Trying to hold it together but screaming inside!

[Missesbumble]

I don't really know where to start, but I'll try to be as clear as possible.

I think DH is up to something but I've no idea what, it's driving me insane that I know there's something not right but can't find any real proof.

Basically DH spends a lot of time on his iPad, chatting on hobby forums, gaming etc but nothing untoward on his browsing history. However, his phone bill tells a different story. I'd suspected something was amiss a year or so ago and since DH has online billing I couldn't check his phone records. It all began over me asking could I use his phone because mine had died and he got all possessive over it. Kept telling me mine would be charged enough to use soon, he didn't want me breaking his yadda yadda. I got a bit pissed off by his response and asked what his problem was, had he something to hide. He got all defensive on me and began arguing shifting it all on to me and accusing me of being paranoid.

He eventually let me use his phone but the seed of doubt had been planted. I asked to see his bills and after him trying to blow me off with, I've got issues, he couldn't remember his password etc etc he eventually remembered his password when I wouldn't back off.

There was nothing incriminating in calls or texts but I did notice a huge amount if web activity on his phone. I asked what he was doing surfing on his phone so much when he was constantly on the iPad and he gave some lame excuse about he knew his obsession with his hobby bugged me sometimes so he used his phone rather than the iPad so I wouldn't get annoyed. At the time I just thought 'muppet' and told him hiding stuff about it is a problem not the hobby as such. (He's a pigeon fancier, if anyone is wondering lol) it's not my cup of tea but it rocks his boat so I tend to keep my gob shut about it.

Anyway, fast forward to a couple of weeks ago. I had a weird but feeling that something wasn't right so I tried logging into his online phone billing account again. Strangely he'd changed the password from the original one, so I had to request a new one. I checked his billing info and again nothing in calls/texts but huge amounts of web use. I dug a little further and found he is accessing it when he's out in the garden, when he's gone to the supermarket, if he's nipped out to pick something up, when he's gone up to bed before me and early hours if the morning when I'm still asleep. It all looks very strange. One particular instance to put it into perspective was Monday evening. He'd been on his iPad doing whatever for the evening when he remembered he needed to print off a CV. We tried printing it but the ink cartridge had run out. He nipped down to tesco, a 5 minute car ride to pick one up. He phoned me at 9.45 to tell me he'd got one and to check it was the correct one. The call lasted about a minute. He returned home almost 20 minutes later and on checking web activity he was online on his phone after phoning me.

Having checked now I've pinpointed days and times of when he's surfing on his phone and I'm never around at those times. He's like a secret surfer on his phone and I'm now wondering what the hell he does on there that's so secretive and time consuming.

Am I being paranoid and seeing too much into this. I've got so much shit going on at the moment with work, I really don't need this :-(

[Missesbumble]

P.s, I suspects I've accessed his account. He said he received a message to say his password had been changed successfully. Stupidly I just played numb and denied it when he asked was it me embarrassed

He looked really tired this evening so I told him he could do with an early night and he got all arsy. He's gone to bed now but been really shifty all evening, quiet and blunt. He got up, checked the back door was locked, walked back into the living room, covered his eyes with his arm and said I'm going up now I'm tired with a fake yawn and not even looking at me.

Sorry I feel like I'm waffling now :-/

[VeryStressedMum]

Could be looking at porn? What do you think he's doing?

[Missesbumble]

That was my initial feeling, strangely though he's never been into porn. We've been married 20 years and he's appeared uninterested when discussed in the past.

My friend has suggested maybe he's signed up to fb or something. Some of the timings of his net use seem rather strange though to be porn related.

I've wrestled with the idea of OW, he's had an EA in the past but he never goes out so meeting up with someone would be hard work for him

[jynier]

Oh dear, OP! Many red flags here! Doesn't look good!

My instincts suggest OW. Hope that I am wrong! Best wishes!

[VeryStressedMum]

He may be acting suspiciously but that doesn't necessarily mean he's doing anything. Could you ask him if he's on fb?

[Missesbumble]

Seeing the red flags myself too, it's stressing me out but I know from past experience any suggestion of OW would be met with anger. When I suspected and asked last time he freaked out, called me paranoid and stupid, made out that everything was in my head and I needed help.

It was a massive blow to eventually discover the truth and all the lies and deceit over months he'd put me through.

