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LEAVING sulking H

(952 Posts)
jamaisjedors Wed 08-May-19 21:56:08

I can't believe this is my third thread.

I first posted in December about my H's sulking and silent treatment - I was ready to leave then but then got persuaded to give it another go.

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/relationships/3448545-Confronting-DH-about-his-sulking?msgid=84022238

My second thread is where everyone helped me work through what was going on, helped IRL by individual and joint counselling.

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/relationships/3498886-Confronting-DH-about-his-sulking-part2?msgid=85957683

We have now made a joint decision to separate, and I have found somewhere to live.

I don't regret not leaving in January because I have had time to process a lot of things, confide in friends, and come to understand a lot of things about myself and H.

However, sometimes I think it would have been a lot easier to power my way out of the door whilst still fuelled with a lot of anger.

Right now I am mostly very very sad.

Today seemed like a reasonably good day, H and I managed to discuss childcare arrangements up til the school holidays quite calmly and sensibly.

We each spent time doing fun things with the DC and H is actually encouraging them to get a little excited about the new house and buying new furniture etc.

But I have just been hit by a massive wave of sadness again after overhearing part of a conversation between DC1 and a friend. DC1 was saying that he had no idea at all this was coming and had never seen us argue or fight. sad

I was sure they were at least aware of the horrible atmosphere, particularly over the last few months so it's a bit of slap in the face to realise they had no idea at all and this must seem totally incomprehensible to them.

RandomMess Wed 08-May-19 22:13:15

I think at some point in the future you can mention about Dads sulking and that you spent much of your time ensuring he was happy so that the sulking didn't happen and that's not how a happy relationship works.

You need to educate them about the unhealthy dynamics so they hopefully don't fall into the same trap in their relationships.

They will realise the lighter atmosphere once you are living separately.

thanksthanksthanksthanks

Dullardmullard Wed 08-May-19 22:17:59

Once away and settle with the separation he might actually understand a bit better but you will have to do some reassuring and that some relationships are toxic.

TinselAngel Wed 08-May-19 22:20:15

The dynamic between the two of you is all your kids have ever known. They're accustomed to it and so are you.

LannieDuck Wed 08-May-19 22:35:01

If you've never had stand-up-screaming matches, perhaps your DC is imagining that's what fighting looks like in a marriage?

Haffdonga Wed 08-May-19 23:01:34

They had no idea because you are a good parent and protected them from his negativity and compensated for his bad behaviour.

But they will certainly have been affected by you being unhappy whether they were consciously aware of it at the time or not. I'm sure you will see a positive change in them once the upheaval is over and they can see you being the calm relaxed and happy person you deserve to be.

Justbreathing Wed 08-May-19 23:03:30

They are young. Perhaps when they’re older they might understand more
Probably it’s more like it was normal to them

TowelNumber42 Thu 09-May-19 00:34:31

Later DC1 will realise that never seeing you argue was actually a sign that you were afraid of him.

Children are resilient. They'll be OK even if it was a surprise.

Chances are DC will mainly notice the difference in a few weeks or months when they realise how much happier everyone is.

Satterthwaite Thu 09-May-19 00:35:35

It's all they've ever known, it's their normal. I remember quite a while back something about watching your behaviour so as not to upset daddy, or minding what you say so as not to upset daddy. They've already learned to tread carefully around him when he is sulking or otherwise moody. They will see in time that it's easier now they don't have to do that anymore

Lisette1940 Thu 09-May-19 02:00:38

flowers Jamais

Happynow001 Thu 09-May-19 05:58:07

* But I have just been hit by a massive wave of sadness again after overhearing part of a conversation between DC1 and a friend. DC1 was saying that he had no idea at all this was coming and had never seen us argue or fight.*
That says so much don't you think? Your husband was so good at undermining you whilst looking perfectly normal and positive and you got so good (for your sake and your children's sake more) of managing around his moods, walking on eggshells, not showing anger etc) that everyone, including yourself sometimes?, were completely fooled. You have always done your best for your children. Your best now is what you are currently doing and it must be the hardest thing you've ever done. It is the right thing though. 🌹

Innernutshell Thu 09-May-19 07:26:32

Feeling deep sadness doesn't mean that we are doing it wrong or that we should change what we are doing.

Sadness is a normal, natural part of life even though most of us are not very equipped to know how to cope with it.

We're with you in the sad Jamais.

