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Childcare/money

(20 Posts)
Slashtrophe Sat 10-Nov-12 13:21:43

Hi

I split with the father of my 2 DC four years ago. I was a SAHM at the time and now work part time. I have always done all wrap around care, which means my ex never has to worry about any effect on his FT job. It also means I have had a larger part than him in providing meals/doing clubs/finding childcare when I have to work. He kept our family house and I rent a smaller house down the road. He has them every other weekend and two nights in the week, but constantly arranges stuff on 'my' days. I have always arranged things like parents evening at times which he can make.
Despite this, he constantly bitches about how much maintenance he has to pay 'me'. Its £350 a month for a 4 and 7 year old. He earns 40k a year, I earn 8k plus tax credits. He is constantly sullen and rude, has threatened to kill my partner if he comes to the kid's events, and doesn't want to contribute to uniforms etc.
I am really sick of this now and would like him to do a more representative 50% of the care, especially since he makes out to everyone that he does. I would also like to minimise contact between him and I.
I am going to put forward the following proposal and stop the maintenance - any feedback would be much appreciated before I send it - thank you!

Childcare arrangements:

X to have boys on Tues and Wed nights, plus Fri-Mon every other week. X to pay for breakfast club and after school clubs on his mornings/evenings, take them to said clubs and to function as contact if they are ill/cancelled.

Breakfast club starts from 8am and afterschool club ends at 6pm.

Cost per day: £25 if available at school (£35 through other sources).

Lunch money for X’s days: £4/day

Chris to provide all meals on his days

Inset days (approx. 4 per year) if on Chris’ days to be paid for childcare at £40/day

Any clubs that the boys do will only be adhered to if on a day when boys are with X anyway, no extra times apart from those set out above.

Any sick time for boys to be arranged by parent having them on that day

Any parent’s evenings etc to be arranged by each parent separately and individually

Birthday parties that the boys are invited to will be left to the parent responsible for that date

All holidays to be split exactly down the middle (first half me, second half X or vice versa) or childcare to be arranged and paid for by parent responsible for that part of the holiday.

Any additional time ie holiday that is taken by parent will not be recompensed by the other parent in terms of time/costs. Any holiday with boys needs to be taken within that half of the holiday.

Any further discussions relating to boys to be arranged once a month/no other contact unless emergency. Boys to have a mobile on which to contact parent they are not with.

Dentist/doctor appointments to be sorted by parent responsible on that date and split 50/50

Further costs for uniform/clubs etc to be agreed in advance and divided accordingly

Dryjuice25 Sat 10-Nov-12 13:46:45

I think you will benefit more on going 50:50, re childcare arrangement. But do you realistically expect him to agree to this as he sounds quite selfish from your op. What you have aspirationally outlined is ideal and that's what most would want after break up but do you think he is reasonable to see this. If he is too career focused, I doubt he would want to oblige. But good luck trying.

Why not show him a breakdown of your childcare expensive if you're struggling financially with the kids? He might not realize you need more money to give your dcs a reasonable living standard although most people will manage on what you seem to earn

Dryjuice25 Sat 10-Nov-12 13:48:15

expenses*

CogitoErgoSometimes Sat 10-Nov-12 14:56:51

I would be going the other way tbh... i.e. me take more care of my children where I can protect them from this nasty, sullen man who talks about killing people hmm but him stumping up more maintenance to reflect the care given.

HorraceTheOtter Sat 10-Nov-12 15:05:30

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

NotGoodNotBad Sat 10-Nov-12 15:27:07

Another one agreeing with Cogito - I can see you want him to share responsibility and expenses, but if he's as unpleasant as you say surely you want to minimise his time with the kids, not increase it? What do the kids think of him? And how does he behave with them? Is it just you and your partner he's nasty to, or the kids and other people as well?

Dryjuice25 Sat 10-Nov-12 15:42:48

Is he nasty/unpleasant/abusive to the kids too? If not why can't he do his fair share of raising the kids. This arrangement surely is win win and win all around. He gets to spend time with dcs, dcs are happy and the OP can also get a break from shouldering the lion's share of parenting. IMO, 50:50 is ideal if reasonably executed by 2 reasonable adults. I disagree with the flow on this one.

Slashtrophe Sat 10-Nov-12 16:04:27

He is only nasty to me, he is fine with the kids. He is basically trying to have his cake and eat it. He wants me to make his life easy whilst paying as little as possible and having me facilitate whatever he does with the kids. I want him to see that it would cost him a lot more if he had to pull his weight. I also want to minimise contact as he seems to want to see me as often as possible and have control over what I do.

clam Sat 10-Nov-12 17:19:33

At least setting it out in this way shows him how lightly he has been getting off so far. And it could therefore serve as a useful starting position for further bargaining to your benefit.

But think carefully; do you really want him to have the kids this much? There may be no coming back from it if he agrees.

solittletimeandsomuchtodo Sat 10-Nov-12 17:31:13

I think it sounds well thought out and the dc have contact with him so why not make it fairer?
Will it effect what he pays you?

Slashtrophe Mon 12-Nov-12 09:55:57

Oh yes it will affect what he pays - he doesn't want to pay me anything so I plan to get him to do his half the childcare plus about £120 a month which is what the CSA recommends after 50% split. Does this sound fair?
I am v used to him shouting and complaining that I have much more money than him and he's broke - he is very unreasonable and I'm not quite sure what he would be paying if he had the kids 50% of the time.
I don't know how to go back from the current set up now (which is 2 nights a week plus a weekend every other) to him having them less without taking a night away. Which seems unfair.

solittletimeandsomuchtodo Mon 12-Nov-12 13:41:42

Take control back!
You and your children deserve that much smile

pmcblonde Mon 12-Nov-12 15:22:07

Logistically I think this might be a bit complicated...

