So my mum seems to hate me...

[Bear1984]

I always thought it when I was little. Why would she hit me but not my sister or my brothers (none of whom I speak to now). Why did she not praise me when I achieved something, even now? What is it about me that she must hate so much to treat me like I'm shit?

Having DD, I was very worried I would turn out like her. When I get angry, I feel like I am her, and it scares me. I wouldn't hit my DD, I know I would never do such a thing, but when I get angry, I'm scared I'm too much like my mum.

But even now as an adult, about to hit the 30s in fact, she still seems to hate me so much. When she was in hospital, she told my sister that she didn't want me to know cos she thought I wouldn't care (had wrote about that at the time under a different name). But over the last few days, I'm just so angry with her.

I picked DD up from hers a couple of days ago. It's very rare I have DD go to my mum's, and this has all too much reminded me as to why! When I was there, she was saying about how she would like to have DD again. Well I said she would see DD on Sunday when we all come round for dinner. She said it's not the same because I'm there and ruin their time together. I don't even want to go to my mum's for Easter! But I felt sorry for her as she'll be on her own, so we were just gonna go over for a meal.

Then DD told me when we were at home, they had gone to the cinema. She asked my mum if she could call me and ask if I wanted to come with them. She said no to this. DD got very upset because of it.

It also transpires tonight that my mum has been filling DD's head with horrible thoughts and comments about me. DD called me lazy and said I don't do anything with her, despite having taken her to cinema and out for lunch today, and then we went into London yesterday and had lunch out as well, and then night before we had pizza and watched a couple of films together etc. I asked her to tell me when she means, as to why she was saying I don't do anything, and she said something like "oh fine, you have been doing lots of things with me, but granny says you don't." It also turns out that my mum has told DD to ignore me when I tell DD to do something she doesn't want to do or if I tell her off.

I'm just flabbergasted at this. I can't believe she would dare say these things to DD!! I mean really I shouldn't be that surprised, but maybe I'm just stupid. So in the morning, I'm going to ring her up, tell her we're not coming round Sunday and exactly why I'm cancelling. Not really looking for advice, just somewhere to vent and kick myself for being so stupid.

[Dropdeadfred]

Your mum sounds awful and iv I were you I would stop all contact with her. Noone has the right to undermine you to your own child like that

[Plumm]

I'm glad to hear you're cancelling on your mum and telling her the reason why.I doubt whether she'll understand though so don't be surprised when she makes out it's all your fault.

[Bear1984]

I totally expect her to think I'm the one out of line as I'm sure in her eyes, she's never been at fault. I know DD will be upset to not go see her, but I'm already making up alternative plans. I've seen a couple of places doing Easter egg hunts at local parks, so will have a go at those.

Spoke to DP and he can't believe it. He had already suggested we cancelled Sunday after I told him about the comment she made and telling DD no about ringing me to go to the cinema. I mean I understand if she wants to just spend time with DD without me, but to just say no, and not even make a nice excuse about it. Arghh!! I think I'm partly angry at myself for trying to be nice to her and hoping she's bloody changed when she hasn't!

[Beamur]

If I were you I would not leave my child with her alone again. She sounds poisonous.
You're not stupid, you're more forgiving and generous than your Mother, but she has shown you once again why you are right to be guarded with her.
I think her comment that you 'ruin' her time with DD is horrible, if my Mum said that to me, that would be the last time she ever had time alone with my daughter.

[Bear1984]

Hi Beamur, I agree completely. I don't trust her at all to be around DD now so she won't be having her alone again. I can't risk DD having any more horrible things being put into her head or being around someone that would even try to do that in the first place!

[Beamur]

Good luck and stick to your guns!

[HerHissyness]

Don't ever let that poisonous woman have a second's time with your DD again. Cut this nasty person from your life on the strength of these comments to your DD alone. The comment about you ruining their time together is just jaw droppingly awful. I want to give you a great big HUG right now.

Do your siblings know of the difference in treatment between them and you WRT your mother? Will they be supportive of you? If so, don't give it a second thought.

Have you seen the Stately Homes threads on here? You could do with some MN support in this.

[Bear1984]

Thanks Beamur. I will.