Mix56 Thu 09-May-19 07:45:15

That must be hard whilst you are so introspective, & asking yourself if this is the right thing to do.
But Imagine if there were no DCs, you would have left well before now,
The lesson they have been learning, is that Daddy can behave "that" way, & Mummy will do back flips to make it all comfortable.
This is their model.
There will be a time for questions & explications, & when they come into the kitchen in the new house & you are singing out loud, or fooling about, they will see a new person has blossomed & understand better what freedom & a relaxed atmosphere is & how different it was under his dominating cloak of unhappiness

NettleTea Thu 09-May-19 07:55:12

I think that is the crux of why I left my ex - I didnt want my daughter to grow up and have his behaviour as normal, to not be affected by raised voices and aggressive behaviour or complete disregard for his family.

Kids dont know. They only have their own home as a single reference point and dont have the wider experience, unless it is seriously bad, to recognise dysfunction - many parents dont recognise it!

CarpeVitam Thu 09-May-19 08:00:54

Hugs Jamais x

lifebegins50 Thu 09-May-19 08:14:08

The sadness is natural. I would also recommend you have a journal, just in case MN disappears and log how his sulking made you feel. At times post separation Ex appeared "normal" and I thought could we be together again but these were only brief moments rather than sustained periods of time.

My youngest knew nothing of the conflict and probably assumed I was the aggressor however since being solo with his Dad he completely understands. I don't know what is worse, his previous ignorance about his Dad or his sad acknowledgment of how his dad is.

Divorce is very painful and I don't advocate it lightly but sometimes it is essential. I am sorry you are going through this, it is like a bereavement and it does it better with time.

cranstonmanor Thu 09-May-19 08:15:24

When you're in your new house and feeling so much more at piece, the DC will see that you are happier. Kids want happy parents.

Weenurse Thu 09-May-19 08:58:00

You have come a long way, we’ll done

CJSmith2019 Thu 09-May-19 13:05:44

You are a great parent and you shielded them from the worst of his behaviour, at a high cost to yourself. They are not aware of that right now and I guess they have the idea that unless there was screaming, arguing, whatever else, then there was no fighting. I still think back to your very first post about him ruining your weekend away, the straw that broke the camel's back, perhaps. Sadness is inevitable, but I don't think you could have continued to live much longer with his dreadful behaviour. Mind yourself.

ChristmasFluff Thu 09-May-19 14:34:12

Remember, this may just mean that your children think sulking is normal, and is the way to respond when someone does what you don't like. I learned that as a child. It's hard to unlearn.

You are doing the right thing for their mental health as well as yours. Well done OP. It's natural to be sad, but it really is the best for you and them. They will get to see their Mum happy now, out from under the thumb. flowers

Mix56 Thu 09-May-19 14:56:25

Also there a couple of posts in your first thread early on with comments of how your DC react to their father's sulking & other behaviour. Then his hijacking DS's birthday... so even if they hadn't witnessed any fighting, they most certainly have had to "subir" their father's behaviour. & so all 3 of you have been adversely affected by him.
It's just that for them it's their "normal"

jamaisjedors Thu 09-May-19 16:17:46

Thank you, your posts have made me cry a bit (in a good way knowing you are all rooting for me) and also take a step back and realise that of course for the last 10 years this is how things have been so they know no different.

I can remember that when DS1 was little things were pretty idyllic but after that it has pretty much always been this way and I had got as far as googling houses/flats and thinking through practicalities of divorce in the past.

Today was another step, I told my boss, who was concerned for me and worried that my responsibilities at work might have contributed to our break-up. I said that my current position has given me more confidence in myself which could have changed the dynamic, but that I don't regret doing this job which I love.

Dropthedeaddonkey Thu 09-May-19 16:28:33

I’d go against the grain here and suggest actually they didn’t really notice at least not in a way that affected them. My kids saw Dad sleep on sofa for months. Overheard arguments. Complained about Dad shouting at them all the time. Yet still when we split felt shocked and said they had no clue. Kids can be quite self absorbed. Unless it’s neglect or aggression level bad I think they tune out a lot of what parents do and say where it doesn’t involve them. I’d avoid painting their Dad as toxic as they can feel that means they have something wrong with them (being their dads kids and maybe sharing traits or personality). Also be prepared for them to be all over / defend the parent who moves out (because that will make them insecure they may be left too). The parent that stays often is the one who gets all the fallout (because they may feel more secure in that relationship). They will want explanations but don’t need to know the gory details. I agree that once you’ve separated over time they will see the faults for themselves because you won’t be there to intervene or shield them from moods / sulks etc. It’s horrible knowing you’ve made a decision which hurts your children but it is short term pain. A year on you will all have come through the other side. It does shake them realising their parents and life isn’t perfect but they adapt probably quicker than we do.

