Divorcing a narcissist

[focusonthegreengrass]

I found out a few months ago that my husband has been leading a double life possibly for about 8 years. He has worked away 5 days a week and only come home at weekends. We have been together 24 years married 18 and have 3 children aged between 8 and 12. I found a long stream of intimate text messages, filed for divorce together with a threat of an occupancy order and he is gone. Problems since he left

1. He denied adultery to his family even though it is very clear that he is still with OW. I have spoken to his family to set them straight as they kept saying to me "he is devastated" " he wants to reconcile" which put me under more pressure. I have also recently revealed to him that I have copies of the messages and he has now stopped denying it to me. Zero remorse though for years of extreme emotional abuse and some physical abuse.

Before anyone comments on privacy, I needed those messages as I was in counselling for 8 years thought he had depression or stress and I thought I needed to help him. The catalyst for looking at the messages was finding some female clothes including underwear in the place where he lives mid week.
Please don't come back with harsh comments, I once tried to post here before when I was trying to leave last year before I found all of this out and I couldn't take it. I may be over sensitive but I have been through a lot.

1. He is being horrendous through the divorce process. He rejects every proposal to move forward eg rejects valuers demands different ones. Wants every stick of furniture and item in the house valued (is this normal?)My legal bill for August alone is £18k. He said at the beginning that he wanted to be amicable but he is being high conflict. He is aggressive, angry and a narcissist.

Is there any benefit in my writing to him to say
It is now high conflict.
Yes my legal team can handle it as they are v strong. However we are losing money that could be spent on our children's future.
My health is suffering, my hairdresser says that my hair is falling out, I have lost 11kg and I am underweight. I am waiting for sti results as I have had to get tested due to all of this.
I am in charge of the children 99% of the time and I need to focus on them.
Any existing goodwill or hope of getting on is being dissipated fast. We ideally need to be able to get on as co-parents.
His blocking requests and requests to have all furniture etc valued (not just large items) are costing money and goodwill.
Would a letter containing these points help or make him worse?

[Notearsgoodbye]

I found it made it worse tbh. Part of me thinks I should have been more combative from the start and the other half thinks I should have walked away even if it meant losing out financially. I didn't because of the children.

For example, the furniture. Do you really want it/need it? Is it particularly valuable?

My ex used to point out to me that the legal teams were benefiting from money the children would have had which was true but it was impossible to negotiate with him.

I came out better off by going to court than agreeing to what he wanted. Was it worth the stress and strain? I really don't know.

[thethoughtfox]

Go 'grey rock' There's great advice on here about that. Just make the decision to let go most of the stuff (whatever you can live without) and move on. Do not engage with him and he loses all his power.

[thethoughtfox]

Let me take the furniture. From the money saved on legal bills, you can buy more furniture and start afresh. The only way to take away a narcissist's power to to cut off the narcissistic supply. Could you send a message through your legal channel that he is welcome to xyz because you are moving on?

[jeaux90]

Let go of anything you don't care about, they like to feel they negotiated and won.

Stop engaging in any conversation or communication which is not about the kids. Keep everything non emotional and let the lawyers deal with the details.

I had to leave my narc ex. I basically took very little. It's just not worth the stress.

[Hermonie2016]

I'm so sorry you are going through this.Just know it will end.

Do you have a deal you can live with? It's not usual to argue over every piece of furniture, but he will use everything to control you and try to win.

You will get through this, it might take a year but it will end.
Well done on being so strong, it's just awful to divorce someone so high conflict.

[focusonthegreengrass]

Thanks Notears that is interesting to know that it was better financially to keep fighting through the legal system to the end. So you didn't settle at FDR and went to final hearing?

[focusonthegreengrass]

Thanks ThoughtFox I may do Greyrock and let the legal people continue. I feel that if I give way on the furniture then he will see a chink of light and put more pressure on me re everything else.

[focusonthegreengrass]

Thanks Jeux my legal team said the same thing. I don't care if he feels that he has won!

[focusonthegreengrass]

Thanks Hermione, good advice "it will end" I will focus on that!

[keepingonrunning]

Try <a class="break-all" href="//www.amazon.co.uk/Divorcing-Narcissist-Battlefield-Tina-Swithin/dp/0615976344/ref=sr_1_3?ie=UTF8&qid=1505646789&sr=8-3&keywords=divorcing%20a%20narcissist&tag=mumsnet&ascsubtag=mnforum-21" rel="nofollow noindex" target="_blank">this book It's American but the principles are the same.
Go grey rock as others have said.
Only communicate regarding your DC and use minimum words. Stick to simple facts. Only use email so you have a record.
If you give in about the furniture, he will be spurred on and turn his focus to some other perceived "battle". You know that, for him, it's all about winning.
Be prepared, it almost certainly will go to final hearing. A poster on an old thread who tried endless negotiation, mediation and being reasonable advised at the end of it all: with hindsight I should have gone Form E, FDR, final hearing and saved the cost of a lot of mediation and solicitors' letters trying to avoid the inevitable.
You can't reason with unreasonable people. You'll get there.

