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Relationships

elderly mum and inadequate home

40 replies

thewooster · 09/04/2017 16:00

I'm really struggling here and would appreciate some other perspectives. My mum and dad are in their 70s and live in their own home with my brother who is 40s. DM had a stroke a couple of years ago and is almost wheelchair bound. She can walk with a frame but has so many other health issues, it is hard for her. She is very weak.

After her stroke my DB became her carer and gets money for this and he does her meals and hoovering etc.

My problem is she cannot get upstairs and uses a commode. She has no washing facilities, no available shower and does not sleep in a bed - she washes her hands at the kitchen sink. She sleeps in one of those adjustable chairs.

After the stroke I tried to get them help from the council to get a grant for a downstairs loo but my parents and brother refused because the council wanted to 'stick their nose into their finances.' So it was a no-go. I then begged my dad to get a loo put into a downstairs room but he wouldnt and she has to use this horrible commode.

Anyway she has gone downhill healthwise recently and cannot get off the commode without help and my DB refuses to do this which I understand as it is embarrassing for both of them. My dad helps but he is not in good health but he empties the commode which my DB wont touch.

I dared to mention that they should move into a bungalow or get their house (it is really rundown) updated and DB went mad and said he has to do all the work and I live in my ivory tower and dont do anything.

Thing is I was not attacking him, all I said was can we work together to persuade our parents to update or move. I appreciate he does the meals and hoovering but he has lived their rent free all his life and pays no bills at all.

I do their banking, sorting out doctors, collecting pills, food shopping so I do contribute.

He totally blew up at me and my DM was on his side because she does everything he says, so I was sent packing when all I am doing is thinking of the future. My dad is not in a great shape so I'm thinking of the future when they both might need a downstairs bathroom.

They own their home and have not done any work on it since the 80s. Things have to break before they get mended if you know what I mean.

Am I a bad person for wanting bathroom facilities for my DM? I'm feeling very hurt by his comments that he is the one doing everything when it is not true. Ok I moved out and have my own house and kids, but I work full time whereas he has never worked in his life.

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TupperwareTat · 09/04/2017 16:07

A quick relpy - In an ideal world I would 'sack' him & get carers in for now. Then see if they can get a bungalow without him.

Ring Adult social care and ask about care providers. Ask for a referall to O.T Occupational Therapy. They could possibly put a height adjustable commode in. So easier to push up from.
Is there room for a stairlift?
Is there room for a bed downstairs?

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TupperwareTat · 09/04/2017 16:10

Mum should have a Stroke Liason Nurse also, that is hers for life. It might be worth ringing her.

Why is DB worried about people asking about finances? Its for his parents benefit.

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LidlAngel · 09/04/2017 16:12

I'd suggest writing to their GP. It's how I got things kick started for my parents when things started to unravel but they were both refusing any help as 'they were fine'.... Tell the GP everything - you'll feel like you're throwing them all under the bus a bit but sometimes you've got to take a hard line in order to bring about change

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TupperwareTat · 09/04/2017 16:13

Also if he were to get the sack & move out your parents could get Wiltshire Farm Foods delivered, your dad could heat up the lunches. Carers could oversee breakfast/supper.

Some daycentres provide transport & have bathing facilities.

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PurpleWithRed · 09/04/2017 16:17

If your mum has no access to a shower or bath, no help with personal hygiene and struggles to use the commode safely I'd say she needs a care assessment and I'd be calling in social services. Your brother may have the best intentions but this sounds like she is vulnerable and this is borderline abuse - neglect and financial. I appreciate it's a very difficult situation for you but at this rate something serious is going to happen like a fall, or an infection due to poor hygiene. You may need to make yourself a bit unpopular. Can you get dm on her own? Or df?

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BigGrannyPants · 09/04/2017 16:21

The cynical side of me says your brother is concerned he will loose his carers allowance and actually have to get a job... he can't be her carer if he's not prepared to do basic things like help her to and from the toilet. Your dad will get to a stage (soon I suspect) where he is no longer able to do these things for her. Maybe you should speak to your mum and dad on their own firstly. It's a hard enough conversation without someone losing the plot at you

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picklemepopcorn · 09/04/2017 16:22

I had a conversation along those lines with people involved in the care of an elderly relative. I asked the HCP 'hypothetically', if I was concerned 'hypothetically', what would the next step 'hypothetically' be? I wanted to raise awareness of a problem without actually reporting anyone. It worked, and interventions were made.

I don't think anyone is going to intervene in terms of 'sacking' your DB though. Do you mean carer's allowance, or Does he get paid separately as well?

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thewooster · 09/04/2017 16:34

Thank you so much for all your replies and you have given me some much needed advice.

When DM had her stroke we had carers coming in at first but they stopped them (DM and DF stopped them) as they did not want to pay. That's the problem I have - they don't want to pay for care.

DB does not get any other wage, only the carer allowance from the government.

I'm going with my aunty to the council next week to ask about accommodation. The other problem I have is my mum will not move without her dog and cat and gets upset if I mention it.

