Confused and upset. Again.

[Justtheonemore]

My husband and I have always had a rocky relationship. I've written asking for advice before. Things got to a point where I felt the need to say, and mean, if things didn't change we needed to end our marriage. Maybe something struck him as different because things were better, much better than they had been, for a long time. Well, until September really.
I'm not sure exactly what altered, it was subtle if there was anything, but I just became irritated that I didn't have the pass code to his phone. It had never even occurred to me before so I do wonder if I subconsciously picked up on a shift in his behaviour, although looking back I still can't see it as he's always attached to his phone. However, suddenly it bothered me that if I picked up his phone and asked to borrow it, instead of telling me the code, he'd take it back and unlock it then pass it back. Then one night, I saw him unlock it and something spurred me into writing down the code. I checked his phone when he'd had a drink and I knew he wouldn't wake. I'm not proud, in fact I hate the fact I did it and wasn't in the habit of checking it. There was nothing there. All ok. Except the next day, he nipped out for 5 minutes and left his phone charging. Something compelled me to check it again. And there were messages from that morning to a woman. The first asked if he'd overstepped the mark, telling her he thought she looked amazing. The next couple flattered her, saying she must have men all over her, then (as she was hungover) in two separate messages (in case she didn't get it the first time) he told her she needed good sex to feel better. Obviously, this caused seemingly endless arguments for a few weeks. He said he was just trying to make her feel better (which hurt as he very rarely compliments me), that the rest was jokey banter. Eventually I decided to believe him. Mainly because, whilst being a complete shit over the years in other areas, I've never had cause to suspect him of anything like this.
Fast forward to this weekend. We went out separately, had good nights respectively. Got in around the same time. And he began a huge argument about me being annoyed a few days ago (because everything domestic and child related falls to me and I was pissed off about it!). He hardly spoke to me yesterday, and this morning has been texting me demanding to know who the man I was speaking to was (I was speaking to a man, a friend of my friend. But not for any real length of time, and about our children), what his name is, asking me to fine this person on Facebook. Telling me I was nuts as there were a set of rules for him, one for me. That he was glad he knew 'the rules' now, he could talk to other women whilst out. I told him it sounded like he felt guilty about something and was projecting. Which didn't go down well.
I'm so tired of him treating me like I'm constantly sleeping around. I went out a few weeks ago (again, at the same time as him) and he didn't text or speak to me once. Until he got home first and I wasn't there. Then I go no end of phone calls, texts, name calling, telling me to sleep with as many people as I liked, and he left his key in the door so I couldn't get in. Sad part is, I'm so used to it I preempted his actions and took the side door key.
So now, despite me doing nothing untoward, I'm getting accusations and nastiness. Again. And he just brushes off what he did. And on top of that, someone I know must have reported back that I had a conversation with a male as there isn't another way he'd know about it. Because why would he? It was a conversation about my gorgeous with no physical contact in a packed pub.
He just somehow has a way of making me feel bad about myself.

Sorry, its so long and now I'm worried I'm making a mountain out of a molehill and me feeling wretched is me overreacting. Can't get a thought straight in my head.

[AMumInScotland]

You're not overreacting. Sorry, but he seems to be using your behaviour (which is fine, by the way, in case you need to hear that) as a way of excusing his own behaviour.

You caught him out in text conversations which definitely overstepped the mark, however much he excuses it as 'banter'. And now he highlights every conversation you have with a man as if it meant he had done nothing wrong. That's either deliberate as a way of making you shut up and put up with it. Or it's subconscious because he feels guilty and sees guilt everywhere he looks.

I don't know your history, but it sounds like you've been trying to fix things for a while now, without success. Maybe it's time to consider whether there is anything here worth salvaging?

[PoirotsMoustache]

Why are you with him? What are his good qualities? Does he make you happy at all?

[LadyBlaBlah]

Your life with him sounds awful.

What keeps you there?

[AnyFucker]

Is this the way you want to live ?

[Justtheonemore]

Thank you for answering.
I know talking to someone on a night out is ok. I know it....but somehow, he makes me question if I really do know it. I know that sounds ridiculous, but he makes me question myself a lot. Or maybe I do it all by myself?? I feel so confused all the time.
He did overstep the mark. He admitted it (eventually) but said he hadn't meant anything at the time, however looking back he could see it was inappropriate. Although now, regardless of what we're discussing, I feel like I'm not supposed to bring it up. Its over. For him, maybe, but its still quite fresh in my mind.
I think now I wonder if his accusations are a way of saying "you see, we're both guilty of it!", even if he's having to change the goalposts. Or maybe its his way of diverting from what he may still be doing (I have to face the possibility, the little voice in my head won't let me dismiss it outright).

[makeitabetterplace]

He sounds frightening. If you're having to take a differ they because you suspect your own husband will lock you out of the house there's something seriously wrong here.

[PeppermintPasty]

You could have a lovely peaceful life without all this. It sounds draining. Do you love him? He sounds very cavalier about you.

[LadyBlaBlah]

I'm tired just reading your posts.

You only have so much headspace and yours is being filled up with total crap. Really, there's more to life than this drama about nothing.

You seriously think it might be ok for a partner to expect you never to talk to 50% of the population because they have penises?

The only partners who expect this are abusive ones.

Locking you out indicates you may well be dealing with one here.

What do you think?

[Jan45]

He's been sexually explicit with another woman but yet accuses you of talking to a man in a pub.....sorry OP he has no respect for you, he's not even sorry by the sounds of it. You checked his mob because you could see he was hiding something and low and behold he was.

I just couldn't be with a man that had such contempt for me.

[Jan45]

And you are right OP, he is projecting, it's him that can't be trusted, not you.

