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Lies and debt, again and again...

(99 Posts)
Pumkinfailure Mon 30-Oct-17 17:30:18

I've posted about this before which makes me ashamed that I'm here once again and nothing has changed.
My DH is a great father and husband (apart from this huge issue) and I love him with all my heart and I'm genuinely broken by his actions and I need to splutter it all out to try and make some sense of it and my part in all of this.
Essentially he's always been crap with money, over the past 20 years there has been a pattern of him building up huge credit card debt, lying about it (it's the lies that are killing me), me finding out, him being remorseful and me bailing him out to the tune of probably over £100k over the years. This has happened perhaps 7 times, each time I say if it happens again he needs to leave, each time I dont follow through, he promises to change and then it happens again.
He's done it again, I found out today, another £10k in the last 6 months.
I don't follow through for a number of reasons- I love him, he's a funny caring man that keeps me sane, he's literally the best dad I've ever seen, I rely on him for all the school stuff/drop offs and pick ups and could not work without him.
Background- I was (until this month) a fairly high earner in a high powered professional job but for various reasons my wage has halved but my hours are staying the same so money a bit of a worry at present.
We have analysed why he behaves like this- he says he is scared to tell me when he is in trouble with money so buries his head in the sand a little debt spirals with interest. He feels that as a man he should be able to provide financially for himself.
The debt seems to build up because he works only school hours to facilitate my job and his outgoings (pays some of the household bills and food) are more than his incomings.
I thought we had sorted this last year (when I discovered £30k of debt) and took some of his household commitments off him. In retrospect I should have took them all and/or opened a joint account. We also looked at how he could run his business better to have a better income as he has a very good in demand trade that potentially should be earning him money. It seems he forgets to bill customers or simply doesn't charge enough, is not working smart, and he seemed to be getting on top of this so I thought.
So today I've discovered after bailing him out massively last year he's done it again. What on earth do I do?
Kick him out? But I love him and rely on him for the children.
Get him to give up work- but we can't manage on my wage currently now my circumstances have changed
Help him again with paying off the debt and running his business
Get him to work for someone else - but we have a son with health issues and one of us needs to be able to take time off with him if needed and I rely on my husband for this- if we were both employed I'm fairly sure one of us would lose our jobs soon enough.
So...if you've got to the end Thankyou! I don't know where to start or how to make sense of this, I'm sure I have a large part to blame in what's happened but don't know what to do next.
(And please don't print this in the daily mail or on the FB page as I suspect my friends may identify us from this but I've nowhere else to turn)

HoneyWheeler Mon 30-Oct-17 17:41:14

I used to work in insolvency and I saw a lot of people in similar situations and it is a scary place to be, so I really sympathize.

I think that after each debt revelation a bit of the trust between you has chipped away and if that trust isn’t rebuilt you may ultimately find it too difficult to keep the marriage together (obviously my opinion, and I don’t know you so could very well be wrong!).

If I was in your position I’d be trying to get my partner some debt counseling, as there seems to be some unhelpful thought patterns behind his behavior, and I suspect that if they’re not sorted out the behavior will keep repeating. Then the rebuilding of trust can happen.

I really wish you the best - I think you’re doing a remarkable job it what must be such a tough situation.

Pumkinfailure Mon 30-Oct-17 17:51:34

Thankyou Honey, your kind words made me cry! That's a great idea about debt counselling to look at the thinking patterns behind his behavioir, I feel to blame that I've emasculated him somehow by earning well and being quite a strong woman. There's really been no need for him having the debt as my money is his money but we've never had a joint bank out, initially though laziness and then so his credit history wouldn't be tied to mine. I think asking for money, despite me constantly asking if he needs any is difficult for him. I also think I shouldn't have left him with any financial commitments for the house (I pay most things). I also wonder if I'm just enabling him however as he really could be doing well with his business even with the limited hours.

AnyFucker Mon 30-Oct-17 17:57:18

Where exactly have those vast amounts of money been disappearing to ?

You know how much it costs to run your house. Is it really to the tune of 100k ?

He's a gambler, love

Holdtightdontletgo Mon 30-Oct-17 17:59:55

So is he spending the money or not bringing enough in?

Pumkinfailure Mon 30-Oct-17 18:03:34

I've thought about gambling and other women but it really seems to boil down to not earning enough. His credit card statements are all to cover suppliers bills, I think he averages about 1k a month of debt over the years which was probably the shortfall he had to cover his share of the children's activities and bills. A big part of the problem I think is that I expect him to take time off when the kids are sick and then he obvious doesn't earn. It's really difficult in my job (male dominated) but on reflection I should bear some of the load.

LIZS Mon 30-Oct-17 18:06:48

How does he spend more than £10 in 6 months? shock seems like his or perhaps both your expenses currently exceed income. How old are your dc, could they go to before/afterschool care while he worked ft?

swingofthings Mon 30-Oct-17 18:11:00

There are two issues you need to tackle: his inability to keep to a budget and his lack of income.

Do you have a joint account of which bills are paid out of and then your own spending money? If so, is it the latter that he is building debts on? If so, what does he buy to overspend so much? Do you actually know?

Or do you have separate accounts, each paying for certain bills, but the problem is that some month his income is not enough to pay for his share of the bills? If that's the case, you need to have one joint account only of which every bills is paid out of, you then divide what's left for spending money.

As for the second issue, would he really want to focus more on his career and earn more? If so, I think it is fair that he should be given this opportunity and you need to discuss how to make compromises to allow this to happen. Can you really not do any childcare at all? Could your son go to childcare some days?

I left my ex partner because of debts and lies, but in my case, he wasn't a great dad or partner and in the end, it killed all the love I had for him. It's hard when you still love the person.