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originalusernamefail · 09/04/2017 16:34

Could you frame it as making things easier on your brother 'as he works so hard???'

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jeaux90 · 09/04/2017 16:35

Mine are both elderly and have carers going in. The SS will ask them to fill in a form about any capital they have coming in to pay for that or any adjustments to their house.

I am moving mine to a flat from their bungalow soon as this is the right answer for them.

Your mum needs access to a toilet and shower etc and carers to come in and do that for her.

Your brother is not thinking straight, and none of them are thinking about the right answer for their needs apart from you. Even with POA though you can't force the issue, you are there to help them with their decisions.

I would sit down with them all and spell it out. It's not fair for your mother to not have access to proper facilities. The right answer is for them to move to a property that is all on one level.

I feel for you, it's a difficult situation as it is. Even more so when siblings are not aligned with the right practical answer.

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SlB09 · 09/04/2017 16:37

im a district nurse and am confronted by these sorts of situations on a daily basis - I can just share advice from my own experience.

Your mum and dad are probably not just listening to your brother - they will feel safe and secure in what they know and have always done, they probably don't feel in control over anything but the house and hold onto this even to their own detriment. Try not to get frustrated or offended at them not thinking as logically about their needs as you do, there will be many factors to their behaviour. If they make a choice just go with it, as long as they have the capacity to make that decision.

Your brother was probably letting off steam by shouting at you and more than likely regrets it, he probably finds the whole thing frustrating & difficult too.

If your district nurses arn't already involved then ask for an assessment, they will have access to equipment/beds etc that may be useful and refer to appropriate services depending on what is relevant and helpful. Your mums at risk of pressure area damage, health issues from sleeping in a recliner etc so support would be useful - and often people take advice from outsiders better (even if its what youve been saying for months!)

It is frustrating, and you can see crisis coming and all you want to do is desperately help as you can see how you can make this so much easier...but in the end its their choice.

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LadyLapsang · 09/04/2017 16:39

Do you live nearby, and how often do you see your parents? I presume she was provided with the commode by health / care services because that was the solution she and your dad agreed on. Is someone helping her have a proper wash / get dressed / checking her skin to ensure she is not at risk of pressure sores etc.

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thewooster · 09/04/2017 16:40

Tupper - they will not pay for carers or for a stairlift or any modifications to make life better.

When she came home from hospital, she had a bed in the front room but they sent it back as they would be charged for it.

It is so frustrating as DM says she is ok and can sleep in a chair but she's making do to not upset anyone.

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picklemepopcorn · 09/04/2017 16:56

I believe care costs are capped at a specific amount per week, and the assessment is to make sure they do not pay too much. Would that help them tolerate it, do you think?

It is frustrating, when your loved ones are not getting the standard of care they need because family and they themselves are, effectively, blocking it.

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thewooster · 09/04/2017 16:57

Ladylap at the moment I am going round 4 times a day/night to help her with getting up off the commode as she has problems with her legs/foot. DB helps a bit but cant help when she is on the commode as he gets embarrassed.

She had a wheelchair, hoist, a bed and a different commode from hospital and everything got sent back after a week or so because they did not want to pay the hospital.

The commode she has now was purchased afterwards but I am not sure where she got it from.

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thewooster · 09/04/2017 17:01

SIB09 thank you for putting things into perspective and I think you are right. They do not want the hassle and feel safe in their surroundings even though they are not adequate anymore.

i've got a long struggle ahead of me I think.

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jeaux90 · 09/04/2017 17:04

You know she is entitled to attendance allowance which is not means tested. Then yes she could pay for the carers out of that or for cleaners etc.

What happens when you want to go on holiday or away for the weekend??

This is crazy, the carers will wash and help her and make sure she is taking the medication etc. My sister and I rely on them as we are both single parents who work full time and my parents carers are amazing and honestly a weight off my mind.

Can't believe they won't move or adapt the house for your mum. God I feel so sorry for her and you x

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LadyLapsang · 09/04/2017 17:11

I really feel for you and your mum. Do you have any idea of their financial situation? Sounds like they have enough savings to ensure they don't qualify for means tested things but not enough to feel confident about spending their money because they a worried they might need it down the line.

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hesterton · 09/04/2017 17:18

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

SlB09 · 09/04/2017 17:19

You shouldnt have to pay for equipment if that makes any difference to their decisions? The district nurses or community occupational therapists will have access to 'loan' equipment (usually sits under local authority) as its for a health need and can order as required where a need is identified. This includes beds, commodes, hoists the list goes on. Cost should not be a factor. I'm guessing even if she got to bed this would alleviate some of the leg/foot problems and have a knock on effect in other areas. Its hard and frustrating but try to let it wash over you if they are adamant, you can only do what you can do x

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SlB09 · 09/04/2017 17:20

And loan equipment does not have a financial assessment element

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Oly5 · 09/04/2017 17:23

Call
Social services because I'm not sure they would even have to pay for adaptations such as a downstairs shower?