[Justtheonemore]

What are his good qualities.....
He provides well for us. He'd never think of keeping back excessive amounts of money for himself just because he earned it. He never questions how I spend it, doesn't control me in that way (although, in the past if we've argued just before pay day he has neglected to transfer any money, and then once we'd made up, transferred less than usual as he'd gone on a bender/bought lots of clothes etc. This doesn't happen often though)
I know what that sounds like. Its not like he earns enough to keep me dripping in diamonds, but with five children I hope you all understand why its something I do consider when trying to straighten things in my head.
He can be fun. But the occasions feel rare nowadays.
I'm here because I love him. I've loved him for so long I don't know if I could ever not love him. Even when he's mean, and miserable, and absentmindedly leaving everything to me. Even when I just need the whole thing to end. I still love him. I don't need him, I'm very used to doing everything by myself and I've now found a part time job. I don't need him, I want him. But it feels like he's grinding away everything about me. And I worry every day that our children will think this is normal.
Things always just slip back to normality, he won't talk things through no matter how hard I try. And with the normality, somehow I find it easier to keep plodding on.

[BuzzardBird]

There is nothing to be "confused" about. He is either already or attempting to cheat on you and he is using anything he can to justify it to himself.
He is a pig and will not change. The only way your situation will change is if you see the light and kick his sorry, cheating, controlling ass out of the door.

If not, you will be posting something similar, but worse, in a month or so.

[NoelleHawthorne]

are you in the Uk?

[Jan45]

Work on you OP, his ability to wear you down and make you feel at fault could be because of how he and the relationship make you feel - shit, he seems to hold the cards most of the time and his complete lack of regret is worrying, never mind his obvious move on another woman.

Stop letting him control you so much, do your thing, go out, enjoy yourself - you might think you are madly in love with him but honestly, when you have time apart and are on your own, it's amazing how much happier you could feel.

[AMumInScotland]

Oh dear.

I can see that it's difficult when you are so used to it, and when you love him.

But have a think - do you like him?
Do you think you are happier and more fulfilled in your life because he is in it?
Do you think he is good for you?

I think those are far less likely to be true than you loving him. Love doesn't make it all okay, it just makes it harder to accept that it's not okay.

He has used money in the past as a way to punish you.
He has locked you out of the house - and that's something he's done often enough that you plan for it.
He projects his own guilt onto you.
He makes you question yourself constantly, until you don't feel like you can even be 'you' any more.

[AnyFucker]

If my H locked me out of the house, he would no longer be my H

Just what exactly did he want you to do ? Sleep in the shed ? Have you begging and crying to be let in like some sort of whipped puppy, making a show of all of you for the neighbours ?

he has no respect for you

[Justtheonemore]

The thing is, despite us having some major problems over the years (and I'm being completely truthful) other women has never been one of them. I've had experience of being cheated on, I don't think I'm an expert obviously but I didn't enter this relationship with a naive view it'd never happen to me....because it already had. So where has it suddenly come from? I've put up with some serious issues on his part over the years, I've tried hard to make it work. I couldn't make that work.
I admit to locking him out of the house before, he probably got the idea from me. Only ever after he'd been drinking for 12 hours + and I was wary of letting him back in such a state. He can be extremely mean when he's drunk. I know it doesn't excuse locking him out, and I can't complain that he did the same (although I never did it merely because he was out!)

[SweetErmengarde]

And you don't have to stop loving him to acknowledge that the relationship is unhealthy and needs to end.

[ofmiceandmen]

Perhaps I'm missing something, you've come here to save the relationship so I won't cut into your decision.
Where are the times you go out together, share things and 'us' time.
5 children means you're not going to have a lot of personal time during normal times.
So maybe share those nights.
He's behaviour is malicious, vengeful or bordering on abusive. It's not to be excused.
But I'm not reading enough we in any of your posts.

[AnyFucker]

There is a difference between locking someone out because you fear their behaviour and locking someone out as a punishment

[ofmiceandmen]

I'm always amazed at so many couples who go out separately every chance they get, then come home to berate each other or accuse one another.

You didn't come together to breed then never share the fun that brought you together.

I'm all for LTB if you've both worked at the unit outside

[Justtheonemore]

We rarely go out, even rarer without the children. Time is scarce (he works long hours, now I work around them), I suppose I feel the time we are together should be with the children. We do occasionally go out together, but mainly if we're out we're out separately. He does go out Saturday dinner times, to see his friends.
Going out together would be nice, but I think the children need family time too and its a sacrifice we're making. Possibly too much of a sacrifice?

[Justtheonemore]

If we're out separately (and it is a rare occurrence as babysitters for five aren't easy to organise unfortunately), I'm always happy to meet up later on. Lots of couples I know have an arrangement like that, see you in X pub at 10? He usually says we'll not bother. I think because nights are rare he prefers time with his friends rather than time as a couple for us. Maybe he already thinks he sees me enough, in the house at night. I don't feel its the same though. He says I just want to control him. I really don't.

[ofmiceandmen]

I'm probably wrong but this is an uninformed opinion (wiser people will no doubt offer better advise.

1. He is a bit of a child - somewhere along the line he feels you hurt his pride. al his actions in his head are a mirror. You did this to me, so I will do this to you.
   

Every action you have took made him look at himself and he didn't like what he saw, but instead of changing he's trying to show you .. "you see, you are just as shit as me"

1. You need some together time. Without you two working as a 'one' there will no longer be the family you are working so hard to keep.
   

Have fun for crying out loud. You both feel all you get to see of each other is mummy or daddy and criticism, and not the person who made you laugh and you fell in love with.

Like I said probably wrong. but there is too much martyrdom in this relationship. him feeling owed for being a provider etc etc -
Time to just find each other perhaps.

[SweetErmengarde]

Given your OP, I would say the reason he wants seperate nights out is that he doesn't want you to catch him out.