DH and I have fallen out over his support of his cheating friend. Wwyd?

[NoMarymary]

DH has had a long friendship with another man who confided about 3 years ago he was unhappy with his marriage (about 20 yr). 2 children 14, 19 at time of breakup.

He and his wife are consultant doctors. He has a business and she is part time. Anyway DHs friend had a secretary who he fell in love with and (according to him) did not have sex with until he split with his wife....and there goes another flying pig, but DH believes it!

I have always liked the friend and he and secretary have just got married. Initially he felt, and expressed how bad he felt about his wife but has now taken to saying she has turned their daughter against him. DD is now 21 and a graduate and I don't believe for one minute she is not her own person. She won't meet with her dad. His DS is ok with the new couple.

I got extremely pissed with DH for condemning the ex W because she has never been anything but considerate, kind and thoughtful towards him. He house sat for them and she would leave meals prepared, sends Xmas cards and gave him a gift voucher etc. imo him commiserating about the ex W just increases the DFs belief he is the victim. To me it is victim blaming and let's the DF not take responsibility for ruining his relationship with his DD.

I have refused to go to their post wedding party and frankly am disgusted with the lot of them! Originally I felt the DF was unhappy and as you have only one life then go for it but am feeling increasing dislike for him. That's awful because he is a genuinely kind man in most ways but there have been hints of his selfishness.

What is the best way to handle this? Reason with DH or just make the subject taboo. Annoyed with DH for taking such a black and white view and we are currently very frosty!

[HappyGoLuckyGirl]

Could you reach out to the ex-wife? Befriend her maybe? You said she always did nice things and seemed lovely, so why not?

Screw the rest of them.

[BiancaDelRio]

I feel for you OP.

DP has a close colleague who was married to a lovely woman.

He then started an affair with someone in the office. When I would meet DP and his work friends for drinks these two would be all over each other dry humping in the corner in front of all his colleagues who knew he was married [angr.

His wife found out, they split and now he has married and had a baby with the OW. DP couldn't understand why I did not want to go to the wedding .

I agree with the previous poster's suggestion of reaching out to the ex wife. She sounds lovely. As do you.

[BarbarianMum]

Honestly it may be best to agree to disagree when it comes to this and avoid talking about it. Your summation of the situation may be correct but it's never really possible to know what goes on between 2 people. And it is perfectly possible to have and support friends despite their imperfections.

I wouldn't be happy with my dh bad mouthing the ex wife to me but I wouldn't expect him to condemn his friend either.

[Squidstirfry]

You dh's loyalties obviously lie with his cheating man friend, but that does not mean yours have to. You don't have to like all his mates.

[NoMarymary]

Thank you

I did have a nice chat with the ex wife a few months ago. I didn't see the cold distant woman she has been painted, but she doesn't live near us and I've heard she has started a new relationship. I wonder if that has influenced the DF to put the knife in?

I made a huge effort to see the DFs point of view about 'I must be with x to be happy' but so uncomfortable with the cheating. At first he seemed genuinely sorry for what his wife went through but now it's all 'the evil witch'. I could accept it when he showed remorse and socialised with him and the sec but now I'm not so comfortable with it.

I just want DH to accept my feelings on the subject and not keep taking his side. He can be neutral and I think he should. DH thinks if someone is your friend you back them up whether they are right or wrong

Don't get me started on what I think of that last sentence! Its up there somewhere with the justification people use of taking it out on your nearest and dearest

[NoMarymary]

I think we will just have to agree not to discuss the subject. I just want DH to accept that his friend isn't perfect and have an adult conversation about the rights and wrongs or the situation without him going off in a huff! He can support his friend without slagging off the exW but he should at least admit to me in private that the daughter has made up her own mind about her dad's actions and not repeat his DFs opinions as gospel.

In other words he should admit that I am right

Realistically I will just say I don't want to discuss them again because his attitude of defending the indefensible has made me rethink my opinion of his two friends.

I do think men compartmentalise more and don't see the bigger picture. he's my friend and can do no wrong

[FelicityGubbins]

I went through similar with my DH a few years back, I not only told him that I found his friends behaviour and subsequent re writing of history vile, but that his (dh) blase acceptance of such behaviour was making me seriously question his decency and moral fibre (accompanied by the slamming down of his Sunday dinner in front of him) he soon shut up!

[Quitelikely]

The 21 yr old is quite clearly very angry and hurt that her father decided to commit adultery. She is choosing to punish him by refusing to see him. Her choice.

I can't understand why your dh can't see that?

Similarly don't let a cheating dog come between you. It's not worth it, it doesn't really matter and won't change what happens.

I too would take a negative view of people who had committed adultery!

As a side note: Why oh why is the boss always bloody running off with the secretary? Is it because really when he is hiring her he is secretly interviewing for a new wife? !

