Strip club

[Roundtheruggedrocks]

I've lurked on the relationship section for a while, am aware of the wide variety of opinions and find it really insightful. I wondered if MN could cast their eye over this and tell me what to do about it?

DH (we're newly married, no DCs) two months ago lied to me about going to a strip club with friends and having a lap dance. I found out through our mutual bank account records (DH is stupid and disorganised over that stuff) and got very upset. I spent a week not talking to him, heard all his explanations (he maintains it wasn't a lie, that he was drunk and would have told me the truth when he sobered up,) but I checked the online account so soon the next day that he didn't have a chance to tell me the truth. i threatened to leave and DH said no way - started crying, said he'd do anything, that he doesn't even enjoy lap dances and remembers nothing from that evening.

In the past (before he met me) DH went to strip clubs with friends maybe twice a year - on stag dos, so I know that he knows the ropes and it wasn't a one-off in his life. He told me when we first met that he had been to these places too. i admittedly hadn't been clear to DH that getting a lap dance was a deal breaker for me, which is his main argument. He says if he had known he wouldn't have done it and he thought because we had talked about his past experiences there that I would be fine with it.

But why lie? This is what bugs me. He doesn't get it - he maintains he didn't lie - that he was just drunk and tired and didn't want me to go ballistic. I need to get over this and get on with our marriage, me continually bringing it up poisons every good time we have together.

Aside from the lap dance thing, DH and I have a great relationship - he treats me like a queen, hence why this insecurity has suddenly come out of the blue. I've started to think that maybe DH likes the stripper thing - the platinum blonde, big tits, body make-up thing (I am a pale, flat chested brunette) and I have become insecure about my looks and weight too. What do you think I should do?

[overture]

I find him saying I didn't know lapdances were a dealbreaker really shocking.
Do you really have to sit down and explain to him what he should or should not be doing now that he is married/in a relationship even???

That also for me would be a dealbreaker if my DH had a lapdance, and even more so if he'd said "had I known I wouldn't have"?!?
what the hell?? really?

Even though you say it is a great relationship, as you said you're newly married, for me personally that wouldn't boost my confidence for our future.

Really sorry for you

[Leavenheath]

It should have been his own dealbreaker. The fact that it's not says it all.

He's trying to put the blame on you for not explicitly telling him that paying a woman to writhe on his lap isn't acceptable.

I don't suppose you've lectured him that having sex with prostitutes is wrong either, have you? Or that having a sexual relationship with another is wrong?

Or that it would be a dealbreaker if he did those things.

Don't take the blame for not being his moral guardian.

[Roundtheruggedrocks]

He said because I was so "cool" with it while he was recounting stories of his past, he was surprised I was so suddenly not cool with it when he did it in our marriage - and apparetly that was essentially a deception on my part (I do 't believe this by the way!) And now that he knows I don't like it, it'll never happen again.

During the week that we didn't speak, my parents and the in-laws cottoned on to the problem and understood what had happened. All of them told me I needed to "move on" so I felt pressured and outnumbered to forgive and forget.

But I haven't forgotten, it has just stuck in my head.i started counting calories again and have lost about 7 kilos in 2 months (all motivated by the lap dancing incident - how unhealthy!) i tell myself that I feel "above it" now, my wrangling with my weight was my way of getting in control of all the insecuriities it brought up, but I hate that I've been left to try to resolve it by myself.

DH sometimes says "you've lost too much weight what's wrong with you?" And I say "oh - it's all your fault." Very passive aggressive aren't I?! Then he gets annoyed and says "you're keeping it going, just forget it now, it'll never happen again."

I now can't define in my mind whether my perception of him is flawed or not. I've started to believe he looks at other women constantly, but he denies it and says I am acting mad and over-analysing everything. Sometimes I know I am being irrational because I set him up in my mind sometimes to fail... Eg I never wear make up or nail varnish. But I decided that this is what strippers wear, so started to wear into test how he would react. He said one day that he "liked" it and that made me decide that he likes the stripper look. And I think that is irrational of me - DH couldn't win either way in that one in my head. If he hasn't noticed I would've decided he didn't fancy me, when he did, I decided he likes strippers. Messed up logic.

Anyway - anyone think I should just resent my mind, think of that as a false start to our marriag and move on?

[Roundtheruggedrocks]

Sorry reset my mind, not "resent" my mind!

[Leavenheath]

No.

Your husband thinks it's acceptable to pay for sexual services. Even if he was single, that would be wrong.

It should be immaterial whether you agree with it or not.

He thinks this is fine, as long as his partner doesn't know about it, or does and is 'cool' with it.

That's some manipulation on his part to counter-accuse you of 'deception'.

[gertrudestein]

I think it would be a deal breaker for most women for heir husbands to buy a lap dance, and he should know that without being told. The issue is about the objectification of women and sex, and that has obviously had a big effect on your self esteem.