Talking to him doesn't really get me anywhere, he stonewalls me and constantly blame shifts so everything's about me and my faults, issues, problems etc etc. he's grown to be very clever at hiding stuff from me. I've found out things by digging on intuition but he will only ever admit to anything when I have hard facts and even then he says he hides things from me and lies, or rather truth avoidance to protect me so I'm not annoyed with him.

He persistently denied OW being in the picture for months even though I had huge suspicions, he made me believe I was paranoid and insecure.

I've gone back to October 2011 on his bills and it's a similar picture month on month?

[Missesbumble]

He'd deny he was on Facebook, me, our DC and most of the family are fb members. I rarely go on but the DC and his mum are regular users.

[Takingbackmonday]

I may be wrong but I think whatsapp (like new msn messenger) uses Internet but doesn't show on bills

[dunsborough]

This is weird OP and I know you know that this is no way to live.
You sound smart and I hope you get some good advice here. If he won't tell you, I guess you have to bide your time...

[niceupthedance]

Things that use a lot of mobile data are videos and music etc. I think it's porn.

[ateddybearfromdelaware1]

It's probably gaming or something.

[DorothyBastard]

Could it be gambling? Do you have joint finances? Xx

[DorothyBastard]

Sorry about the errant, unintentional kisses!

[WipsGlitter]

I was thinking gambling. Or porn.

[QuiteSo]

It's probably WhatsApp. My cheating husband wrote to OW on it nearly every day. I was able to read the whole sordid story of their pathetic romance.

[Hissy]

He's not a mumsnetter is he? It's flaming addictive!

Seriously, your instincts are telling you, and the online usage is telling you that there's something going on.

I don't know how you're going to get the truth out of him, but perhaps you won't until you make it enough of a big deal. Ie, ultimatum time, fess up or piss off.

(((hug)))

[VeryStressedMum]

Regardless of what he's doing on his phone, the way he won't talk to you and blaming you for everything is the problem.
You shouldn't have to dig around for clues to find out what's going on. First of all he shouldn't really be behaving in such a way that would make you feel like this, he would know after the other time that him behaving like this will make you think the same thing is happening again.
I know what I would do which would be to tell him in no uncertain terms what I thought and get his phone off him. If he tried to shift it round that it was my fault I'd be telling him that this crap won't work anymore we both know it's not me...I would be telling him that I am quite clearly not delusional and paranoid because it was proved I was right and I'm not falling for the same bs again so don't even try.
That's what I would do, and probably worse, but it may not 've right for you. Just don't let him get into your head and start to think you are what he tells you you are being.
And when he says he hides things to protect you...he means to protect himself.

[MissScatterbrain]

Sounds very dodgy esp given the fact that he has a history of cheating.

You do not need "proof" - the fact that he lies and is secretive is enough. Your only option is to ask him to hand over the phone there and then or you will end the marriage. You will have to be prepared to mean it though.

He doesn't sound very invested in the marriage given the time he spends on gaming/forums etc. What is your relationship like generally?

[CogitoErgoSometimes]

I agree with the PP that you don't need proof. This is one of those cases where I think you go with your suspicions and make it up to him to prove he's trustworthy rather than the other way around. The relationship is dead in the water already so if there's nothing going on and you've burned your bridges, you've lost nothing but gained self-respect. If there's something going on.... and his unreasonably angry response sounds very OTT.... then you've also lost nothing.

[Missesbumble]

Good morning and thank you all for your input. I'll try to respond to each post.

I'm not sure if he knows how to use whatsapp? The DC use it a lot I think the send photos to each other or maybe that's snapchat, I can't keep up lol. I've never used it but I know DH is smarter with his phone than he makes out. I don't know how to use his phone properly I find it quite confusing. He has a samsung, whereas I'm used to iPhones.

It is no way to live, you are right. It's draining. I'm in the process of setting up my own business and away in London next week for 2 days on a course. I'm scared about it all and feeling quite stressed as it is and this is not helping. When I discovered the OW last time I went off like a firework and found out hardly anything, he lied and backtracked continually and gave himself time to think and decide what to say while I was losing the plot. I'm trying to keep calm and play the long game this time. Can't say it's OW again but something's definitely not right!

He's not into music and he doesn't game on his phone, his gaming apps are on the iPad. He rarely ever takes his phone out of his pocket tbh, odd text/call to family and that's the only time I see it.