[pompodd]

Doesn't seem to me like you can fairly criticise him for taking a "black and white" view when you are doing the same - refusing to go to their post-wedding party, saying you are disgusted by them all.

You don't really know what goes on in a marriage between two people and I suspect you shouldn't get involved with or speculate about what the DD and DS of this friend think about the situation. If I understand it correctly you only know this friend through your DH and you and the ex-W weren't friends separately?

I'm not saying that you aren't right, just that you probably shouldn't fall out with your DH over this.

[CogitoErgoSometimes]

'he's my friend and can do no wrong'.... is just loyalty. Maybe he's failing to see both sides of the argument and maybe you will have to stop talking about this man if you disagree but I don't think his loyalty should be a reason to get angry.

I've lost count of the number of female friends down the years to whom I've had to say 'you're better off without the bastard' and have had it said to me in return. Even if 'the bastard' was a decent bloke, it's not what they want to hear.

[Annarose2014]

You have to stop talking about it. Both of you. Its done, she's in a new relationship.....let it go.

So that means he can meet his friend as often as he likes, but he can refrain from regaling you afterwards with new tales of the evil Ex. Just say "you can skip over that part, please" and refuse to get into an argument about why. You have a choice about what bullshit you listen to.

In other words, you are at risk of damaging your own relationship by getting into endless circular arguments about this couple. Neither of you will ever be proven "right". Unless the Ex Wife turns into some batshit crazy psycho who torches the house or something. Which is unlikely.

So its gonna remain "he said/she said" till the end of time. Are you going to be arguing about this couple for the next 10 years? I promise you they don't think about you two that much!

[loloftherings]

I did have a nice chat with the ex wife a few months ago. I didn't see the cold distant woman she has been painted

When my cousin and his wife split, when I saw her she was perfectly lovely. He was fine too. But when they were together or had to interact they were hideous and nasty. It's their (ex) relationship, you aren't in it. Maybe she is cold and distant to him.

I do think men compartmentalise more and don't see the bigger picture. he's my friend and can do no wrong

You don't think women do this?
Loads of women I know have fast friends they stick with through thick and thin, through their mistakes, etc.

[Twinklestein]

This is not about the couple it's about you and your husband, and I wouldn't be happy either with my husband accepting a dishonest version of events. Defending the indefensible is just really irritating.

Being a friend doesn't equal being a sap, he should be able to see the wood for the trees. You can be a loyal friend and admit someone's faults.

Does he put his mates on a pedestal?

It's all very well saying don't talk about it but this will come up every time you have to see this guy. I wouldn't mind my husband remaining friends with a cheat if he admitted in private the wrongdoing. But if he condoned the nonsense I would refuse to see the bloke full stop. But then I'm arsey like that, I'm not necessarily recommending it.

[enriquetheringbearinglizard]

In my world you speak as you find. This included one of my best friends who started an emotional affair which later became physical. We never fell out but there was absolutely no doubt that I didn't agree with the behaviour and didn't intend to bite my tongue either. I was there to lend support after the fallout, but quite clear that it had been a self fulfilling prophecy and she had been very stupid not to see that no good would come of it.

I wouldn't be happy with anyone agreeing when the Ex was badmouthed in any way unless they'd experienced it for themselves.

[SolidGoldBrass]

Just because she is 'lovely' top you doesn't guarantee that she wasn't a cunt to her H. Of course, she may be a perfectly pleasant woman and her XH a selfish fannyrat, or they may simply have outgrown each other. The point it that you don't know the truth. I think you need to keep your beak out. No one really knows what goes on in someone else's marriage, and you don't get to control your H's friendship because you fancy yourself as the Monogamy Police.

[todayiamfat]

Wow. I know in theory some of you are right about this, but no way did the df have an affair because his wife was a cunt to him.

OP, i am on the dw in this situation (not literally) and i work with the stbx. I have mad it clear to our friends and colleagues that i don't expect them to take sides although most can see through the arsehole

I think you are totally free to not go to the wedding. Your dh is also free to go. I too think you should just agree to disagre. Why let the cock make things difficult for you two?

[NoMarymary]

Omg this friend and his new wife are on the highest pedestal you can imagine!

I have socialised with all the people involved,including the DD and DS, and I accept you never knows what goes on in a marriage but to me if you are unhappy, get out and then start a new relationship, don't sneak about behind the back of someone who trusts you. The affair was going on for quite some time.

pom I didn't see this relationship and cheating in black and white initially but as a marriage that wasn't working and someone who had found his real soulmate. It's this blaming his exW when his DD has clearly made her own choice that has turned me against them. It's just cowardly and not taking responsibility and I dont feel I want to celebrate a marriage based on lies and cheating. Something, btw, this friend was worried about, how his wider circle of friends would react. Theyve mostly accepted the OW now so I think he is doing a fair bit of history rewriting. I felt more sympathy towards them when he seemed genuinely sorry about the pain he had caused his exW. Now it feels like victim blaming.

