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Bit of a rant as to why abusive men get to see their children?

(134 Posts)
Fightingback16 Tue 12-May-20 09:51:44

I’m just needing to have a rant. I’ve spoken to a few people lately about my abusive husband and him having contact with dd. I even to an extent had the same conversation yesterday with my lawyer who I know only speaks from experience not her opinion.

Why do fathers have a right to see their children when they have abused there children’s mother. The emotional attachment they need with mummy is invaluable. If they can do it all in front of their children and not just when they aren’t around then how will they be good fathers. As people have told me, yes I did chose to have a child with him (chose is not really the right word, more like tricked/forced)

I’m a bit different because my husband has put my daughters life in danger so he isn’t allowed contact until it goes through the court.

But are there mums out there who have to hand over their children to their dads each week? Do they end up changing and being ok fathers?

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OnlyJudyCanJudgeMe Tue 12-May-20 09:57:54

Of course there are and of course SOME men change.
Just because the dad abused their mother does not mean to say that the dad will be a shite father!
Babies & children don’t NEED a bond with “mummy”.....they need a bond with a secure care giver, that could well be their father!

Fightingback16 Tue 12-May-20 10:01:42

How can they be a good father if they beating and screaming at their partner in front of the children.I’m not trying to be awkward but I just don’t understand.

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Needtogetbackinthesack Tue 12-May-20 10:03:04

My kids dad was abusive. He didn't see them for months (I refused to send them for overnights, he didn't want less so took us to court) he has seen them every sat for 3 months and is still abusice to them. He was violent to me and admitted to this and drugs in court. They're going for their first overnight on Friday and I feel sick at the thought so am trying to distract myself.

If you want some pointers towards really supportive groups on fb I would be happy for you to message me! It's tough, it's a minefield. But it is what it is in this country and we just have to be there wirh the emotional support for the kids when another generation is damaged because of 'contact at all costs'

stophuggingme Tue 12-May-20 10:03:06

@onlyjudgecanjudgeme

An man that abuses the mother of his children is ultimately also abusing his children.

End of.

stophuggingme Tue 12-May-20 10:03:50

Sorry that comment was for @OnlyJudyCanJudgeMeOnlyJudyCanJudgeMe

PlanDeRaccordement Tue 12-May-20 10:08:53

Well there is a limit. If the abuse is bad enough, the abuser loses their parental right to see or have the children live with them part time.

It’s not like abusive parents get access to their children no matter what.
As you say with your case OP, because he’s been a danger to your DD the court will now decide if he retains his parental right or loses it.

Also, children don’t specifically need an emotional attachment with their mother. That is a cultural myth which is especially strong in the U.K.. Children need an emotional attachment with a loving primary caregiver which can be either mother or father or grandparent or adoptive parent. Although it’s usually men who are the abusers, there are families where both parents abuse the children or the mother is abusive but not the father.

Fightingback16 Tue 12-May-20 10:09:37

@Needtogetbackinthesack I’m really struggling with what is going to happen. My little girl is amazing (like everyone’s kiddies are) my husband is a bully to everyone. He can’t walk down the street without starting on anyone who looks at him. It kills me to think if at the end me leaving and going through all this pain will not protect her. If he sees her then she will forever be changed in a very bad way.

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Fightingback16 Tue 12-May-20 10:11:08

Sorry I just meant that the mum deserves the right to have a bond with their children. Mine tried to take my bond away. She needed a bond with me because of our situation.

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PlanDeRaccordement Tue 12-May-20 10:18:32

The courts make it difficult. First, mum and dad both have the default right to bond with their children. Second, justice requires innocent until proven guilty and adult to adult abuse is reckoned to be entirely separate from adult to child abuse.

So what results is a situation where a parent keeps their rights over their children, until they are proven to be abusive/danger to their children. It’s reactive instead of proactive. Because you can’t keep the child from a parent who might be abusive, only a parent who has been abusive. This means the child must suffer abuse before they can be protected from an abusive parent.

It’s a catch 22 and I wish we had a better system so that children are not sent into dangerous situations.

Fightingback16 Tue 12-May-20 10:20:17

When I went to work he was at work and my mum had our dd. Some days he decided not to work and demanded dd stayed with him. I’d come home and he was drunk or stoned, or both. Once I came home and he was drunk and I opened the door to dd who was 2 holding a cutting knife. I tried to bring it up but was warned to keep my mouth shut. How will he be a safe father? It’s going to forever haunt me if he is allowed. (That’s not the life threatening example)

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Fightingback16 Tue 12-May-20 10:30:44

Im scared for little dd. He hasn’t applied to court yet so I have a bit of time. It took all my strength to leave him, I had a breakdown. I’m so scared for her future, she is the cutest, squeakiest little person at the moment.