We don't have joint finances as such. I've been the main bread winner for the past 10 years, he has a card to my account which is used for bills, shopping etc. he has his own account but since the tax credits, child benefit is paid into my account it's a case of what's mine is ours what's his is his. It's not bothered me for years when the DC where younger but now they're adults/teens it's started to bug me that he rarely spends his money unless it's on himself or his hobby.

Definitely not gambling, he's too tight for that lol. Thanks for the kisses though much appreciated :-)

He's not a MNetter, as much as I'm aware, he mocks me when He sees me reading the talk forums. He does visit forums/sites of his own interest which I think he's a little addicted to. He's on them on the iPad so unsure why he would do that on his phone too?

I slept on the sofa last night, well slept of a sorts! I kept asking myself what the hell I'm doing. I don't know if I'm even getting my needs met or am happy anymore. Yes, we have a huge amount of history together, yes, always wanted my marriage to be forever. Yes, we have DC & GC to think about but is that enough to stay together for :-(

I can't even count the times I've tried to talk to him about things, tried to sort out problems or concerns over the past few years since the EA. There was never any grand gestures from him but I firmly believe he loved and still loves me but I'm starting to wonder what it is he loves. He spends his time watching tv programmes I have little or not interest in or on his iPad. It bothers me occasionally and when I say something about it he'll have a moan but then show a bit more consideration for the next day or two then it's back to normal and a vicious cycle of the same ensues.

We do have a similar sense of humour, we do laugh and joke together and are generally friends and rub along ok. It's slowly been going down hill IMO but when trying to discuss anything with DH he says he's happy and loves me and accuses me of being dramatic or expecting fairytales when it's just not like that in RL.

I've sensed a shift in what we want in life, we both seemed to want the same thing years ago now it's not like that. He puts little in but expects more out. He's supporting in my business but he puts little in but I know for sure when the money's coming in he'll sure has he'll be happy to take that out.

I know I'm not going to get anything out of him trying to talk to him. I checked his phone bill again this morning and he was on the web on his phone when he went up to bed, even though he said he was tired.

[ImperialBlether]

So, to summarise:

he keeps his own money for himself and is happy to spend yours

he spends a lot of time online but is secretive about it to the extent of escaping from the house to do it

he makes excuses as to why he should go out (eg the CV) and when he's out he's online when he could've come home and logged on there

he's had an emotional affair in the past but tried to make you feel you were going mad rather than admit to it

he is a pigeon fancier yet mocks you for coming onto MN

he's shifty

he stonewalls you

he shifts the blame onto you whenever he can

OP - this is not a nice, decent man. You can do a lot better than this. He sounds like:

a) a cocklodger
b) unfaithful
c) a pretty nasty piece of work

[MissScatterbrain]

He sounds shit.

He cheated in the past and got away with it so I bet its not the last time he cheated.

[Missesbumble]

It looks crap when you write it all down like that, I feel physically sick and holding back tears wondering where it all went wrong! He was so sweet, kind, loving and generous when we met he made me believe that some men are good again after 2 shitty and abusive previous relationships.

I can't believe how my life has come to this, I would never have taken this shit when we met, so why now?

I've just been going through his bills again. My mum died in 2012. She was taken into hospital and put on life support for a lung infection she was struggling to fight. The machine was turned off the day after and I was in bits. We sat with her while she passed and then everyone left apart from me and eldest DC. We stayed with her for a while and DH went out with the others. on checking his bills there's a call made at that time to a number I don't know and he was web browsing on his phone. Maybe I'm looking too much into this now but my stomach is churning now wondering what was so important to check online while I was sat crying hysterically beside the body of my mum :-(

[MissScatterbrain]

How awful

Its well known that abusive men turn on the charm in order to reel in their victims - who often have a history of abusive relationships.

[JoinYourPlayfellows]

Talking to him doesn't really get me anywhere, he stonewalls me and constantly blame shifts so everything's about me and my faults, issues, problems etc etc. he's grown to be very clever at hiding stuff from me. I've found out things by digging on intuition but he will only ever admit to anything when I have hard facts and even then he says he hides things from me and lies, or rather truth avoidance to protect me so I'm not annoyed with him.

Just ask him to leave.

Really. This is no way to live.

He treats you really badly.