Am I over-reacting in thinking this is emotional abuse, and what can we do about it?

[IBlameThePenguins]

Hi, I would really appreciate a bit of perspective on this, and some advice too if possible.

To cut a long story short, my dp has two children from a previous relationship. The break up was pretty acrimonious, but dp and his ex managed a reasonably good relationship until hits ex met a new man. Since them things have gone from bad to worse. Dp is now only allowed access every other weekend and one phone call in a 30 minute time slot on a friday. His ex has not spoken to him for over a year, and any attempts to communicate re: the children's health /education etc go completely ignored. We are currently going through the court to get a contact order.

What really worries me is the comments the children come out with... Things like ' my other daddy wants to punch you' ' my other day says we have to hate you' amd today's ' my other daddy says we have to cry the whole time I'm with you' and ' we have to call it the boring weekend'

I'm really worried that this will have a massive long term effect on the children's emotional well being. It feels to me like they are being emotionally abused, but we feel pretty powerles to address this. My heart breaks for the children and for dp every time something like this happens.

His ex has ignored requests for mediation.

Thanks in advance.

[IBlameThePenguins]

Sorry just seen how long that was. Thanks if you got to the end. I am off to bed in a little while, but will check back in the, morning.

[SarahStratton]

I would repost this in Relationships, Penguins. I think you'll probably get advice more quickly and from knowledgable posters.

Not that there aren't any here, just the posters you need hang out there.

[GillyMac93]

That must be so awful to hear , I hope you get something sorted re access , thats horrible

[Heswall]

Would you consider applying for full time custody ? This man sounds appalling, immature and damaging.

[PoorEv]

This man sounds vile and extremely immature to think its clever teaching the children phrases like that! I have no advice I'm afraid, but I'm sure someone will be along soon.

[IBlameThePenguins]

Thank you for your replies. I can't tell you how heart breaking it is to hear them say those things, and to see dp's face crumble when they do. I will try and move this to relationships, though am only on my phone, so may have to wait until tomorrow. Thanks for the suggestion sarahstratton

[BertieBotts]

I know that this is very frowned upon by the family courts. Certainly it's probably the quickest way to fuck up your children during/after divorce :(

As for what you can do, unfortunately probably very little :( As you're going through court, it would definitely be worth talking to your solicitor about it, ask if there is any way the children could be spoken to neutrally as well, by a teacher at school for example, so that the legal parties involved have a non-biased account of what is going on. (Not saying you are exaggerating through bias, but the other side could say that, if you don't have good evidence.)

The only other thing your DP could do is apply for that thing which checks out any adult who has contact with your DCs, for any previous convictions. I'm not sure what it covers, though, certainly it wouldn't cover "being an evil bastard but never being prosecuted for anything".

Keep going through the courts and try as far as possible to be perfectly reasonable, calm and collected.

[Alambil]

ask the courts to bring in CAFCAS - they will speak to both parties and then the children and advise the court on the best for the children. They are trained to do this, rather than bringing in untrained teachers or other professionals who may disrupt the case.

If you're very worried, you could discuss the matter with the local Social Care services and see if it meets their threshold for the children receiving support.

[Hownoobrooncoo]

Sorry don't have any advice but don't think you are over reacting, it sounds really worrying and vile.

[Bohica]

The best thing you can both do is be very noncholant about the coments and change the subject to something a lot more positive.

And then keep a diary of every comment made on which date.

Don't let the children feel you react, no side ways glances at each other just play it really cool.

And then get some help from CAFCAS or through the court and I second findingg out how to get a crb check done.

Good luck and sorry for the rubbishly short advice

[IBlameThePenguins]

Not rubbish advice at all. Thank you. We do always try not to respond, and move, on to something positive, but you're right about the sideways glances.. We will continue to work on that.

Don't spouse anyone knows how we would go about a crb check? I know on the grapevine that he used to get in trouble for fighting in pubs etc... Cracking bloke :-(

[IBlameThePenguins]

Excuse typos, am on my phone!

[Jux]

You won't be able to move the thread yourself. Click on "report" on your OP and then fill in the box asking MN to move the thread. I've done it already but they may need you to ask for it yourself.

