew online. He's been seperated from his ex wife for around 5 years. The reason for their separation is that he cheated on her with a prostitute and was then charged with raping the prostitute. This went to court and he wasn't convicted. She believes him 100% that he is not guilty. Between the split from the ex wife and the rape trial he meets another woman and gets her pregnant. He also develops a cocaine addiction which he is still battling with and was also made bankrupt.

I asked her what it was about him that she found so attractive and she said he's funny, handsome and knows deep down that he's a good guy and deserves to be happy. I'm honestly aghast. One of these things about him would have me running for the hills never mind all of them. She has children and genuinely seems smitten by him. How do I deal with this, I just cannot see how this is going to end happily and am so worried for her. Or am I being too judgemental?

[Blondebakingmumma]

Sounds like she has made up her mind to date this guy, however many flaws he has.

I don’t think you trying to convince her otherwise will be constructive. Just be there for her when she needs you in the future

[Sunnytimesahead]

I agree with @Blondebakingmumma. I don't think she will take on board any advice you give and she might distance herself from you. I suggest you be there for her if she needs you.
It's lovely that you care so much about your friend but you are not responsible for her decisions no matter how illogical they seem.

[Saltystraw]

It baffles me that women with children can make such bad decisions.Fair enough if it’s only you being affected but When their are kids involved you need to think about role models.

[SpanielRadcliffe]

I asked her what it was about him that she found so attractive and she said he's funny, handsome and knows deep down that he's a good guy and deserves to be happy.

"Deserves to be happy" is telling to me. The time, attention, energy, and care of women is not a public resource for society (or individual men) to tap into at will. But if she really likes this guy, she's likely to stick with him until she can't anymore. I think you've done the best you can; you might just have to let her make her own mistakes and learn from them. There's a pattern that often plays out with women in unhappy and/or unwise relationships: they will complain about the guy and ask for support, but won't heed advice to end the relationship. It's a time trap - be prepared to shut her down if she goes ahead with this relationship and complains about him to you.

[Jonas657]

I totally agree that she's probably made her mind up and nothing i say will change that. And yes I do care about her a lot and don't want to see her get hurt.

She's not an unintelligent woman so I don't know what her thinking is behind this. The rape allegation thing doesn't sit right with me at all. I know not all men in court are guilty however I know very very few cases actually get to court. He wasn't even found not guilty, it was not provan (scottish law)

[PicsInRed]

He wasn't even found not guilty, it was not provan (scottish law)

Given how hopeless rape trials are for even women society "approves" of, can you imagine how utterly horrific it must have been for a prostitute to pursue that? Yeah, anyone can lie, but I think it is hightly, highly unlikely she was lying and his conduct was likely to have been particularly egregious. Apparently the jury thought so to, as they gave the victim a "not proven" verdict, rather than not guilty. They effectively said that on the balance of the evidence, it may well have been rape, but not beyond a reasonable doubt.

Never let him around your own kids - even supervised. It causes kids to then see such a man as "safe" and gives him an "in" under other circumstances e.g if he sees them walking in the street.

Do you know the kids' dad?

[Jonas657]

Yes I know of the kids dad however he is a deeply unpleasant man and I would worry for her safety. I think it would be the ultimate betrayal if I told him of all this, she would never come to me for help in the future if I said anything to him. I would never allow the new man to be around my own children. That's another point I missed out, he has to be supervised to see his own children because he's failed a couple of drug tests. The whole thing is such a mess and the more I write the more fearful I am for her.

[IM0GEN]

Well as long as she keeps his man away from her children then it’s up to her.

I think you know that he’s violent and dangerous, don’t you OP? his story about the prostitute is nonsense BTW. Women who are prostituted don’t go to the police because they are raped, they are raped every day in their job.

It must have been an incredibly violent assault with a great deal of forensic evidence for her even to go to the police, let alone for the procurator fiscal to take it to court.

Presumably shes read reports of the court case? Or have you?

I hope there’s another family member to look after her kids, if the worst happens, as her ex doesn't sound very suitable.

[ginghamtablecloths]

Oh dear, so her ex is a terrible man too. Stating the obvious but she has a history of bad choices in the man department. She may well be intelligent but her behaviour isn't too clever is it? Plainly Mr Bad Boy is more exciting than Mr Nice. I suppose this ghastly individual is actually a step up from her ex - which isn't saying much. This does not bode well for her or her children.
It may not make any difference sadly, but you must talk tough to her. Tell her she's making another big mistake but you'll be there to pick up the pieces if necessary - and it will be necessary.

