Rationalisation help required please

[BibbettyBobbettyBoo]

Long, sorry.

DH was speaking to his brother on the phone last night. BIL and his GF are considering buying a house, and for financial reasons are thinking about getting it solely in his name. I said that, although it's exactly what we did ourselves, I wouldn't advise it, and that his GF should think very carefully before putting herself in that position.

DH wanted me to clarify, I explained that, although I paid into that mortgage for years, it isn't mine in any way, and if we had split up before getting married (or even probably after) I would be homeless and penniless. He then refused to believe that I paid anything towards the mortgage (he kept saying "I didn't make you pay rent"). He said that I was lying a number of times, still on the phone to his brother. I looked up my old bank statements online, and proved to him that I did indeed make monthly payments, entitled 'mortgage payment', every month between buying and moving out of that house. The amount was approximately half the mortgage plus half of all bills. (He didn't want a joint account for some reason, we do have one now (now I'm the earner and he's a SAHD).

I'm cross now for a number of reasons. He clearly has it in his head that he provided for me over that long period of time, which isn't true. He called me a liar, numerous times, in front of his brother. He has apologised, and doesn't see why I'm still annoyed.

This got me thinking about how he has been WRT money. When we first had kids, I was a SAHM. I worked part time (evenings), studied, and set up a business, but still felt very pressured (by him) to find more work.
He was then made redundant, I got FT work, and he has been a SAHD since. (I was SAHM for 2 years, he has been SAHD for 18months so far). I haven't pressured him into work at all, even though we live somewhere (abroad) where child care is very affordable. I remember how it made me feel, and I don't want to do that to him.

But, it's all a bit... difficult. I need to rationalise this a bit.

[Timetoask]

I think it's time to put pressure on him to find work then. Just like he did to you.
I am so glad that you could prove your mortgage repayments! People have very short memories.
I think you are right to advice your bil's girlfriend. She will be in a very insecure position financially.

[BibbettyBobbettyBoo]

Thanks, but I really don't want to pressurise him.

[DaffodilAdams]

Lots of red flags here for me and I think it more than just short memory. He seems to have rewritten your history together, certainly your financial one. Plus the fact he doesn't see why you would be annoyed. Did he apologise whilst still on the phone to his brother or ring him back up and put the record straight? Calling you a liar, repeatedly, especially in front of someone else isn't on. There is a whopping amount of arrogance there.

And the pressuring you into getting a job is a bit bullying. Especially as you definitely doing your but, so to speak.

Does he often ignore what you say or dismiss your feelings? Does he pull his weight generally around the house now he is a SAHD? I'm just trying to get a picture of your overall relationship to gauge whether this is a one off or actually part of fairly regular disrespect for you.

[BibbettyBobbettyBoo]

I don't think he's generally dismissive, and he more than pulls his weight now. He does all of the cooking, most day-to-day cleaning (we have a cleaner once a week) and all of the school related stuff. I just work really, and obviously share child care after school and at the weekends. (1 child is still a toddler).

He claims to have apologised when on the phone, but really he just accepted that he was wrong. He has apologised now, but after I told him to.

[CogitoErgoSometimes]

You are entitled to have a conversation about him returning to work. It's not 'pressure' it's just sensibly going through the options. Do it in the context of a family budget/finance discussion, perhaps, and your aims for the future such as holidays, bigger houses, new car or whatever ambitions you have as a couple.

Hear what you're saying that you'd have felt put out if he'd asked you to return to work when you were a SAHM. But is there any element here that you are worried/nervous about his reaction if you even broach the subject? If he's the type that gets nasty, that wouldn't be good.

The other issue ... denying that you paid into the mortgage... sounds really peculiar. Could be anything going on there from misplaced pride to poor memory to a more sinister wish to downplay your past contribution. As he was on the phone to his brother at the time maybe the problem was that he lied in the past and told his brother he paid for everything 100%.... some macho 'male provider' bullshit thing?

[DaffodilAdams]

OK so he is quite happy to pull his weight generally then. It is still very strange that he revised, in his head a major part of your financial history. Did he say why he thought he'd paid for everything? Or why he wanted you to work more?

[BibbettyBobbettyBoo]

We don't really need him to work. I don't earn loads but enough and we live in an affordable country. He is great at the role of SAHD, so that's not really an issue, apart from the contrast between that and how I felt in the same position.

He's not a nasty type at all, I don't think it's sinister, but still troubling. I think it's a memory thing - he genuinely believed that he had 'provided' for me for years. It worries me that he has that false memory of something I see as quite important.