[BertieBotts]

Sarah's law, I think? Although I believe that only covers child sex offences. I'm not sure about other offences, but this is a background check any parent is entitled to do to on any adult who has regular unsupervised contact with their children, such as a new partner/other parent's new partner.

[IBlameThePenguins]

Thank you bertie. Have poised this on to dp. Thanks too jux. Have done the same.

I'm really grateful for all of the kind words and advice. Thank you!

[OliviaLMumsnet]

Hi there
We have moved this to relationships.
M Towers

[Sassybeast]

How old are the children OP ?

[IBlameThePenguins]

Thanks olivia :)

They are 4.5 and 6 sassy

[WhippingGirl]

hi op. this was pretty much my childhood when my parents had share custody and it was quite shit.

my dad used to go on at me to parrot these daft lines to my mum about how i would be damaged for life by divorce and a load of other crap i forget now. most of the time i would never say it to my mum - too busy having fun and being with my mum - funny that! but my mum could spot these lines a mile off and say 'did your dad ask you to say that?' followed by 'listen dont worry about it - lets go to the park/or whatever'.

the least fun part was being interrogated by my dad when i went back there who was dying to know what mums reaction had been - ie the desired effect.

this technique did nothing to damage the relationship with my mum and we are as close as anything 25 years later but it made me look down on and resent my dad to a great degree and that relationship is completely broken now.

Feeling unable to let an ex partner move on is bad. Feeling unable to let your children move on and adapt is really bad - or in this case feeling unable to let your step children move on/have al ife beyond you is outrageous.

hope that was helpful

[Eurostar]

It sounds awful for you all and very possible that this man is abusive to their Mum, isolating her etc, hence no contact.

Perhaps it would be worth contacting the NSPCC helpline for advice?

There is info for Sarah's law here www.sarahslaw.co.uk/how-it-works/
I'm not sure you could get a CRB check on him - they might know in the legal forum about finding out about past convictions? I presume if you involve the police they might involve social services, which could sound worrying as many fear social services but if there is abuse in the home, perhaps it is worth the risk?

[WhippingGirl]

again, nspcc dont do frontline child protection. they will tell the op to report to SS if they have concerns about those kids.

op i think you need to tell this ocncern to your solicitor to add weight to your application for a contact order which imo is now essential.

i would also strongly suggest your partner seeks a private conversation with his his ex wife. he could offer to have it in front of a 3rd party and or a mediator if she has reservations about seeing him/speaking to him.

meanwhile depending on how old the kids are (as in this is easier if they are older) i suggest your partner addresses this issue with the kids and tries to get a better picture of what life with this man is like for them and for their mum. this may require lots of reassurance that its not betraying mum/stepdad etc and that its a confidential conversation where they are safe from repurcussions.

[ThePinkPussycat]

I am afraid similar is happening to a friend of mine, CAFCASS were involved as she is fighting for more contact through the courts, but CAFCASS just had to take the word of DD(9) as gospel, though we are 100% sure she was, as my friend puts it, pumped. CAFCASS didn't really have enough time to gain the trust of DD to tell the truth, and besides DD knows that she is living with her dad and would want to keep him sweet. The courts have realised, as we have, that the situation is affecting DD badly and have now appointed a sol just for her, and she is being referred to CAMHS.

I take my hat off to my friend for managing (mostly) not to rise, her ex is disgusting in the way he uses DD to get at her.

[AgathaFusty]

I have no experience of this, so maybe this isn't the right thing to do, but, given your partner's very valid concerns, would it be possible for him to contact the children's school? Just to see if there have been any concerns expressed by the teachers there, and to gently give them the heads up that things may not all be well at the children's home so that the teaching staff could be vigilent in spotting any issues?

[cestlavielife]

document the refusal to mediate and make sure CAFCASS get involved,keep records of what the children have said and pass to solicitor .
speaking to school is good idea too to see if they have any concerns

[headinhands]

Hi op. In case you didn't know, and apologies if someone has said this up thread already, I think this behaviour is called 'parental alienation' although I think it's mainly termed as that in the US. Maybe you can do some goggling for tips on how to counter it although the advice you've been given here is spot on I imagine as in not drawing attention to it in front of the dcs and keeping a log etc.