So it looks as though, once again, dh expects me to act as if nothing is wrong...

[IKnowRight]

Recently dh has been extremely stressed, very quick to anger, not pulling his weight etc etc. This has happened before. There's also been a couple of incidents of extremely selfish behaviour on his part.

Following my own depression/anxiety, counselling and an AD which has worked extremely well for me, over the past couple of years I've felt more able to confront him regarding his behaviour, letting him know it's completely unacceptable. His response is always very defensive, turning it round on me and telling me I'm as bad or worse, I don't support him enough etc etc

The problem is, I don't feel he has my back. If he's tired or down or whatever then I will step up and try and help. If I'm tired or down all I get is how much more stressed/busy he is. Good recent example - I broke my foot earlier in the summer. Got home from the hospital, feeling shit, struggling on crutches. He came home, went on and on about how unreasonable it was that I was non weight bearing on my foot and when I pointed out that I couldn't even carry a cup of tea myself he told me to make up a flask and carry that. Then fucked off back to work. All of it a joke of course .

Anyway... the past couple of weeks have been awful, he is so angry about the slightest thing, he has been scaring the children. He was in a sulk because of my calling him on his behaviour. I have asked him to see a doctor, I want him to have counselling over his knackered self esteem and his angry reaction to stress, however he's not done anything to start this off and I rather suspect that he thinks that if he toes the line for a week or two I'll pipe down and things will go back to normal.

Normal for me is shit though. We both work full time, he doesn't pull his weight wrt housework and childcare. We never socialise. He treats the children as an annoyance and an inconvenience - other than the odd family day out thrown in to keep us sweet I suppose. All he ever does is complain - about his job, the state of the house, the progress of his football team. The whole thing is making me weary and quite frankly I've had enough.

He's told me he's sorry, he's told me he's going to get help for his moods, that he is going to help me come up with solutions to make our lives easier and more enjoyable but he never has and I don't think he ever will.

I want him to leave. It's hard to say it out loud but it's true. I would be financially OK without him. I doubt the kids would miss him much, he has very little to do with their day to day lives, in fact being an EOW dad would probably mean more meaningful contact with them.

I'm struggling to say the words though. How can I throw him out of his home? How can I do this to our family? Having read numerous threads on this board I KNOW it's the right thing to do, I don't want my children having to tiptoe round him and I don't want to live in an atmosphere. I just need to find the words. Feeling very sad and very lonely in this marriage, I could do with some support to help me get out of it. Thanks for reading, if you've made it through the incoherent ramble.

[Destinysdaughter]

Sounds like you've actually tried really hard with him and he's not willing to change. You have every right to tell him to go!

You can tell him it's not working for you any more, that you don't feel it's an equal partnership and that you think it would be better if you separated. Write it down if you think that will be easier - a version of what you have said in your OP would work. Do you think he will get nasty if you say this to him?

[Hillfarmer]

Difficult to start the conversation, but make it when your dcs are not around and perhaps on the back of yet another grumpy outburst from him. Something along the lines of 'It's clear that you're not happy, I'm not happy either - I think it would be better for everyone if we separated.'

Before that you could check out a couple of family solicitors. Get an idea of what you'd need to do if you wanted to divorce. Sounds like you've come to the end of the road. There's no need for your children and you to live under his black cloud.

Mine was happy enough to leave, but absolutely outraged when he heard from my solicitor soon afterwards! I think he thought I'd be begging for him to come back to shine his benevolent light on us, or that I would crumble under the pressure of looking after little children without him. Not a bit of it.

Your H can start his anger management course once he's left the family home. Not before. He needs to take responsibility for making everyone else's lives shit.

If he's anything like my XH (who I genuinely loved until he drained all the love I had for him with his awful angry and nasty behaviour) he will sulk for years. Yes it is really sad and lonely now. And there'll be times when you're sad in the future, because it is a tough road when you grieve for what you could have had. But I doubt you will miss the black cloud.

The main problem might be if he refuses to leave. Could he afford to rent a place? You will know best how to handle that one. Perhaps he would be happier on his own without the chaos of family life??

[Jan45]

It isn't working, and from what you describe, it wouldn't be working for any woman, he's dismissive of you, non respectful and clearly doesn't have your back, all the things you need for a happy, healthy relationship.

It's way over time to call it a day; you deserve a peaceful life and so does your kids, you know you can have this if you can get him out of your daily life, who would want to be with such a selfish uncaring man, nobody.

You are not sending him anywhere, for you the marriage is over and you want to make plans to separate, it's no biggie nowadays.

[Destinysdaughter]

Agree about seeing a solicitor first so you know exactly where you stand re house and finances.

[K1mberly]

Get all your paperwork together and see a solicitor first , before you speak to him . Many angry men get a lot more angry when they know you are leaving. You want to know what all your options are .

[IKnowRight]

Thank you so much for commenting, I haven't been able to reply until now, life is off the scale busy.

DH is currently in ultra nice mode. I've agreed to go out for dinner with him tonight as we have relatives staying to look after the kids for half term. I think he thinks it's a wine and dine with a shag afterwards, for me it will be a chance to have a civil discussion out of earshot of the children, in an environment in which we cannot rant and rave at one another.

Really good idea to get paperwork organised and see a solicitor before speaking about separation, I'll do that.

I'm feeling so conflicted, I feel terrible threatening him with separation when he's making an effort, but he needs to understand that under no circumstances will I put up with this bullshit any longer and I will not tolerate another episode of what we've been living with recently. It's down to him then, if he seeks help (doctor, counselling) without having to be repeatedly pressured to do so by me, I will give him a chance.

Must admit, I really don't want the shag part of the whole evening's plans, it's really hard to fancy someone when they're being an arse.

[RiceCrispieTreats]

You do not have to have any sex that you don't want to have. Tonight or any other night.