[BibbettyBobbettyBoo]

Haven't broached the issue of me feeling pressured to work FT when I was SAHM. It could entirely that be my perception of things and his differ. I'm sure he will say that he didn't pressure me at all. However, I can remember many times feeling like that - one in particular when I had to walk from the table in tears when he was making me feel shit for not working - in front of his parents. Maybe that's the link - his family? Perhaps he wants them to think I'm not pulling my weight?

[ArtVandelay]

Have you shown him the bank statements in black and white? I wouldn't worry about his feelings to much tbh go hard on this issue and make him remember and make him eat humble pie. This is not what colour
was the wallpaper in your first flat. This is fundamental. I don't believe for one minute he has a memory issue.

[BibbettyBobbettyBoo]

Yes, I showed him. He believes me now.

[CogitoErgoSometimes]

" I had to walk from the table in tears when he was making me feel shit for not working - in front of his parents. Maybe that's the link - his family?"

No. The 'link' is that this man is piece of work and has you doubting yourself. He's clearly quite happy to make you feel bad so that he looks good in front of others. 'Many times'. He's therefore a bully and the incident with the BIL has reminded you just how low he brought you in the past. Nothing to do with your perception and his.... He's controlling you.

Now he's sponging off you and giving you no credit for paying towards the bills in the past, but has you frightened to say anything. Frankly, how you can describe someone like that as 'not a nasty type' is beyond me.

[DaffodilAdams]

Well the fact you feel his perspective would differ about the pressuring, despite the incident you mention is not good. I think you may be on to something with the family connection. I just wonder how much else he is rewriting with them whilst you are not around.

I do think there is a fundamental issue here, of him perhaps not valuing your contribution except in the terms he gets to define.

[BibbettyBobbettyBoo]

Seriously, he isn't nasty usually at all. He's very easy going and generally happy / calm. This is a bit weird though.

And yes, the making me cry bit was nasty. But rare.

[DaffodilAdams]

Yes I agree with Cogito he is trying to control you.

[BibbettyBobbettyBoo]

Hmmm, but but but... he genuinely is otherwise lovely. What's going on then? Why?

[DaffodilAdams]

He probably doesn't need to be nasty all the time as he is getting what he wants.

[CogitoErgoSometimes]

Making you cry was nasty enough to alter your behaviour going forward. That's all a bully has to do. ... it's like dog training... if the dog gets a nip round the neck for pulling on the choke-chain it learns not to pull. You've learned to keep your mouth shut...

However, I can remember many times feeling like that .... means it wasn't rare.

Controlling people can be very charming and lovely when they're getting their own way. So as long as you're compliant and not challenging him I'm sure he's fine. Point out you paid the mortgage when he's trying to make out to his brother that he's the sole provider.... and you get an earful.

[BibbettyBobbettyBoo]

But why think I had paid nothing? What for?

[CogitoErgoSometimes]

So that he's the 'Big I Am' in front of his brother. He made you cry, berating you for not working in front of his parents. Face-saving. 'See I am the man in this house ...' Bully.

[CogitoErgoSometimes]

He & his family wouldn't be from a traditionally misogynistic culture would they?

[DaffodilAdams]

Completely agree with Cogito. He doesn't need to be nasty all the time, only when you object to his behaviour or what he is saying.

[BibbettyBobbettyBoo]

Yes, the culture is traditionally misogynistic Cogito. White English.

[AttilaTheMeerkat]

Controlling men are not nasty all the time; if they were no woman would ever want to be with them. Controlling behaviours like he is showing you is insidious in its onset and creeps up on you over time. This is really about power and control. You have gone onto modify your own behaviours over time.

I have read what you have said about him as a SAHD.

How do you feel about him as a husband?.

[CogitoErgoSometimes]

It's a fair question.... :) I thought you were going to say Greek or Italian or something. Wouldn't be the first man from that kind of background to be 'modern' at home but act like a martinet in front of the family.

I digress. Your solution to this is to speak up, challenge and confront. Same as all bullies. Don't worry about making him feel bad because it clearly didn't bother him in the past. Turn the tables with a clear conscience.

[BibbettyBobbettyBoo]

Absolutely a fair question, and I mean my response. Yes, they are quite misogynistic as a family. Far more than I like, anyhow. Seems quite standard for white British families!

How do I feel about him as a husband? I love him. I miss him when I work away. Nothing exciting, all very stable.