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illclapwheniminpressed Tue 12-May-20 10:30:52

It's all ridiculous! All of it.
Court and the UK put the mental well-being of children at the bottom of the list and are confused to why so many adults have MH issues.
I'm waiting for my ex to at some point drag me to court for some attention and to use it to abuse me.

Sounds dramatic but he spent all last year getting an order to see his other ds, once the final order came in place he just stopped contact. 30 minutes before pick up, Hasn't seen the child in 8 months.
He hasn't seen our ds now in 5 because contact was all about him and being with me.

But I know that it's so hard to explain this in court without sounding like a nasty selfish mum.
I'm just a little me luckily that even the ss said she could see it wasn't about contact but to carry on harassment.

PlanDeRaccordement Tue 12-May-20 10:38:29

“I’d come home and he was drunk or stoned, or both. Once I came home and he was drunk and I opened the door to dd who was 2 holding a cutting knife. I tried to bring it up but was warned to keep my mouth shut”

That’s heartbreaking OP. Have you these incidents written down in a diary? SS needs to know about this.

Hoggleludo Tue 12-May-20 10:42:04

I had a violent upbringing. Not my father. But a stepfather.

If I'd of been made to stay with him. Not sure what I'd do

Is your daughter old enough to express that she doesn't want too?

I was 8-14. So I was able to state

Though it didn't help.

I remember one night. We managed to escape. I remember it because our old banger of a car went round over 999.999 miles. Back to 0. Or whatever it does

However no one would take us. No one would help us. So we had to go back.....now that I remember more than anything. That we were finally free and how happy we were.

Then having to go back. Realising he might find out that we'd left and the ensuing violence.

Fightingback16 Tue 12-May-20 10:48:07

I have been writing it down as I remember it. I don’t know if it’s a consequence of the breakdown or just the amount of trauma but my memory is really bad. It’s very uncomfortable not remembering large chunks of years.

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Raidblunner Tue 12-May-20 10:50:27

I think abusive men should be made to attend a behavioral/ rehabilitation programme and be professionally assessed before they are allowed anywhere near their children again. They should be tested for drugs & alcohol beforehand and be at zero prior to any contact. Also the children should not be there on their own and the ex ideally should be accompanied by another family member ie: his mother/sister until such times that is proven he can behave in a responsible and safe manner.

PicsInRed Tue 12-May-20 10:52:15

Men who abuse the mother are shit fathers.

The end.

PicsInRed Tue 12-May-20 10:55:57

the ex ideally should be accompanied by another family member ie: his mother/sister until such times that is proven he can behave in a responsible and safe manner.

Dont forget that the apples often doesn't fall far from the tree.

I would be absolutely appalled if ex MIL was mandated to supervise contact. Frankly, she and FIL made ex, and having them there too would be worse than him by himself - they reinforce and encourage his bad behaviour so that it becomes worse.

Fightingback16 Tue 12-May-20 10:58:18

My mother in law was with my husband drinking when dd had the knife...luckily she lives thousands of miles away!

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Fightingback16 Tue 12-May-20 11:00:17

She was also with her daughter drinking when her daughter fell from a balcony and is paralysed...so yeah apple and tree!!

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missyB1 Tue 12-May-20 11:03:43

OP you are not wrong, and it’s a national scandal. How many kids suffer further harm (physically and emotionally) from this belief that abusive men “must” be allowed contact? I dread to think of the scale of harm being done.
Courts love to talk about a child’s right to see a non resident parent, but they don’t seem so bothered about a child’s right to be protected.

PlanDeRaccordement Tue 12-May-20 11:09:04

“Courts love to talk about a child’s right to see a non resident parent, but they don’t seem so bothered about a child’s right to be protected.”

^ Thats exactly what it is. I wish that they’d lower the age where a child can refuse to see a parent. Even a 5yr old knows if a parent scares them or treats them badly. They don’t listen to the resident parents because it’s all categorised as bitterness and they don’t listen to the child either.

CountryCasual Tue 12-May-20 11:10:34

I think the issue is lots of women claim their partners were abusive once a relationship ends. Pretty much all of my friends (I’m a mid twenties women) claim their exes were ‘abusive’ but cite very mild examples that pretty much everyone is guilty of at some point in a relationship. These are also women who ‘don’t like him talking to other women’ but don’t think that’s controlling of them at all.

I think the threshold for physical and mental abuse should be significantly better respected and if it were it would be much easier to enforce things like limiting an abusive parents contact.

‘He physically abused me so I don’t want him to see our DD as I feel she’s vulnerable’ - very valid!
‘He said I shouldn’t eat McDonald’s everyday so I don’t want him to see DD incase he shames her’ not valid!

Unfortunately I think there would be quite a few of the latter complaints coming through.

Fightingback16 Tue 12-May-20 11:11:09

I guess harm will be done not having a father to a certain extent. They must wonder why even if you tell them it’s not their fault. But that doesn’t mean that having contact is a better option.

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