Quite sad that you seem to think this is inevitable, as if your free will is not part of the equation.

[RandomMess]

I think you need to use tonight to tell him that you've had enough and you don't believe his empty promises anymore and you don't fancy him anymore due to his behaviour.

Absolutely no shag.

[ouryve]

If you don't want the shag part, then the shag part shouldn't happen.

Is this something else on the list of things he gets arsey about?

[IKnowRight]

Oh no don't worry the shag part won't happen unless I want it to. He may well get arsy but that will only prove my point won't it????

[RiceCrispieTreats]

Indeed.

[Jan45]

Use this opportunity to tell him the truth, no point in play acting when you are living in misery, get help for his moods- maybe this is just him so not sure if that's the answer.

I wouldn't want to shag a man that was so dismissive of me, taking me out for dinner wouldn't even come close.

Stick to your guns, be honest and take it from there.

[AnyFucker]

Another chance for him ?

How many chances does he get ?

Is your tolerance unlimited ? He seems to think so and if you cave again, then he is right isn't he ?

[springydaffs]

It's nothing to do with anger, it's to do with bullying and control. No amount of 'counseling' is going to touch that.

Honestly, some people have such riches and piss it up against the wall.

Get rid, good and proper, for good. He's had years to address this - an evening's wining and dining isn't going to begin to touch it. You've had a truly miserable time at his hands. If he's miserable bcs he's chucked out then 1. too bad and 2. he'll know what it feels like, what he's dished out all these years.

He's got it coming. Have a lovely life without this ungrateful, ungracious wretch.

[IKnowRight]

Arrgghh just typed out an essay and lost it. Short version - he's been extremely domesticated this weekend, pulled his weight and more. He was very charming when we went out on Friday. I slept in the spare room, he woke me in the middle of the night crying and asking for a cuddle. He got a quick hug before I went back to sleep. Last night we shared a bottle of wine, but slept separately again. Tonight he's in a mood because I'm not being attentive enough. I told him that a week of sharing domestics, a bottle of wine and a meal out aren't enough, he's still not taking responsibility for his behaviour before this week and if he thinks that a bit of schmoozing will out me back in my place then he's very much mistaken. He wandered off muttering under his breath.

This week, solicitors advice. What paperwork will I need? I know precisely fuck all about the separation process.

[Leeza2]

Paperwork - you need evidence of all your marital assets . Broadly Thats everything you and you DH bought or saved since the date of your marriage - bank accounts, pensions, savings, property , businesses etc . Inheritance counts in England but not in scotland ( unless you brought it into the marriage ) .

It doesn't matter if it's just in one persons name

And your debts - outstanding loan debt on the mortgage

Your incomes - not just salary , other things count too

Solicitor will want to know others things about the children etc , but that's the main things .

They are not a marriage guidance counsellor , so don't run up a huge bill explaining all the detail of how awful you DH is. They just need to know the broad reasons why you might be divorcing him and if he's abusive to you / kids . Use the time to get legal advice about the money / house/ legal stuff.

You will feel much stronger when you know the facts about what you and the kids are entitled to

[IKnowRight]

Thank you :)

Finances etc will be pretty straightforward - he has never hidden anything from me we both have full visibility of all incoming money and equal access to it.

I am so very nervous of taking this step. I can feel myself backing out as I type. He's finally going to see our GP, this is a huge step for him and I'm glad he's doing it, but on the other hand it's still all about him and what he feels and wants. I am being a bitch if I do anything other than just put up with his sulking.

The practicalities are starting to worry me too. I'm being assessed for a condition which may mean an operation. No idea how I'll manage if he's not around, we have no family nearby and I've increasingly withdrawn from friends as my life has got busier. We live fairly rurally and I'm not sure how I'd manage getting the youngest to school if I can't drive for a while. That said, he was fuck all use when I had an injury earlier this year, he just rang his parents and got them to come and stay for a couple of weeks until I was able to drive. Still, that's better than being stuck on my own. I couldn't deal with the same arrangement if we'd already separated.

But there is never a good time is there? I am tying myself up in knots.

[IKnowRight]

There is a house to rent just round the corner from where we live now, but it won't be available until March. Would I be completely mental to tell him I'm taking the house and will move out in March next year unless he can show me why I should stay by then?

[Leeza2]

Yes it would be completely mental . You need to keep this plan in your head . And watch how behaves over the next few months .

But if he's been like this for years, it won't change in weeks .

Besides, if you move out and a a year or two down the line , he's a totally different person , you can always get together again .

[Leeza2]

In the meantime , you need to see a solicitor . And enquire about that house

[Handywoman]

The only thing that would be mental is holding out hope that he will ever really change.

He has shown you who he is and you are rightly sick of it - he killed your love by a thousand moody cuts.

GP is a red herring. Everything he is doing is so he can get his life back to normal. The problem is that normal is shit for you and the kids.

You don't need his approval. Go and see a solicitor.

[FredaMayor]

I think DH is thinking of leaving but hasn't the cojones to deal with it straightforwardly with you. If you don't initiate it he will, so let the timing be your decision, and sooner rather than later so you don't get bounced by being unprepared.

[IKnowRight]

Thank you all again.

Do you think that men who behave like this make a deliberate decision to behave this way as it gets them what they want, or is it all subconscious? Not that it really matters as the outcome is the same, but I'd love to know if he's deliberately leading me up the garden path or if he genuinely believes he's hard done to.

House has been enquired about. Looking for local solicitors next. Still feeling wobbly and undecided but I'm pressing ahead as if a decision has been made. Knowing where I stand financially/legally/logistically etc will make me feel a whole lot more secure in my decision.

[ifyouregoingthroughhell]

He's a manchild. He knows that. No harm pointing it out though.