Justbreathing Thu 09-May-19 17:01:09

@Dropthedeaddonkey
You’re totally right
Children are self absorbed, not in a negative way. They just are. They don’t recognise nuances in that time and space. But they well look back on it as adults in a very different way.

Justbreathing Thu 09-May-19 17:03:40

And I agree, they will have to deal with their father doing the same to them as he did to you. Once they’re out of the quiet family dynamic they will realise
Sadly that’s their battle. You can’t fight it for them. But by being separated you can assure them that it’s not normal. If you were still together it would all be hidden and minimised

ScreamingLadySutch Thu 09-May-19 18:20:41

Right now I am mostly very very sad.

It is the most desperate thing in the world that things have to come to an end because they will not change.

But it isn't will not. Its because they can't. They simply do not have the tools or the inner world to access change.

That is another layer of grief (recognising this). Giving up all hope and letting go of wishes and accepting you have zero control. Losing your investment of a happy family. That sadness goes on for a long time Jamais

Mix56 Thu 09-May-19 21:41:37

You are totally, utterly, completely right to stop this relationship. Both for you & your children.

In my case, I really believe, after all these years of analysis of My situation that my H is highly functioning in many professional spheres, but actually is insecure, incapable of questioning his 'model' (if indeed he got to the point of asking could he ever be wrong ?)
He decided this was the "way to do it", he is not intelligent enough to question his mother's & father's dynamic
Highly "Machismo", he tried to dominate, & whilst having been attracted to an outgoing, confident, independent woman for all the right reasons, he then spent 30 years trying to prove he is stronger, better. The Master....... & frankly failed.
It so happened that I am indeed Stronger, Better, & more intelligent than him, I didn't sombre into the misery of the underling,, a miserable down trodden 2nd rate female
He now knows who is the stronger of the two of us.
Had I been in UK I would have left, I would have been able to find help, a job, etc, however, I was not entitled to leave with DC & I was penniless.

So what I am saying is, please Fly, live your life, Be Happy.
It's the only life you will have

Nat6999 Thu 09-May-19 21:49:05

My DS was only 6 when I left his dad but now at 15 can remember the atmosphere at home when we were together. I couldn't bear to be in the same room as my husband, we didn't argue much but our marriage was a mistake & I knew it within a couple of months of getting married. Kids pick up on things that you don't expect them to.

Newmumma83 Thu 09-May-19 21:55:08

I am so glad you are making the move.

I understand you are sad because you put A LOT into that marriage but now it’s time to put some energy into you and enjoy your kids more
.
Please keep us updated ... and I do hope that when you breath the fresh air of your new life that you find happiness again x x

Mix56 Thu 09-May-19 21:56:26

& Yes. Obviously a happy marriage is not about domination & being strong.

Imleavingonajetplane Thu 09-May-19 22:35:37

My jaw is on the floor @Mix56

That’s the exact person I’m still just about married to, and you’ve nailed my H exactly.
He’s been trying to outdo the confident girl he married nearly 30 years ago.

Bravo Jamais KOKO flowers

EKGEMS Fri 10-May-19 01:33:34

Hot damn OP Best news I've heard all day

Stormy76 Fri 10-May-19 02:10:13

I am glad that you have managed to find a way to be amicable about it, when do you move out?

dontdoxmeeither Fri 10-May-19 06:55:30

All continued power to your elbow thanks

Mix56 Fri 10-May-19 07:54:53

Imleavingonajetplane, I'm sorry to hear that.
Another point I will make as I already outed myself, is that my now adult DC, have no respect for my H, look at him alternately with hardly disguised disgust, &/or pity. They do not like him.
Their relationship would probably have been better if I had left, although I do not feel responsible for his interactions with them.
They probably between then have a lot to say about me, that I would not like to hear.

FilledSoda Fri 10-May-19 10:12:46

You can't even imagine the sense of relief and happiness that's just around the corner .

jamaisjedors Sat 11-May-19 08:47:59

So... the amicable part lasted til last night when we saw the marriage counsellor again.

First of all H gave a long speech about how things went at the weekend and basically said that he had hoped until the last minute that I might put a stop to the separation and that telling the kids was the worst moment of his life.

He did a lot of rambling about "signs" during the weekend, including a group of girls on a hen night who came up to him and asked him for the secret of of eternal love - apparantly he said to them "it doesn't exist" in quite an agressive way.

Then we talked about money a bit, and the counsellor was shocked by what H was proposing (I move out, leave all the furniture behind and just take my half of the money in the joint account).

She tried to show H that that was not a fair split at all and that even the sum of money that my lawyer suggested to cover new furniture was a very low figure in her opinion.