It sounds like you recognise some ongoing insecurities in yourself that have been exacerbated by this problem. They have been triggered by your husband's behaviour in this instance, but are they always there? Ie are you always concerned about yor weight and appearance?

I'm not in any way condoning his behaviour, but perhaps there are two issues here:

1. Do you want to / can you / how can you move on from this issue with your Dh?
   
2. Do you want to/ can you/ how can you move on from using harmful coping strategies on yourself to deal with stress?

[Roundtheruggedrocks]

I have been left with the general impression that he is baffled by my continual complaints about the issue. Baffled that I would even consider this a threat to our marriage or how I it would even enter my thoughts that he 'wanted' a stripper considering he has met and married me. He maintains that evening was purely entertainment and my fussing about it has built it into something bigger than it ever needed to be. He says we should go there together and that he can show me how stupid it is and "dispel the myth" from my mind.

[Roundtheruggedrocks]

Thanks gertrudestein.

1. I think I've got stuck in a cycle of thinking I'll get over it when I've proved things to myself. Ie setting him "traps" like putting make up on and seeing if he likes it. That's totally stupid - I don't think I genuinely know how to move on. He has asked me to just draw a line under it and see how he is for the rest of our marriage. It sounds so simple but my brain obsesses.
   

1. No I don't seem to know how to cope with stress without doing something dramatic. I have a therapist and even talked it through with her and even she did not think it was a big deal! No-one outside of my head thinks it's a deal breaker.

[gertrudestein]

I think you need to decode whether or not you can forgive him. Personally, I find his views repulsive. If a man can think a woman lap dancing is entertainment as opposed to exploitation, then I don't want anything to do with him. Having said that, I also think watching porn is intolerable but I know some very 'nice' men who do, and who are in good loving relationships.

Do you think his behaviour is indicative of his attitude in general? Or do you generally agree with/ appr

[gertrudestein]

Approve of his views and attitudes?

[Leavenheath]

Yes. Baffled's a good word.

He just doesn't see what the big deal is in paying women to sexually service men, or him.

It's not like he'd marry them. He thinks they are beneath him.

They are merely there to sexually please him and others like him. No better than they ought to be.

There are two separate issues here I think. The above is all about his attitudes to men's entitlement to pay for sexual services and towards the women who provide them.

The other one is his lack of comprehension about why this has affected you so personally.

I'd love to see his face if you told him how you'd been to a club, opened your legs and had a bloke nuzzle you through your knickers for money - and then accused your husband of 'deception' if he hadn't expressly told you that this was an unacceptable thing to do.

[Leavenheath]

And get another therapist. That one's a dud. No therapist should bring her own judgement to a client's problem.

[gertrudestein]

Sorry, cross posted. It IS a big deal! But I do think you need to treat the two problems separately. I think you're right, that you're setting him up to fail at the moment, partly because it feeds your own coping strategies.

Do you really want to / believe you can move on with your dp? If so, what is the best way to communicate openly and honestly with him? How can you make him understand your point of view, in a spirit of complete openness - ie taking him at his word that he's sorry and that he wants to make it up to you.

[Fozziebearmum2b]

I'd feel exactly the same as you. I have a complete hatred for strip clubs, and don't see why just because the sexual services are offered in the context of a laugh and a strip club that women should have to accept them-v odd.

Anyways I would imagine reacting the same way you have-ie right in the self esteem. Some girls aren't bothered by it (or pretend not to be) which I find really odd too.... But hey some people live in all sorts of unconventional relationships.

The bottom line is-there's nothing wrong with your reaction, so stop beating yourself up and trying to justify it to yourself and others.

But, you need to decide whether this incident is enough for you to walk away, or give the relationship one more go.

If you go for the latter; You've made clear your feelings and I would have a really honest and frank conversation around how this has deeply affected you ( he needs to work at building back your trust). But if you do this be truly ready to forgive (and not bring up regularly) or else it will eat away at the relationship.

But if you walk away you need to be confident in your decision too, it's a huge decision to walk away from a marriage and hard to go back at a later date if you wished to.

You'd be justified in either, but only you can decide if its a deal breaker.

Good luck

[libertarianj]

As long as he isn't going every week and spending all the money then it's no big deal. An occasional visit to one on a drunken lads night out should be no cause for alarm. It only takes one person in the party to suggest it and it always seems like a good idea at the time, after a few beers.

and it's not a sexual service, it's a striptease and a performance with no touching allowed, despite what people on here might say.

I've started to think that maybe DH likes the stripper thing - the platinum blonde, big tits, body make-up thing (I am a pale, flat chested brunette) and I have become insecure about my looks and weight too. What do you think I should do?

That's a bit of stereotypical view of strippers and is far from the reality. I think you are being too harsh on yourself there.