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smurfy2015 · 09/04/2017 17:39

First quick suggestion before my long...er pre typed reply, i just saw someone mention equipment, a leg lifter has been very handy for me so might be useful for your mum as well

elderly mum and inadequate home
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tiktok · 09/04/2017 17:51

Carers allowance is about £65 a week, and the care has to be for at least 35 hrs. Attendance allowance paid to the person cared for is about that (I think). I wonder if your brother gets your mum to pay him the AA? That's fine and perfectly legal but maybe not the best use of the money if they are turning away other help.

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smurfy2015 · 09/04/2017 17:59

Warning - long reply Wink

First thing before anything else i would compose a letter to the GP that you feel would be best, make an appt even if it is weeks away to go and discuss it as then you have an agenda and you both are on same page at start of appt without you having to explain anything, bring a copy of the letter for yourself to refer too

in the GPs letter state all your concerns, including the risks such as perhaps not being able to clean properly after using commode (even with help due to embarrassment) and the potential for skin to breakdown etc, what you fear would be the long term consquence of not taking any action to prevent this and discuss solutions to prevent things going down this path,

By any chance are you registered at GP surgery as carer? even if you arent, they cant tell you anything about your mum as she is an adult however they can take on board what you are telling them and your parents may be off the generation who would do as the dr advised, even if was the same as you but it holds more weight cos the dr said it, if you get my drift

i second what other pp said about involving district nurses, im 90% bedbound due to 5 different conditions, i would be lost without my hospital bed and other equipment. I was resistant at first but for sake of not letting skin break and causing excess pain i had to put pride to one side, best decision ever. I also have 4 care calls per day

I can understand a son not wanting to do personal care tasks for his mother however he has taken on the role of carer and this doesnt allow for picking and choosing what parts, he will or wont do.

"I do their banking, sorting out doctors, collecting pills, food shopping so I do contribute" im not suggesting that you withhold care or lie to get a care package but if you were unable to do these things would your brother step up to the plate and take this on, or is it only selected parts of caring again?

re Banking can be done online, you could help them with this via a second named card for the account, and then you have monthly statements and you make sure all bills are paid as and when needed on time.

re Sorting out doctors and collecting pills, pharmacies can be good if a person is on a long term regime of the same meds to set up a re-ordering service so that they will re-order on the patients behalf as needed and put the meds in time slots in a dossette box. Some pharmacies also have a "drive thru" pick up window, others have delivery services so check out what is available in your area. Make things easier on yourself.

Food shopping as you know, could sit down with a mobile wifi connection and do a grocery shop etc with your mum / dad, then brother could take delivery and put away. It would allow your mum to make the choices of which 1 of out x number of choices she would like, same as in a supermarket, bringing that back to her as she may have always done her own shopping and might miss that now she is housebound effectively

Are all pathways in the house clear? for your mum with her walker as last thing she needs is a fall,

"Am I a bad person for wanting bathroom facilities for my DM? I'm feeling very hurt by his comments that he is the one doing everything when it is not true. Ok I moved out and have my own house and kids, but I work full time whereas he has never worked in his life".

No you are NOT, definitely not, from the way i am reading it and please correct me if i have picked it up wrong, he is doing meals and hoovering and as a "carer", he isnt actually doing any direct "personal care" tasks at all - due to embarrassment or otherwise

Brother may be aware that if he is not a carer anymore, he will be required to sign on and look for work.

"My dad helps but he is not in good health but he empties the commode which my DB wont touch." - :( - what i see from is this,

he is living rent free, some housework, getting "carers" allowance which i conceed isnt much for what a lot of carers do and majority out of love, he is basically like a live in housekeeper/carer who doesnt do personal care which is not what your mum or dad needs

"Your dad will get to a stage (soon I suspect) where he is no longer able to do these things for her. i suspect this will come soon", also you need to try and speak to both of them seperately so they can give you their own thoughts on this, your mum is in danger of a fall due to weakness, sores from lying in an unsuitable chair as a bed and infection from same sores or from pressure points anywhere else

" I am going round 4 times a day/night" - if you couldnt do that, they would prob need to resort to outside help at some point, ask for a care assessment and explain you cant help all the time as its taking a lot out of you (and im sure it is)

You mention that your mum would not move without her dog and cat - have you heard of The Cinnamon Trust - The only specialist national charity for people in their last years and their much loved, much needed companion animals. A network of 15,000 volunteers “hold hands” with owners to provide vital loving care for their pets. We keep them together - for example, we’ll walk a dog every day for a housebound owner, we’ll foster pets when owners need hospital care, we’ll fetch the cat food, or even clean out the bird cage, etc.

re washing when i havent been able to do a proper wash, i can suggest the following
Re hair washing - no rinse shampoo cap - feels like a real treat
body cleanser - senset cleansing foam as it leaves me feeling really fresh

good luck and if you want to ask me anything as ive been the carer, now the caree and also the daughter trying to get a stubborn parent to accept care Brew and Cake

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