H was announcing that I could not take a single thing from the house when leaving, apart from 1 or 2 personal items.

His next proposition was to want to get a bailiff (?) in to list every single thing in the house, and its value, and then factor that into the settlement, so I would receive half of that value... at some point in the future.

The counsellor pointed out that I should not move out in those circumstances and that my lawyer would certainly advise against it, and that having a bailiff counting up everything and wrangling over every last detail would be horrific for the DC.

Also that the DC needed to be free to take any of their furniture or personal items with them if they want to.

It got pretty horrible and H is still refusing to get a lawyer so we can't start mediation.

It seems I would be ill-advised to move out while this is still up in the air so I need to see my lawyer again asap to sort it out.

H's final suggestion was that I list what I want to take from the house and the sum of money I want for re-furnishing and then we both sign this.

I actually don't want very much, I had got my mind into "buy new things" mode, but I do not want to be out of pocket either.

ThinkWittyThoughts Sat 11-May-19 08:52:35

I'm so sorry that he's already decided to start punishing you. But in a perverse way I'm glad you had a witness, for your own sanity if nothing else.

Speak to your lawyer ASAP - she is the best person to advise you now.

aweedropofsancerre Sat 11-May-19 08:54:29

Are your surprised by this? I am not which was why I was worried that your choosing to move out. I think his behaviour will get worse and he won’t care that the DC are stuck in the middle of it. He didn’t care before when he was sulking round the house and then ignoring them too. Personally I would be worried about going 50:50 childcare with a man that can do that to his DC. I would definitely be speaking to your lawyer ASAP

sandgrown Sat 11-May-19 09:04:05

Mix 56 you have hit the nail on the head. My partner has suffered depression since losing a good job and now working in a poorly paid menial job. When we met I was very independent and owned my own home etc. He is constantly trying to prove he is better than me and to try and show he is more intelligent. He makes certain comments about things he thinks I won't know then keeps repeating them if I fail to acknowledge. He is actually disappointed if I show I know what he is talking about or God forbid I know more than him.
Our teenage son was initially upset by his lack of interest in him but now is starting to despise him . I do worry about the long reaching effect on.him

RandomMess Sat 11-May-19 09:18:23

thanks

I'm not surprised he cares about nobody but himself, we said he wouldn't relieve that you would dare leave him. He is a bully always has been.

justilou1 Sat 11-May-19 09:21:56

You keep hoping that he will be reasonable because that is how he wants to appear publicly. He wants to hurt you because he is hurting and he can’t believe that you are not “being reasonable” and staying. He honestly thought that you would “come to your senses and stop this nonsense”..... Your feelings have never been valid here.

Innasnailshell Sat 11-May-19 09:57:00

Remember this is still just another round of games he is playing. It's a little concerning that although the counsellor can see what's right they don't seem to have enough experience to truly see what is going on.

The counsellor pointed out that I should not move out in those circumstances

You could be waiting many more months for the circumstances to be right to move out. I'd hazard a guess that your H will do all that he can to ensure the circumstances are not right for you to move out. He'll invent a 100 things that need to be said or done before he agrees to anything. He might say he'll agree but then he'll change the goalposts - just as he has always done.

You have got it exactly right when you say you wanted new furniture anyway. The sooner you and your DC are out the sooner you will all be at peace and able to see everything more clearly.

There are probably many more games he will play in attempts to make you doubt yourself but every day that passes they have less influence on you. Even though you have the skills and would like to keep things between you both reasonable it's highly unlikely he will allow this.

You can't do this without rocking the boat - and once you actually do - and actually leave - he'll make sure it looks like you've sabotaged the whole thing. There won't be any niceness. I'm sorry this makes it all the harder for a sensitive soul such as yours jamais. Men like him bank on this. He still just does not believe you will go.

You are highly skilled in working him out. Your safe house is just around the corner all ready and waiting.

jamaisjedors Sat 11-May-19 10:05:19

I think the counselor pointed out that I shouldn't move out because H was saying he wanted me out as quickly as possible.

So she is pointing out to him that if that's what he wants, he needs to make a reasonable offer about furniture/money etc

TowelNumber42 Sat 11-May-19 11:09:37

I think this is the moment to thing strategically.

OK, you don't want much from the house. Still, your list must be long. Includes loads on it.

He has to know right now that his new normal is one where he won't get away with being unreasonable. You won't obey. That making an unreasonable demand results in him getting much worse than he wants. Your list must make him squeak. Then you can choose to reduce it somewhat if you are so willing. You have to get out of appeasement mindset. You'll kick yourself later if you don't.

