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Turning Tavern - are there any people around from there any more?(17 Posts)
I am having a tough time with my first female crush (I am female) and a search took me to the Turning Tavern of a few years ago.
I was wondering if any of those people were around to 'listen'? I'm feeling terribly lonely. Can't eat, can't sleep thinking about whether this current thing I am feeling is one-sided or not. Even if believe the latter, I am not sure what to do about it, if anything. I don't think I have felt something this intense before and am concerned on so many levels.
Can anyone help me?
Here to hold your hand. I've been there, I know exactly what you're feeling.
Blonde hair, sex on legs.... ahhhh (gentle sigh)
Yep, I was on it under a different name That thread, as corny as it sounds, changed my life. It made me realise that I was far from alone and it gave the courage to explore my sexuality properly and I now probably identify as 90% gay. It was/ is tough sometimes for certain people to understand, believe even, because as my name suggests, I don't fit the lesbian " stereotype". I'm very feminine, which honestly made it harder and more complicated to come out. But anyway, that thread meant a lot to me, as you can imagine.
So tell us more OP about your situation.
Be great to hear from all the original TT ladies too
OMG! You are here! Thank you SO much for posting. I am new to this.
toolongwithout Much hand holding will be necessary! :-) I like the sighing!
notthestereotype Thanks for support. I understand what you mean, as I have been reading back to those posts and am understanding so much more about myself. I, too, am very feminine but there have been hints in my past about possible bi tendencies.
Ok. I will tell some of my story in a new post. I'm shaking with excitement and fear and everything :-) Thank you for holding my hand. I'm so scared!
Ok. Here is a bit of my story. I might change a few details in case the wonderful woman in question stumbles on this. I wish I could give more details as the story would make more sense. It sounds a bit bland with the detail knocked out
There's a mum at my DD's school, divorced with DCs. Our kids got together through school. I always thought she was different to the other mums, there is just 'something' about her, you know? I thought it was just that we are similar, seem to like the same things and think in similar ways.
Recently, our DCs have grown closer and as a consequence we have emailed each other more. As our DCs have had more things on, they have spent more time together, and so have she and I. Just traces of each others' company, really, at pick-ups and drop-offs.
Once a every week or so. Our emails have become chattier, a bit more intimate (not about 'us' as such, just about things that are going on, and work and stuff) and she has recommended going to do things together. First one or two things but then quite a few local events. I get the feeling she holds people at arm's length. None of the other mums, just me and the DCs (sometimes she mentions DH).
The emails culminated in her inviting us away for the weekend in the next few weeks. She said I could bring DH but it sounds as though this was not the norm with other people there. She sounded utterly thrilled when I said we could come, also she has sounded so happy each time I say I can attend something, or do something.
It was when the most recent invitation came through that I thought 'WOW! I really like this woman!' She is clever and warm and open and just amazing. And I then realised that I have had a bit of a 'thing' for her. A crush, yes. She has made me feel good about myself (telling) and has given me a sort of confidence. I didn't discuss this with anyone but I did ask one of my DDs why she invites us - and not other mothers - to so many things. DD's first response was 'it's because she likes you'. Independently, someone came up to me recently and said 'Oh, I was talking to so-and-so and they were singing your praises yesterday and saying what an amazing person you are'. When I asked who, they replied with her name.
I hit my car brakes hard when it occurred to me... OMG! She might like me, too! OMG OMG OMG
So I have spent the past week going through the emails with a fine tooth comb in the manner in which only a goo goo ga ga girl in la la land can thinking back to every small thing she did or said, analysing every little act (like when we were sitting together at an event, there was a huge frisson between us). I tested this when we had another event to sit at together, and it was there again. She even says to my face 'you are amazing. No, you are fantastic. You've done a great job doing x or y'. The emails went from just an initial to signings offs of 'Much love', 'Lots of love', etc. In a couple she tells me she loves receiving them.
I can't work things out in my head. Does she like me, or am I imagining it? Even if she did like me, how could I play this out? I am in a loving marriage, I was not looking for this and there is absolutely no way I could break up my family unit but trying to stay away from here is impossible. She is in my every thought, my waking dream.
I know the RATIONAL answer is to stay away. The dream has progressed in my head and not in real life. I should approach with caution. But it is too unusual to give up. Everything she says or does, every little action, it's as though it was meant to be. Perhaps because we are so similar. I wish I could go into more detail. There are many non-verbals but they could also be misconstrued.
Help me to survive this, please! I feel so embarrassed but not sure what about. Part of me wants to hold her, stroke her hand, her neck, her face. To tell her she is doing such a wonderful job with her children (doh I suspect she knows this anyway!). It is a weird sort of love (if I can call it that, yes I think I can), almost innocent and romantic. I want to care for her, too look after her, just lie down and hug her. A huge type of intimacy that I might sometimes have with my DH but not always and not like this. I feel as though I understand her weaknesses better - after all they are similar to mine.
Have I missed some universal signs of liking?! One of her suggestions for a social event was to something loosely involving homosexuality and I told her yes, it would be fun, but that I would have to check dates. I wish I had just said YES now. Maybe this was just coincidence, though.
So many other signals. I am scared that I am misreading them.
Help me, please, oh wonderful and more experienced taverners!
Oh dear, that was long! Also she is at my DDs', not my DD's school.
But does it really matter about genders here? You both appear to be in relationships with other people? And yet youseem to be considering embarking on an affair if she's up for it? Am i missing something or is that the situation?
Wallaby73 I'm afraid I don't think it's as easy as that to explain. She is single and I wish I could go into this further, but I can't without revealing information about myself. I wonder what the Tavern people have done in the past. Are you one?