[Jonas657]

I haven't read any reports, she just told me all this during a catch up phone call last night. I don't think she has read anything either, she's just going by what he's told her. Even without the rape charge he still went to a prostitute behind his exwifes back when they had a small child, that alone to me is grim enough. Out of all the bloody men in the world she's fallen for this one! Also I know that people tend to just tell the bare bones of a story, what else hasn't he told her about. Could she be lulled into a weird false sense of security because he's been so 'open and honest' with her by revealing all this? I just don't know want to say to her, I know that people can change but this is a LOT of skeletons, I'm so fearful of her getting hurt but she's a big girl and I guess she has to made her own mistakes. But there's mistakes and then there's knowingly starting a relationship with a potential rapist.

[Crystalspider]

Jeez I like to think I'm a fairly balanced and non judgemental person too, But this, I think I'd say to her 'what are you thinking'! I would have to be honest that he sounds like a complete loser and potentially dangerous.

[Sweetlikecoca]

Tell your friend how you feel. So that when she looks back and it probably ends in tears at least you tried and she will remember that.

However it is upto your friend and she may well find out the hard so just support and listen.

[bubbleup]

I'd have to tell her what I thought tbh. That she's worth so much more and if she can't see that then she should see that this isn't the type of character to allow into her children's lives

[Jonas657]

I'm going to give her a call soon and have a chat with her. I've also looked online to see if there's anything about the rape case, I've found one article which is about when he was charged and what he was charged with. The charges were pretty violent, tying her up and punching and kicking her. Surely the procurator fiscal would need evidence of this before charging him?

[Bunnymumy]

If her ex was a deeply unpleasant man then it sounds like she has form for ignoring red flags. I would encourage her to do the freedom programme online. You can word it as 'just to be on the safe side'. I would also direct her to youtube videos on love bombing as it sounds like he has being doing this, otherwise she wouldn't be do ready to forgive such big things in his past.

[IM0GEN]

Yes, they wouldn’t bring such a case until they thought they had a decent chance of success. She must have had a lot of injuries, poor woman.

[IM0GEN]

Is your friend already known to social services ? I’m assuming from what you wrote that her children still live with her and are not with a family member or foster carer ?

[Jonas657]

Hi imogen, no there's no social services involvement, the kids live with her. Reading back you'd think this guy was a stereotypical rough sort but no, he's got a very good job and lives in a nice area. Just goes to show you can never judge a book by its cover. Calling her now.

[Reedshoes]

OP I feel your frustration!

My friend sounds kind of like yours but there’s no telling her. She does the same thing time after time and there’s red flags each time but she marches on through then gets hurt.

She’s done it a few times and each time I think FFS. Each time she asks fir my advice and each time she doesn’t take it. I’ve also got another friends in a similar situation ie- moving in with a complete waste of space but hey ho.

I give up now. Some people won’t help themselves and your friend seems like she’s one of those types.

[LittleWing80]

OP from personal experience, she won’t listen and you will end up losing your best friend. Let her go. All you can do can is be ready to pick up the pieces when the car crash eventually happens.

[Aknifewith16blades]

I'd put money on her reliving the old trauma with her ex with this delightful man.

I'd be encouraging her to check him out via Clare's Law and Sarah's Law; I'd think about calling the NSPCC to flag that you are concerned about her kids in the relationship (if he can't be around his own kids, he shouldn't be around hers).

And I'd be telling her point blank that if she follows this path she will be putting herself and her kids in danger.

[Warmhandscoldheart]

I'd say I was concerned about her. If she brushes you off, ask what advice she'd give her daughter if she was in a relationship with this man?

[Jonas657]

Well, I'd have been as well talking to a brick wall.

He's very sorry for the past.
He's trying to sort himself out.
One of the failed drug tests they made a mistake.
His marriage wasn't going well and he thought going to a prostitute would be better than having an affair.
Hes on medication for anxiety and depression.
He's only had one slip up with the cocaine since the new year.
He doesn't mean to do these things, it's just spur of the moment.
He 100% did not rape that woman.

She did however stay quiet when I asked what her exhusband was going to say or do when he found out about all this.

I left it at that and told her I loved her and would always be here for her but that I think she's making a big mistake.

[SummerDayWinterEvenings]

I'd tell her if she sees him or puts her children at risk then I WILL report her. She's an adult- the children need safeguarding.

[Bunnymumy]

Well you've done all you can op.

He has no record of harming kids presumably so I dont think it can reported as a safeguarding issue anyway. Not that I would as she needs to know you are her friend. Not be driven further into his arms by a perceived betrayal.

Hopefully she will have a think now you've had this chat. Time will tell.