[keepingonrunning]

Co-parenting is most likely going to be extremely challenging. Look into parallel parenting instead.
When your ex contacts you wait a few days before replying, if at all. (Ignore if possible. Most of his communications will primarily be designed to provoke a reaction in you). There's a good chance he has conditioned you to think you have to respond immediately when he demands it. Bin the idea that when he says, "jump", you have to say, "how high?".
Keep arrangements for your DC to see him set in concrete. Do not expect or allow any deviation from the agreed times. That way you will get dragged into endless communication and game-playing where he will try to control you and them.
I'm sorry your health is suffering so badly with the stress. Prioritise your own well-being when you can. Evidence based stress management techniques here

[jeaux90]

And don't write the letter. Bloody pointless as they have no sense of consequence

[keepingonrunning]

Your legal fees sound very expensive. Check with your solicitor whether they really need to respond to every silly letter he instructs his solicitors to send, for example insisting on valuations for low value items. Won't it simply make him look ridiculous and petty to the judge at the final hearing? Remember people like your ex thrive on drama and watching the fallout from creating a maelstrom in other people's lives. He will love the idea of bankrupting you from a flurry of solicitor's letters.

[keepingonrunning]

He can't control you any more. Ignore ignore ignore at all times unless absolutely necessary. Take back your power.

[Notearsgoodbye]

Yes we went to final hearing. We didn't go to mediation as things had broken down too badly.

I did do better in the end through the court system BUT ex was so way off the mark with what he was offering, it was a joke and the judge saw that straight away.

[focusonthegreengrass]

Keepingonrunning I am guessing from your name that you are talking from experience here. The book looks great, I have ordered it on Kindle. I like the concept of parallel parenting and I will start to implement it. Yes I had also said to my legal team, just say "no" instead of rushing around trying to answer him but I will say it again. Thanks.

[focusonthegreengrass]

Jeux, yes I have been mulling this over all day including based on the advice from this thread. Someone said to me that if I wrote the letter he will know what is upsetting me the most which will give him more power. As written above I need to take back my power! Thanks for the good advice!

[focusonthegreengrass]

Notears it gives me hope that you did go to final hearing and got a good result, maybe I need to get more stamina and just stay with it using the advice and techniques mentioned on the thread. Thanks.

[Deadsouls]

Firstly I'm so sorry that you're going through this and suffering. I had my own entanglement with a narcissist (not as serious as yours), but my health on all levels suffered as I had to endure his vindictive, narcissistic rage.

So as others have said; please do not send the letter. He will view this as you being vulnerable, and he will exploit it. The point is, he doesn't care about your feelings. Don't show vulnerability, feelings, emotions nothing! I'm sorry to say they use any and everything they view as weak spots to gain leverage or manipulate.

If you have to interact with him, just keep it simple, alluding only to facts. The reason he is being so difficult and creating all this drama is because he gains a sense of power from it. Don't play into his hands!!!

Leave it to the professionals. (Legal bill sounds dreadfully high, he could be deliberately making trouble in order to ramp up costs)

Decide what you are prepared to let go of financially, materially etc, in order to gain freedom and get this toxic person out of your life. It may be that you will lose out, I did (on a much smaller scale). It really burnt, but the thing is because these types don't care who they throw under a bus in order to win, and will resort to any and all tactics, this is the kind of person you are dealing with. So it may be that you come out of it all with less than you'd hoped for.

They do not stop! So you might have to be the one to stop it.

I wish you all the best and strength to get through this and back to health. I really get it! They are terrible people.

[Deadsouls]

Oh and don't do or say anything, no matter how innocuous to you (especially get angry with him, hard as they are enraging), that he can twist and turn around onto you as 'evidence' against you. The less interaction or emotion you show, the less likely this will happen. Most probably he's waiting for you to 'slip up' or say or do something, so he can use it. So sorry again....it's awful. One day you'll be out of it though.

[jeaux90]

You will take the power back by not responding believe me. The only thing you should respond on is kids and logistics around them. Nothing else and you do it matter of facts, no emotion.

Everything else you ignore. Even the "why are you ignoring me" texts.

They live to goad you

[focusonthegreengrass]

Deadsouls and Jeux thanks so much. I will re-read your posts re not responding and taking power back when I am tempted to engage with him. I am feeling more positive already. It is a horrendous situation but I will get through it.

[greenberet]

Feel for you Op these men are a nightmare - have been through horrendous divorce myself and still sorting out the mess. Do your solicitors fully get his abusive behaviour etc - mine told me they did but all they were interested in was ££££. Kept saying I wanted to cut & run mental health took a huge battering - but they persuaded me to continue to FH - got totally let down by legal team and got shafted by x and justice system. Had I taken an offer I would be better off And would have saved myself months of hell. I'm still battling with CMS as he's not paying anywhere near what he should be - and yes he is out to destroy me still 3 years since he left

[Deadsouls]

You so definitely will! I remember I thought it was endless when I was in it, but I did get free and many many ppl do.

Have you been reading up about narcisstic abuse. A lot of the forums online have loads of experience and info about divorcing a narc. I like Melanie Tonia Evans (even if I don't always chime with her approach), she really knows her stuff. She also understands the emotional devastation that narcs wreak. There's a lot about 'grey rock' online too, and narcisstic abuse. I found that gaining knowledge of how they're mind works really cemented my ability to extricate myself.

Hopefully when he stops receiving emotional energy from you I.e stops being fed, he'll get bored with tormenting you. All the best - you've got this. At the very least you'll know that you are the one who has behaved with dignity and integrity, qualities that narcissists lack.

[Deadsouls]

Also, if you haven't already then look up how to co-parent with a narc.