InSpaceNooneCanHearYouScream Sat 11-May-19 11:58:52

Why does he get to call the shots? I would tell him in no uncertain terms that you are entitled to half of everything and that is what you'll be taking. If he doesn't like it then HE can move his sorry arse out. What a grade A wanker her really is. Time to make him realise he is no longer in control.

CJSmith2019 Sat 11-May-19 12:05:22

I agree with InSpace. This is not his call to make. He could drag things out forever, with nonsense like that. Talk to your lawyer and start your list. A bailiff, FFS! How did he even think of that!

woolduvet Sat 11-May-19 12:06:21

It really does seem like he's hanging onto being in charge. This needs squashing, you're in charge of you now.

Justbreathing Sat 11-May-19 12:06:35

Agree with others
Be your new self!!
He doesn’t get to dictate ANYTHING

IdblowJonSnow Sat 11-May-19 12:15:27

You're feeling sad because you're a great parent with love and concern for your children.
However, whether they were affected or not by his moods/dodgy atmos, you're still allowed to leave if your dh wasn't behaving well.
It's normal so be sad, it's a massive adjustment but still a good decision.
Be kind to yourself as well as thinking of your kids. flowers

Haffdonga Sat 11-May-19 12:42:04

Well it's no surprise that he's trying to make things as difficult as possible. So he wont cooperate or engage? Get practical - rather than asking him what he thinks is fair and to make an offer, can you turn things round on him and write a list of all the household stuff. Then tell him he has the choice of keeping 'your' half in himself and paying you the replacement value or you taking it. Include all the household basics that you would need to set up home (furniture, pots and pans, kitchen equipment, cutlery, crockery, bedding, furnishings. lamps and ornaments, tools (garden and DIY) etc.

Leave out the high value stuff that lawyers might need to discuss, dcs stuff and any personal or sentimental that are obviously not shared between you. They can be sorted later. Be calm, fair and practical and tell him how it is.

Keep going. flowers

Mix56 Sat 11-May-19 15:09:34

I also suspected he wouldn't be as reasonable as you seemed to think.

Maybe try to put much more on the list than you really want & then negotiate down to the actual items that you want to take ? ! !
I agree, as you have invested your money into the joint home, then you will not be walking away hands empty. He does not get to veto your ownership. & by punishing you he is punishing his DC .... they will be living in this house 50% of their time. Maybe he should think about that

Is your house rented ? I can't remember ? If its a mortgage free property then surely you will want to get your half at some point ?

Dullardmullard Sat 11-May-19 16:17:07

And it begins. they always get nasty when it becomes clear you don't back down and go back into your box. He will have known the signs and chose to ignore them. He is that selfish thinking you'd not go through with it.

As @Mix56 says it's his kid's house too and he'll be depriving them really not you as per say.

I have to say please be careful around him when departing as this is when they become the most dangerous. You have seen that he can be nasty with money now, so be on your guard with him with regards other things. I think he will try any means to keep you in the house with him plus Watch out for things going missing that means something to you?

timeisnotaline Sat 11-May-19 16:23:09

I’m with towel. These are hostile negotiations. If there are small things sentimental to you and not him I would hide them rather than put them on the list. The list itself needs to be long and you can negotiate down to the modest amount you actually want.

StationView Sat 11-May-19 17:48:12

Jamais, as those of us who have been through this have commented, this comes as no surprise. My 'D'H behaved in exactly the same way. He was the one who left, and he subsequently sent me a list of house contents, via his lawyer, all at inflated prices. He wanted me to agree to buy them, and for their value to be deducted from the final settlement. The scummiest thing he did was to try to charge me for DC's bed. That's right. His own child's bed. I sent a message back that he was welcome to anything in the house other than my bed and the washing machine, both of which I had bought since he left. He then suddenly lost interest in the idea.

I remember asking my counsellor why 'D'H was behaving in this way, and he said, "Station. He's had twenty years of you backing down to him and appeasing him as you tried to avoid his sulks. Why wouldn't he think it will carry on working?"

It didn't. We went all the way to court, in front of a judge, in the end grin. I got a good settlement.

Happynow001 Sat 11-May-19 19:31:36

Hi Jamais. So, sadly, he is following the well-worn pattern of trying to abuse you financially now. Do, please, look ahead and plan accordingly as he is showing he's prepared to be nasty.

If you have not already taken out of your shared house things that are personal to you, ie financial statements, passports, favourite or expensive items of your clothing, birth and marriage certificates, your children's birth certificates, please get them out now and leave them with someone trusted until you can move them to the new house. When you get the keys to your new house keep them secure (at work? hidden in your car? with someone trusted?) until you are able to move in so he cannot gain access.