HerHissyness, thanks. My siblings and I don't talk anymore. My sister, who was the golden child who couldn't do any wrong (despite sleeping around, having 2 abortions, threatening mum on several occasions, stealing both parents' credit cards and using them, then to have a DD with a guy who was a one night stand who didn't want to know, and then lied to her ex that it was his so that they would get together again...) I have absolutely nothing to do with her now. I avoid DD seeing her, but again my mum interferes and when DD was round hers, had asked sister to come round and see her. Another example of how she undermines me. My brothers and I rarely speak to one another. I had a big arguement with one of them a few years ago and now we don't talk.

I have looked at the Stately Homes threads and posted a while ago on them. Lately I haven't been on Mumsnet as much as I use to.

My DP is very supportive though. He understands how hard things are with my mum, and has asked me to not to speak to her yet, as he will be home tonight for the Easter weekend (works in the city so is away for four night of the week) and he wants to make sure he is with me when things come to ahead. I'm lucky to have someone so understanding. The problem is my mum lives literally around the corner. A 5 minute walk from my house. It drives me mad, but there's literally no way we can move for a long time. Me and DP have both agreed for us to move to a different part of England when DD is about to finish primary school so we can move and it won't unsettle her too much with school as she'd be starting secondary school then anyway. But I know when I tell her, she will be matching right to my house (I will make sure we're all out) and won't stop because I know she won't see she's done any wrong, and that I'm out of order for saying these things and for refusing her to see DD. It makes me angry just thinking about her being like that.

[Bear1984]

Well I've done it. Told her we're not going round and the reasons: I know what she's been saying to DD, she's been undermining me as a parent, her attitude towards me and it's down to me with what DD does etc.

Haven't heard back from her since I told her. I think she's probably quite upset, which then makes me feel bad and guilty, when I keep telling myself I shouldn't feel that way.

I do feel a bit better for telling her. I stopped being as angry today and kept getting upset. But it's done now. Wish I didn't feel so shit about it.

[Bear1984]

Ok just spoke to her. She doesn't understand where this has all come from. She said she was talking to DD about me to see how I have been as I'm under a lot of pressure with working as well as coming to the end of my degree. She was saying how I'm difficult to get a hold of (partly cos I avoid her). She was saying she didn't mean to upset me and would still like for us to come around Sunday.

I'm now banging my head against the wall because as usual, she's taking the approach where she doesn't consider the fact she may have done something wrong to genuinely piss me off and it feels like she's doing the usual "well if you need someone to blame/shout at, I guess I'll be that person."

DP has taken all the phones away from me so I don't end up calling her back and shouting and raging. I've calmed down a bit, but I'm just flabbergasted I guess. Trying to concentrate on my family now and focus on having a lovely evening with them but at the same time, I'm just angry too...

[Miggsie]

Have you seen this website? Are you the scapegoat child?

My gran tried to turn me against my mum and dad. She had the personality disorder on that website...it was all about her, she wanted me to love her, not my parents. Very confusing for a child. Ultimately my mother stopped me seeing my gran and it was much better for me...but I spent my early years really confused and upset as my gran would tell me my mother was a crap mother, and it was my mums fault that my brother had asthma and I was spotty as she was a terrible mother. She did the same to my brother. We talk about my gran now and we both shudder.
Sadly, she was how she was, and she never changed, she truly thought she was perfect and in the right all the time. She relied on us being nicer than her and doing things for her out of guilt, my mum and my brother and I resisted the guilt but my dad never escaped from under her thumb.

[HerHissyness]

"She said it's not the same because I'm there and ruin their time together."

She told you this with her own poisonous mouth, you heard her.

She is bullshitting you, you know it and so does she. she has so little respect for you, she thinks you will fall for it.

Stick to your guns and watch her KICK OFF, it'll be the biggest fireworks display your area has seen for years. BUT she caused it, you have put up with it for all these years and now she is working on DD. That, for me, would be IT. She has managed to poison your entire family against you, and now she won't be happy until she has taken your DD from you as well.

I hope your DP has a good family, you can adopt them as your parents and never look back!