Cambionome Mon 30-Oct-17 18:12:58

So up till now you've been able to bail him out because of your good salary, but from now on that won't be possible...? I would be very, very worried that he will run up huge debts again and bring the whole family down with him.

How much would it cost to employ someone to help with childcare? Would you be able to work from home some of the time? Could relatives help?

I really think you need to try to find a way to manage without him before he financially destroys you.

AnyFucker Mon 30-Oct-17 18:29:30

He isn't a good dad

Whatever problem he has is going to put his kids in financial jeopardy

bluescreen Mon 30-Oct-17 18:31:57

How much of the debt is interest? I imagine quite a lot of it could be, if it's on credit cards, as it builds up so quickly.

I can understand why you don't have joint accounts in the circs, and that's wise, but have you thought of a top-up system from your bank account to his credit card? Would it be a good idea (not too emasculating?) to go through the credit card bills together when they come in? If you know the dates when they're due and diarise it you can ask him about them before they have a chance to mount.

Pumkinfailure Mon 30-Oct-17 18:43:09

Thankyou for the replies, really good advice and good for thought.
In answer to some of the questions- we have separate accounts but a joint account for bills is something to think about, I've been wary of being tied to him financially. I've taken steps to protect myself and the children (I.e mortgage is in my name only) but Cambionome is right there is the potential for him to destroy us financially particularly now my income has dropped.
I could pick up some of the childcare with some changes and I will definitely look into that and also look at after school clubs. There are no relatives unfortunately- another reason I don't want to end the marriage, he's all I've got.

AnyFucker Mon 30-Oct-17 18:45:15

That makes him a very expensive habit

expatinscotland Mon 30-Oct-17 18:55:48

You're in love with someone who doesn't respect you or his family and who is likely a gambler or involved with someone else. He's a very expensive habit indeed.

Honeycombcrunch Mon 30-Oct-17 19:04:47

Cut up all his credit cards as a first step.

I know someone who was married to a man like this and they ended up bankrupt with their home being repossessed.

Isetan Mon 30-Oct-17 19:07:37

How has cleaning up his financial incontinence and taking the blame for his fecklessness worked out for so far? It hasn't but here you are again,repeating the bloody cycle.

This isn't about what you did or didn't do, this is about what he does and doesn't do. Why haven't you requested regular credit reports? I don't quite get the logic of protecting yourself financially by not having a joint account but not taking steps to monitor his spending properly.

If you insist on staying with this man, then for fucks sake grow a pair and take control fully, or accept that you will continue colluding with your H to screw you and your children overr financially.

Enough of this half hearted handwringing bullshit already.

Adviceplease360 Mon 30-Oct-17 19:10:14

There are two issues you need to tackle: his inability to keep to a budget and his lack of income.

Do you have a joint account of which bills are paid out of and then your own spending money? If so, is it the latter that he is building debts on? If so, what does he buy to overspend so much? Do you actually know?

Or do you have separate accounts, each paying for certain bills, but the problem is that some month his income is not enough to pay for his share of the bills? If that's the case, you need to have one joint account only of which every bills is paid out of, you then divide what's left for spending money.

As for the second issue, would he really want to focus more on his career and earn more? If so, I think it is fair that he should be given this opportunity and you need to discuss how to make compromises to allow this to happen. Can you really not do any childcare at all? Could your son go to childcare some days? this

Annoyed5678 Mon 30-Oct-17 19:21:09

If he couldn't afford the shortfall for the bills due to his company, and your expecting him to only work half a day yet pay the same when your on huge sums before, how come you didn't pay for all the bills? Seemed logically if your earning high and he isn't. If a man posted that he expected his wife on low income to do children work yet pay half when he's got big money uproar but this seems all your husband's fault

Tiddlywinks63 Mon 30-Oct-17 19:23:04

£100k ?
Ffs! That's a ridiculous amount of money to go through?
Just because up to now you could bail him out is no reason for him to carry on in his own sweet way, dragging his family down and down behind him ☹️

Cambionome Mon 30-Oct-17 19:26:16

I think Isetan puts it bluntly but has hit the nail on the head. If you are going to continue with this relationship you have to take complete control of everything to do with finances. He is totally incompetent, and you can no longer take his feelings or needs into account. Don't continue to make the same mistakes over and over again.

butterfly56 Mon 30-Oct-17 19:31:33

Yep seen this happen to someone they were bankrupted and are now divorced. She now lives on benefits in housing association property.
He found himself a wealthy widow and doesn't work at all now.

butterfly56 Mon 30-Oct-17 19:41:03

another reason I don't want to end the marriage, he's all I've got.

He's very good if he's managed to convince you that he is all you have! hmm

You have enabled him all these years because you made the mistakes of bailing him out every single time.

Good husbands do not put their family's at risk.

Pumkinfailure Mon 30-Oct-17 20:03:21

I realise I need to take full control or end the marriage- I guess that's why I'm posting to help me think clearly.
I do have access to his credit report and online banking but hadn't checked it for the last 6 months as I believed him that everything was going well and I was working 80 hour weeks and let it slide.
Annoyed- He didn't pay half of the bills, far from it, about 10% but what I was saying was perhaps even that was too much.

LIZS Mon 30-Oct-17 20:22:50

But he is not a child. He needs to behave as an adult and manage spending responsibly not expect you to parent and bail him out to make it all better. What is it that makes him so passive, does he somehow feel emasculated by being the primary child carer and you the main earner? Is his business that profitable or a glorified hobby?

Ecureuil Mon 30-Oct-17 20:27:54

If his £1000 a month overspend is all bills, and you pay 90% of the bills, you must have a very expensive lifestyle.

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