Please plan for the worse/most unreasonable things which may happen because that's where he will be trying to lead you to.

He is showing you, clearly, he is not prepared to be fair or amicable.

Lunde Sat 11-May-19 20:04:39

I'm sorry that he has become so hostile - but I am not really surprised. Sulkers and controllers never want to lose the upper hand and will fight to "win" at all costs, even if they are fighting for something they don't really want.

After gambling that he could just bully you into dropping everything his new approach is for you to make yourself invisible and paint yourself out of the family so that his like doesn't change in anyway and that he can just pretend everything is the same as he has all the stuff.

You need to speak to your lawyer urgently now that it is clear he is going to play hardball. You should ask her again about transferring money from the joint account to furnish the new house. You didn't take her advice last time as you were sure that he would play fair - but now the situation is different.

Mix56 Sat 11-May-19 20:34:11

Please plan for the worse/most unreasonable things which may happen because that's where he will be trying to lead you to
Unfortunately I agree, He is no longer your friend.

Queenofroutine Sat 11-May-19 20:43:16

Jamais I’m on the same path as you but not quite made the break yet. I saw inklings if this when we nearly split when he announced out of nowhere he would therefore stop all joint cards (I only use them for food shopping for family). I am following your story closely & am in admiration of you, Your DCs will be proud of you in time xx

jamaisjedors Sat 11-May-19 20:45:04

Thanks for all the advice.

As it stands, H has transferred half of the money from the joint account to my new account and half to his new personal account.

But as the counsellor pointed out, this is not fair because it leaves me furnishing a house with my share of the money.

His attitude is very strange (or perhaps human?) - last night he was furious and not budging. This evening he saw I was upset and said "may you find peace".

I had a nice day at ikea with the DC, even DC2 said that it was fun, we had lunch, tried out sofas and beds and took our time but didn't go overboard either.

DC1 wants to see the house next week so he can start planning his room, which is a good sign.

I'll talk to my lawyer about the list. I had already (on advice from here) put aside a few silly things which I definitely want to keep and when we discussed me taking personal stuff there was no problem the other day.

I think H is paranoid about me and the money, he's convinced I'm hiding money in the UK, just like he was convinced I was going to leave him to live with as a lesbian etc etc.

jamaisjedors Sat 11-May-19 20:47:25

I am currently using the joint account card to make purchases - conveniently my personal card has not arrived yet.

RandomMess Sat 11-May-19 20:55:49

Well if you only got half the money then you will need to take household items to the value of 50% in the marital home presumably excluding the DC items?

Fairenuff Sat 11-May-19 20:56:04

H's final suggestion was that I list what I want to take from the house and the sum of money I want for re-furnishing and then we both sign this.

Sod that. Just take what you want from the house when he's not around. What's he going to do about it if he won't even get himself a lawyer.

Good idea to use the joint account, especially when it's things for the children as that should be jointly paid anyway. Just keep receipts to show what you've spent it on and don't worry. The onus will be on him to prove you've been reckless with it (which we all know you won't be) and he can't do anything without a lawyer anyway.

Once he gets a lawyer the mediation can start so it might actually help if you push his buttons for once to make him take action.

CJSmith2019 Sat 11-May-19 20:59:46

Sod that. Just take what you want from the house when he's not around. What's he going to do about it if he won't even get himself a lawyer.

+1 to this. I had the exact same thought earlier. You are doing great. Glad to hear that the children are looking forward to the new house too.

Mix56 Sat 11-May-19 21:04:47

Non mais, sans blague......
He ""gives"" you half of joint funds, OK That's great. (You could have taken it, he could not have stopped you.)

From here on, in order for you to furnish, he pays half, or gives you half of house stuff/furniture....... on Top of bank account.
This is evident logic for any child. He will not play along, so its for you to choose your battles, I agree if you say, "OK, Whatever," He will be furious, he will have lost his Joker

jamaisjedors Sat 11-May-19 21:06:15

Sod that. Just take what you want from the house when he's not around. What's he going to do about it if he won't even get himself a lawyer.

+2 !!!

I have already put aside the bedding that I want to take, for me and the DC. A few other bits and pieces like blankets, favourite mugs etc.

I cba about the rest because buying new things or tracking down bargains online second-hand is keeping me busy and focused on the future (what my lawyer advised was best for me psychologically).

If H doesn't move to get a lawyer and start the mediation, I won't spend a penny out of my own account and will just continue to use the joint bank account card - the amount left in there is approximately what I was advised to ask for anyway.