I've had experiences with women, and am married to a man now, so I think there's much room for fluidity in sexuality. However if you say your marriage is happy, where can this go? If it was a man you were falling for it would be looked upon as the beginnings perhaps of an emotional affair.... Is that how you perceive this?
Not being harsh, just trying to understand where you're coming from.
struck, I understand that you don't want to go into too much personal detail, as you don't want to be outed (not like that )but I think people are going to be confused as to what it is you're looking for. If you're in a happy relationship, then of course the sensible thing to do would be to walk away and I think you said you were, no? However, you might be in an open relationship for all we know and each to their own, of course. If that's not the case though, I really would try hard to let it fizzle.
When I was on the original TT threads, I was utterly miserable and was very unhappy in my relationship, which just so happened to be an EA one. I didn't want to have an affair and that's not what happened, but having this awakening and sharing my feelings with like minded women, gave me the courage to leave, so it helped me on a number of levels. Yes I was developing feelings for another woman before that relationship ended, but I didn't let anything happen until it was officially over.
I got chased off the TT thread once for daring to suggest that cheerleading women into cheating on their husbands (when no such thing had been previously agreed) was still encouraging deceitful, sly and yes, actually cheating behaviour even if it was with another woman
So I am glad to see some more reasoned responses here
OP, if you want a new relationship, end the one you are in first. Or would that threaten your security, that of your kids and financial situation ? You can't have it both ways unless you negotiate opening up your relationship so your husband gets to seek sexual experiences elsewhere too. Anything else is old fashioned shagging around, no matter which way you swing it.
ummmm me too - very similar. Mine has been going on for about a year. It's hard to tell if it's reciprocated. I feel like I want to get away now!! But I can't because she's my best friend and my worst enemy all rolled into one! We have an intense friendship and maybe it is an emotional affair. She's not married, I am, but not that happily. However I don't think seriously about leaving and I think if anything happened between me and my girl friend it would be a nightmare to deal with! If we are gay then we are massively in the closet :-(
I enjoy the fantasy for the time being and because it's been such a long time I think I've calmed down a bit about it all and become more sensible.
We told each other we loved each other the other day. Is that even normal between female friends?!!
We get close then she pushes me away or I do the same.
You've helped me by posting because all this has just been in my head until now!
As for advice, I think let it all calm down a bit because as everyone else will probably say, an affair is an affair full stop.
I'll keep tabs on this thread, I don't do the forum stuff, so I'm not very good at this sort of thing!!
Thanks so much for responding, ClareAbshire, notthestereotype, and AnyFucker
I agree that there is probably more room for fluidity in sexuality than I initially believed. I have always known I have a bit of a 'streak' so to speak, but have not been like this before. My marriage is happy but it might be happier if DH were to accept this. He is very open-minded when we talk about similar scenarios, but I don't know. I actually don't think he would respond in the same way as he would if this were a man. On the contrary, something tells me he would be more accepting. I suspect because it might be viewed as an extension of a friendship, or as discovering a different side to me. I don't know.
I'm not sure what I am wanting from this woman. She is so nurturing and caring, maybe just an extension of that would be ok? I waver so much. I expect she would put at number 1 her children, rightly so.
As for happy relationship - yes, we are happy as in: home sorted, children sorted, jobs sorted etc. but intimacy is not like it would be woman to woman (obviously). I don't know what sort of intimacy I would want from this woman and I don't know how open my DH would be in terms of an open relationship. This has been, like you say, notthestereotype, like an awakening. But would I continue to feel this way in the future, with other women? I just can't imagine it.
AnyFucker I saw when you got chased off the TT thread for saying that.
I don't know if I want a new relationship. I want an extension of the current one, and I don't know if this woman feels the same. The feelings are new and I don't know how to deal with them, or at what stage to share them. I am aware that I can't have it both ways, unless there is agreement from my DH.
Thanks for responses everyone. I appreciate the balanced views.
I'm glad my post helped you, sorry you are in the same position. I am finding it hard to tell if my feelings are reciprocated or if I am imagining things. I keep looking up in articles ways to 'tell' if someone is interested but they vary so much and I know I could be deluding myself.
I'm sorry to hear that yours is also your best friend and, oh dear, worst enemy. So sorry. Sounds very complicated.
I suspect I need some time to let it all calm down, too. Yes, I do think it is normal for female friends to tell each other they love each other, especially old ones.
Hope we can keep each other calm, too. I'm also not good at forum stuff but will keep checking in.
All the time spent emoting about this is energy taken away from your marriage. To me, is is an emotional affair. If my H was having an emotional affair with another man, I would divorce him. Be warned.
Your posts read like someone in the grip of an infatuation. They're giddy and breathless and cringey. You seem to be giving yourself permission to obsess over it because you feel the unexplored dimension to your sexuality and so it's somehow more valid than a crush on a man would be. I don't doubt that you are conflicted but I do think you're at risk of doing something unwise. I can't say what I'd do for sure, in your position, but I think I'd take some practical measures in the immediate term;
As with any crush, try to imagine the reality of a relationship with this person, the drudgery, irritations, mismatch of beliefs. this might be challenging while you're in the grip of an infatuation, but give it a go.
Dramatically reduce contact with your friend. You don't want to, I know, but you need headspace, what you are contemplating is massive. You won't get any clarity while maintaining an intense relationship which feeds your fantasies. Talk to your husband, in a hypothetical way, about your sexuality. What made you aware of your bi streak in the past? Tell him. You're going to need to do a lot more talking, so if you're serious, start now.
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