[Cinacina]

I understand your feelings OP, I can never understand why some women feel it us acceptable or 'fine' for there dh to pay for young women to thrust there vagina or boobs in there dh faces. It surely isn't compatible with a healthy marriage!
Although it is not to an affair level, it is definitely damaging to a relationship. Of course it will effect your confidence, and when people say just move on, it is not that easy when you have images flashing in your head. It is demoralising and makes you feel down about yourself in that you are not good enough do your dh has to look elsewhere (although I'm sure your dh doesn't think so). Men simply don't understand (or don't want to) how damaging there behaviour can be when women are expected to be the 'perfect' being.
For me it would take a lot if getting over, yes we are not 'plants' and it us normal to sometimes find others attractive, but to actively pursue sexual kicks is low and fuels insecurity.
He has to do a lot of work to fix this and build your trust. That means accepting full responsibility and accepting that his behaviour has caused great hurt. Minimising your feelings is poor form and shows a lack of understanding.

What do you want to do?

[Cinacina]

Do you have children op?

[Roundtheruggedrocks]

I want to be with him and to make our marriage work. We have been married under a year and have no kids and everything else about my life with him is great except this one thing which seems to poison everything.

If he started going to strip clubs regularly or showing no regard for the rules I've (now) set then I would LTB, but he hasn't so far. But this irrational obsession has manifested in me which will ruin the relationship if I don't control it.

Sometimes he has a problem keeping hard when he wears a condom when we have sex and I automatically think - he doesn't find me attractive, he wants a stripper and sex disintegrates because I get upset, he loses his erection totally etc.

[Roundtheruggedrocks]

His bafflement at my reaction is interesting - he really puffs up my ego and says things like - why would a woman like you even think for a moment about this stuff? It's below you etc.

He once took a stripper on a couple of dates after meeting her on a stag do (this is part of what he told me before we got together) I asked him why it went no further and he said - are you kidding? She's a stripper, I could never be with someone who did that for a living.

[CajaDeLaMemoria]

There are big holes in his story.

He didn't tell you because he didn't want you to go ballistic - so he knew you'd react badly, that you wouldn't approve of him going.

So he can't, then, have thought that you'd be fine with it. Or he wouldn't have needed to keep it a secret, because you wouldn't bat an eyelid.

He needs to stop lying and twisting everything or you can't move forward. He knew this was a deal breaker, he did it anyway. Why?

Once you've worked that out, perhaps you'll find it easier to heal.

[maleview70]

You need to let this go and get on with being married.

You have expressed how annoyed you were and he now knows that this is of limits in the future. By your own admission you had not made this 100% clear and whatever anyone says, if blokes are on a stag do with mates and had way too much drink then generally they will go along with things.

Your husband sounds a good one overall. Dont throw it away over this because there are not that many completely squeaky clean fellas out there with no skeletons in their closets....

[Branleuse]

i think you need to let it go. Id also have assumed that youd have been ok with it, if you hadnt mentioned anything when hed talked about strip clubs before. Twice a year is quite a lot really

[Badvoc]

Ah...and yet he will happily pay money to see her labia?
Sounds a lovely chap.

[Fozziebearmum2b]

I find, generally, men's views on the strip club thing are alien to me-here's a few conversations I've had over the years....

'I'd sleep with her but never have a relationship with her' So you're happy to use her but not respect her enough for anything else? Weird....

'I can go to a strip club, but I don't want my wife/partner to watch male strippers' huh? Seems pretty hypocritical?

'If we go I'd just stand at the bar and have a quiet drink with the lads' really?! So if naked ladies are dancing around then you'll avert your eyes like a shire horse?hmmm

'I would never let my daughter/sister/wife etc be a stripper/porn etc' But its okay for me to pay into the industry myself by going....everyone there is someone's daughter etc

I'm lucky in that my dh respects my (admittedly strong) views and wouldn't go. But a previous partner went against my wishes and didn't tell me (no private dance) and it came out at a wedding. I was more pd off that he'd lied to me than anything else and massive loss of trust and took a long time to get through it.

I think a lot of your concerns are related to men and women having different views, so you can't understand where hes coming from. But also, it's the going against something he knew was a deal breaker (which others have said). This for me is the most worrying, doesn't matter how drunk etc he was, he should have known. But, everyone makes mistakes-and if he's genuinely sorry then it's worth fighting for.

I do think second to the above trust, you sound like you have self confidence issues. This isn't about how you look, your dh can look around all the time and will meet women all the time, watch films etc, (as can you) but still be loyal and not want you to look like a stripper. He's married you for a reason.

Could there be anything else causing your worries too-ie other niggles with the relationship or any previous self esteem issues which are wading in. Please don't think I'm suggesting your overreacting, but feel like there's something else your hinting at in your messages too