We've only argued about it once and as you say it's not worth coming between DH and me.

Twinkle. I am arsey too I think. I could socialise with the newlyweds for DHs sake if he admitted the nastiness of the situation, it wouldn't stop him liking his friend but the blind acceptance makes me think DH lacks any morality too.

I don't believe the exW was a cunt to anyone, their marriage was outwardly successful but (according to the DF) they had grown apart and didn't share the same interests or hobbies. ExW loved playing tennis and DF would go with her as she would with him to various functions connected to his hobby. When he left he took everything in the wardrobe and deliberately left the tennis racket as the only thing. It was unbelievably cruel. ExW cried in DHs arms over this rejection of her and everything she though they shared together. I really don't like this man much anymore and would struggle to socialise any more. I've never interfered or discussed this with any of them. I'm certainly not the monogamy police! Where have I said I wanted his to stay with the exW? I'm uncomfortable with cheating so if that makes me PC monogamy Plod, so be it!

I am going to tell DH the subject is off limits and not give them any further head time. They're not worth it.

[Twinklestein]

I don't think this is about policing relationships. I don't personally judge people for cheating. I have a good friend I have supported through all manner of unwise relationships, however I'm more than aware of her faults. I have another friend who cheated on her husband because he cheated on her.

I don't think cheating automatically casts you into outer darkness. But I think how you deal with the fallout says a lot about your character and values.

In this case, it's not the cheating per se that bothers me. Relationships go wrong, people don't behave as well as they should, that's inevitable.

Refusing to admit you started an affair before you ended the relationship with your wife, though, is cowardly. Assuming that your daughter has been poisoned by her mother, rather than legitimately pissed off, is weak.
Creating a false narrative to manipulate your friends at your ex's expense is dishonourable.

What bothers me is that it calls into question her husband's ethics that he so blithely accepts his friend's dodgy narrative.

Personally, OP, if I don't like someone I don't bother with them. I don't think you should feel any obligation to see this man if you don't want.
Leave your husband to his pedestal...

[NoMarymary]

I don't automatically condemn cheating even though I am uncomfortable with it. You only have one life and I can't see the point in staying with someone who makes you unhappy. I could have been done better but I put that aside.

It's all this not taking the responsibility that I hate and blaming his exW.

But definitely it is my DH not having the backbone to recognise how unfair his DF is being to his exW and DD.

Initially DH was quite squeamish about the affair side of it and felt sympathy for the W but it's this about face I can't stand.

I normally don't waste time on people I don't like either and will explain to DH why I won't be socialising with them any more.

[Surreyblah]

So you could spend time with the cheating DF and new partner (OW) when he seemed contrite, but not now he is badmouthing his ex? Like the straw that broke the camel's back?

Fair enough I guess!

must be v frustrating that your H is going along with the badmouthing, and spending time with them, perhaps agreeing to disagree might be best.

[Twinklestein]

I think that's totally fair enough.

[Bogeyface]

I've heard she has started a new relationship. I wonder if that has influenced the DF to put the knife in?

This may well be it.

He didnt love her and left her for another woman, she was devastated. There is nothing that strokes an ego than 2 people in love with you. But she has done the unforgivable and moved on, she was not supposed to do that. It means that actually, he wasnt all that and she is probably glad that he did fuck off now she knows what he is capable of. She was supposed to stay in love with him forever with him chucking the odd crumb of niceness that she treasures and makes him feel good.

Personally I wouldnt want anything to do with him either. Own your actions, if you did something wrong then accept it, own it and move on, stop trying to blame someone else. His DD has her own mind and by suggesting she has been poisoned by the ex is insulting in the extreme, as it says that he thinks she is stupid enough to fall for it!

[BadLad]

Could you reach out to the ex-wife? Befriend her maybe?

Is it just me who thinks this is an awful idea?

[NoMarymary]

Surrey. No I have not spent a lot of time with the DF and OW. They dropped in once with DH unexpectedly and I gave them lunch. They were both very nice though and I had previously always liked the DF. I socialised far more with DF and his exW but mainly with other people there.

I felt more sympathy for him when he felt contrite. Probably a bit shallow of me I admit.

I don't think the exW needs befriending as such. I will have the odd chat with her on the phone (neutral subjects) as DH will probably still house sit for her.

Bogey. I think that's how it feel. ExW has moved on instead of sitting at home crying. Hence he can blame her for turning DD against him, which is rubbish.

I am not socialising with them because the more I think of his actions (he left exW when her father was dying (he died within weeks) the more I don't like him. He is lovely to chat to, seems caring and fun, but his actions have a streak of selfishness and cruelty that's not for me. It will upset DH that I reject the man who walks on water DF but tough.