X to have boys on Tues and Wed nights, plus Fri-Mon every other week. X to pay for breakfast club and after school clubs on his mornings/evenings, take them to said clubs and to function as contact if they are ill/cancelled.

So the kids would be back with you Monday and Thursday some weeks and Thursday - Monday other weeks? The first schedule sounds like a lot of to-ing and fro-ing for the kids

Any parent’s evenings etc to be arranged by each parent separately and individually
Depending on whose day it is? Surely both parents need to be involved if possible

All holidays to be split exactly down the middle (first half me, second half X or vice versa) or childcare to be arranged and paid for by parent responsible for that part of the holiday.

Would it not be more stable for the kids to have the same childcare arrangement just with split costs unless it's being looked after by family or something

Dentist/doctor appointments to be sorted by parent responsible on that date and split 50/50
I'm not sure how you can mandate 50/50 here

ClippedPhoenix Mon 12-Nov-12 17:47:50

The arrangement, whilst not ideal, sounds ok to be honest. If he had the kids more wouldn't he then have more access to you?

Is this because there's a new man on the block?

Slashtrophe Tue 13-Nov-12 13:58:07

At the moment it is a similar arrangement but I pick them up from school then he picks them up from me when he's finished work, and then he drops them back at 7am so he can go to work and I take them to school. So the handover being done by the school would cut most contact between him and I, and also allow more flexibility in my working hours.
I have always facilitated things like parents evening - arranging it after his work hours etc, letting him know when and where - and he will turn up and ignore me, in fact sit at the other end of the hall and then act as if I am not there at all when talking to the teacher. So frankly I've had enough of it and he can sort himself out (he won't bother).
Most of the issues are about him wanting control over me and I want to draw a line under it and lead a separate life from him. He does a school hours job and has all the holidays so he should be able to book holidays within that. At the moment he does what he likes, whenever, and I fit round him.
My man is not new (3 years together) and ex has a girlfriend, but when my partner and I move in together I don't want him coming to the house and threatening him,

Ahardyfool Tue 13-Nov-12 14:07:55

Oh my god. Better hope he is happy with your idea otherwise you'll have no one who will reinforce his need to make a commitment to his children.

I have my children every day and night except one 24 hour period every week when my youngest goes to her father. I get no maintenance for none child and the others see their father every other weekend for a day. I pay all childcare, including through the holidays. I do all the medical and school stuff without their other parent and pay for all uniform and extras.

I have tried to obtain more but there is not a single law in the land that will enforce my children's fathers to take on their share of practical and financial responsibility. The CSA maintenance does little to cover the true expense. I also work ( til this week) 40 hours a week and take home less than £100 of that after childcare. I survive on tax credits. It's the children who miss out in every way.

Grump.

Slashtrophe Tue 13-Nov-12 14:31:03

What would the ideal arrangement ve do you think?

Ahardyfool Tue 13-Nov-12 14:56:54

Was that qu to me?

I think OP's suggestion is bold and fabulous, wish when the resident parent asserts themselves as such they were backed legally, politically, etc.

stoney1215 Sun 18-Nov-12 08:09:27

was the amount paid by your ex determined by the court or did you 2 agree to it on your own ? what about custody of the children , visitation , and when the kids are to stay with him ?

quick math says your ex makes 3500 / month . assuming he brings home 2500/month he should be able to provide more financially for his kids .. im pretty sure that 50% of what it costs to feed , cloth , provide housing , transportation , and provide person care is more than $350 for the 2 of them . 350 / month for each of them is probably more realistic

if you 2 made a support agreement and he is not willing to pay more your only option is to take him to court . if you do this you risk the courts deciding he pays less not more . same thing with your custody arrangement . if you have custody inform all doctors , schools , etc .. that your husband does not handle your childrens you do and they are to make appointments with you only .

my mother and father split up when me , my brother , and my 2 sisters were young . their agreement was that he would provide a home for his kids and we would live with her . she would provide the rest . when she needed his help with doctors , school etc .. he didnt do it for her , he did it for his kids .

when school was out he took us where ever he wanted , when ever he wanted , for as long as he wanted . when i got older i found out that this was not the norm . i could never understand how it is that when people break up they do not always do what is best for their kids . how people use their kids as pawns or as leverage . what i do not understand most is the worse thing of all , how someone could decide to not take care of their kids at all .

fayster Sun 18-Nov-12 08:38:33

OP, I think it's admirable that you are trying to be so fair to your XP, but I'm not sure that it will achieve what you're hoping for.

If your ex is that unreasonable, it doesn't matter how evenly you split costs and time, he will still find something to complain about, and if he wants to come to your new home and have a go at your new partner, he will. I think you (and he) need to separate his relationship with his kids from his relationship with you.

If you want him to collect your boys from school on his days, just tell him to, and tell him that he if he doesn't, he is not to come to your house to collect them. If you don't want to organise parents evenings for him as well, don't. You don't have to engage with him. I don't think you'll stop him from whingeing about how hard life is to other people, I'm afraid, but you don't have to listen to it yourself!

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