Originally H told me to stop spending off there, but when I said that would hold up me moving out, he changed his mind and said I could use it for certain things but should use my own money to furnish the new house.

I'm not going to, we can just as easily keep track of it from the joint account as from my own account and there is less risk of me being out of pocket and having to fight for the money.

Mix56 Sat 11-May-19 21:29:14

WOT ? we can just as easily keep track of it from the joint account
No, He does not get to check your account,
Everything in your house is half yours, He does not get to say "it's mine..."
he is simply continuing the bullying, & you are accepting it.
Not only has he effectively driven you out of your home, you then have to pay for it.
If the house is paid for, he will be living rent free, whereas you will have to pay.
Just NO

Wallywobbles Sat 11-May-19 21:35:54

Just some advice. When I was going through this bollocks I just said that I would only discuss with our joint lawyer - so for you that's mediation. Have a working doc of what's been agreed so far so you're going forward at each session and to confirm every one has understood the same thing.

jamaisjedors Sun 12-May-19 10:49:27

Discussing through the lawyers is definitely the best plan... When H gets one!

Today and last night were weird.

I was a bit emotional in the evening through tiredness and had to leave the dinner table. Later on H was asking after me in a very concerned way and then said good night, may peace be with you (he is not religious).

The next morning he came to see if I was feeling better (I just ignored) and then asked me to stay at home today and cook with him. .
I said that he had asked me to go out for the day and that was what I was going to do.

He said, yes but I've changed my mind, I want you to stay and cook lunch with me.

I went off to do some yoga and have a shower.

After that I got my stuff together and said I'm going out, as planned. He said "aren't you going to stay and have lunch with is?" And I said "no, I need to get out".

So then he said "haven't you found peace yet jamais ?".

I ignored and left the house.

Justbreathing Sun 12-May-19 10:51:43

Dickhead
Total mind games

CJSmith2019 Sun 12-May-19 11:03:45

Sounds like a line from a very very bad movie. Try not to let him get to you with that nonsense.

innasnailshell Sun 12-May-19 11:06:28

Sounds like he might be testing your resolve to stick to what you say.

Well done on doing exactly what you said you would.

Fairenuff Sun 12-May-19 11:11:59

Haha, you should have said "Yes, I am so thankful that I have finally found my peace and you will too one day if you are as lucky as me" and floated out the door grin

In future when he keeps asking you the same thing just say 'Which word did you not understand'.

Lunde Sun 12-May-19 11:43:17

Mind games

Haffdonga Sun 12-May-19 11:49:03

Cognitive dissonance = the discomfort felt when you hold 2 opposing beliefs. It can make us contort ourselves in all sorts of weird ways to align the beliefs.

H has 2 opposing beliefs. 1. I am a good kind guy and a great husband .' 2. My behaviour has been unbearable for Jamais and she is leaving because I have been deeply unkind,

The only way he can live with the discomfort of these two thoughts is to rewrite reality. So now he is a good kind guy all the time and you are leaving him not because of his intolerable behaviour, but because you are somehow not at peace with yourself. You are disturbed and emotional who just can't see what an amazing husband you are leaving.

Poor poor misunderstood H.
Not.

Have a nice day out.

Aussiebean Sun 12-May-19 12:00:05

Anyone else’s eye rolled hard at the ‘are you not at peace yet!’ BS.

Mix56 Sun 12-May-19 12:16:21

Did he say it in front of DCs ? ie "Look mummy is leaving us, but she's feeling guilty type of shite, or if not, just pure sarcasm. Idiot

justilou1 Sun 12-May-19 14:47:28

Who does he think he is exactly, Rasputin???

RandomMess Sun 12-May-19 14:49:52

I think you need to remind him that the counsellor asked him first what he wanted and he replied "to split" so this is his choice.

KOKO thanks

jamaisjedors Sun 12-May-19 15:49:25

Dalaï Lama perhaps? He might have been re reading his bookgrin

CJSmith2019 Sun 12-May-19 15:53:45

I would be tempted to start using a beatific smile in response and a murmured 'yes'... Or 'soon, very soon'...

StationView Sun 12-May-19 16:05:54

Expect him to start questioning your sanity again soon, Jamais.

Standard operating procedure, I'm afraid.

LizzieSiddal Sun 12-May-19 17:38:11

When are you moving to your new house Jamais?

jamaisjedors Sun 12-May-19 17:42:14

Not in front of the DC, no.

Expecting him to start messing with my head but just had a lovely day with a friend so feeling rejuvenated and strong.

Hope you have all had nice weekends.

Picking up my keys tomorrow at 9am grin

TheABC Sun 12-May-19 17:51:29

Congratulations on getting the keys! It's all going to speed up now.

You could have a lot of fun with DH's mind games if you wanted to, especially now you have you exit route clear.

feelingfree17 Sun 12-May-19 20:17:39

Well done you! He had controlled you for far too long. He almost had you, you were increasingly changing to accommodate his twattish controlling behaviour. Do not buy in to it any more - ignore, ignore, ignore! You will feel in control for the first time in a very long time. “May peace be with you” - who does he think he is! It will be yours, very soon, once you are away from him - and then maybe he may begin to have a very hard look at himself (I doubt it though)

Lisette1940 Sun 12-May-19 20:19:56

Glad you are getting keys to your home. X

jamaisjedors Sun 12-May-19 20:42:23

OMG I just went to get some clothes from the bedroom and H has turned it into some weird sort of shrine with a load of photos of the DC surrounded by candles.

He has also rearranged the room a bit and added some statues from elsewhere in the house... and put out in the corridor a few of my personal bits and pieces and my yoga mat (so the bedroom is now most definitely HIS space).

I guess his hoovering attempt at lunchtime (asking me to cook with him) failed and so this is what he spent the afternoon doing.

I am a bit annoyed that the DC have been on screens all afternoon - he obviously hit a low after I left and so used "his day" with them... to do nothing.

This is after dad of the year on our last day off - it's wearing thin.

H looked dreadful this evening, he was shivering with cold and was white and could hardly eat. I think my turning him down today brought it home how things have changed.

H also tried to send me some "messages" by reading out some slogan about love from a bread bag (of all things).

I am glad he is seeing his psychologist tomorrow, and I hope he will tell his family soon because I worry he will crack otherwise.

Off to watch Alicia being a strong single woman. Have a good evening everyone.

Justbreathing Sun 12-May-19 20:47:57

The person who mentioned cognitive dissonance is correct,
He can’t handle the truth. That’s it.

jamaisjedors Sun 12-May-19 20:50:35

Yes, I agree totally about the cognitive dissonance; his brain can't process this at all - about himself and his image of himself, and also about me.

Mix56 Sun 12-May-19 20:50:52

Next twist... he is sick.... uh huh !

TinselAngel Sun 12-May-19 20:54:18

Don't feel sorry for him!!

RandomMess Sun 12-May-19 21:20:01

He is desperately trying to reel you back in all without actually having to change his behaviour, utterly deluded!

AsleepAllDay Sun 12-May-19 21:29:24

Oh he sounds like a prick. Putting your things out and then trying to get you to pity him with his 'illness,' the shrine to the kids...

He's hoping that one of these mixed messages will make you break down with regret and let him come back and be the same old sulker!

Give yourself the pity you would give him - you've been through a lot

justilou1 Sun 12-May-19 21:37:18

Well I hope the insurance is up to date if he’s playing with candles! How weird that he’s saying “Peace be with you” and setting up altars.

Dullardmullard Sun 12-May-19 22:07:38

Ahh the guilt trips have begun.
The ill look just for you upping the anti now he is
Wonder what’s next an illness he has which will be total bullshit or he’ll commit suicide if he tries this one phone the police on him with your concerns. This will be on him not you remember that when you do leave.

Disengage now or you’ll be sucked in.

I take you ended up on the mattress from the beginning and he didn’t do the sharing of him having a turn.

I’d be inclined to empty your clothes out of the room sooner rather than later as well so you don’t have to see the shrine

I also wonder if he wanted you to engage when you saw it because I wouldn’t not a word to him and If he says have you found peace or what ever bollocks he spouts.

Say why thank you yes I have. He’s deliberately trying to back foot you again.

Happynow001 Sun 12-May-19 22:10:36

Just ensure you get your personal documents (birth & marriage certificates, financial documents, passports for you and the children, favourite and/or expensive items if clothing, jewellery etc) moved out ASAP into your new home when you collect the keys tomorrow.

Don't forget to do an official change of address so new mail gets redirected, and also with your office, solicitor, bank and other relevant people.

Move as much to online accounts as possible and change your passwords/pins on your accounts and devices.

Justbreathing Sun 12-May-19 22:16:26

He will go for a suicide bid next. Or talk about one at least.

Fairenuff Sun 12-May-19 22:27:51

You know how he used to sulk to get your attention? Well now he's just changed it to 'poor me'. Carry on ignoring it as it's all stupid little childish games.

CJSmith2019 Sun 12-May-19 22:33:34

I’d be inclined to empty your clothes out of the room sooner rather than later as well so you don’t have to see the shrine

Exactly what I was about to say. And tbh, the sooner you are out of the house for good, the better.

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