[Beamur]

Well done for being clear and honest with your Mum, she is unlikely to see it in the same way as you.
You've done nothing wrong, so don't feel guilty.

[Bear1984]

Miggsie, yup I'm the scapegoat it sounds like. I do feel like I've always had the blame no matter what and it was always my duty to be an example to my younger siblings, whether it was my fault or not. Most likely why I was hit and they were not. I remember when I had a breakdown and a lot of it was partly down to my mum's attitude and behaviour towards me. She again at the time said "well if you need someone to blame, I guess I'll let you blame me" and that she would never change.

HerHissyness, yeah I know she's lying to me which is what frustrates me so much. My DP has a wonderful family, thank goodness. They are so great with both me and DD and I've always looked at their family wishing that I had a family like them. Well really his family are mine now too anyway.

Beamur, thank you. I know I will stop feeling guilty soon. I think that's just ingrained in to me to feel that way whether I should or shouldn't. I'm determined to enjoy this weekend though with the two people who mean the most to me.

[pointybunnyears]

You have a toxic parent and you have started freeing yourself. Well done, keep it up, you will all be the better for it.
I'm trying to get my cousin to free herself from her mum (my aunt) and have seen how hard it is for her, so hats off to you.

[Bear1984]

Thanks pointybunnyears. I hope so, I know it will be difficult. I know she will be persistent when she realises as well. I know I'm a strong person as I've been through so much, so I know as long as I can stick to my guns and keep my DP and DD close and focus on them, I will get through it ok. Hope your cousin can do the same.

[Beamur]

I suppose I can identify with this as I have a difficult relationship with my Dad, but have learned the limits of how we can comfortably relate and spend time with each other (i.e we don't and very little)

[TantePiste]

She is very toxic and there is no easy solution, because she will be back with further lies, schemes and manipulations.

Setting people against each other is one of the favorite pastimes of narcissists. Trying to turn your child against you is typical and I doubt she will stop, just because you caught her out, and pulled her up.

My unfortunate experience is that narcissists will not comply with you laying down the law and so I doubt she will behave herself.

I feel for you because my dad did the same thing, and it was really the hardest thing of all his behaviors to put up with - him telling false tales to third parties about me. To this day I have no idea most of what he said, but it was obvious by the way his friends, girlfriends, and relatives of ours behaved toward me. We lived hundreds of miles away, but before he passed I had vowed never to let my son be unsupervised in my dad's company for this very reason. Also, because of my dad's vicious tongue and the way he targeted me as scapegoat, my dh and I agreed to always encounter him together. Even on the phone, I would let my dad's calls go to voicemail and only return the call with dh in the room.

It was very helpful to me to do a lot of reading and learning about how to deal with a narcissist parent. It's a learned skill. It was also quite a relief to spend time on fora with other people with narc parents. It's amazing how they are all similar in their behavior - yours is absolutely typical.

Hugs to you - it sucks, but at least the family you married in to is full of real love. That's wonderful.

[Bear1984]

Hi Beamur, usually I do keep my distance from my mum. It is very difficult when she literally lives around the corner from me. I've even made steps of not going to the local park because she takes the dog for a walk there, and not to leave for school run til after 8:20 because we will pass her if we go before, and to not go into town in the morning. She works for a school so has the holidays off, so often during the holidays she goes on and on about spending time with DD. I obviously became soft this time round, and now thoroughly regret it.

TantePiste, I'm sorry to hear you've been through the same thing with your dad. I've been the same with my mum in terms of having my DP with me. He always makes sure he is around when I have to see her or if I'm on the phone to her. I get very stressed out before I even see the woman when I know I have to. I may look into reading about it like you have. And thank you, I do remind myself that I'm lucky to have that :)

[HerHissyness]

Bear, you need to move!

[sweetkitty]

I have cut myself off from my toxic mother as well.

She would have never have said anything bad or negative about me to anyone else in fact she would love to boast about my achievements etc as that made her out as the perfect mother. But she never praised me directly, was never warm or affectionate. She would love to try and bring me down and make me feel bad. Always comment on my appearance, tell me I had put on weight. Oh and her other thing was to try and make me feel sorry for her, if she had some health issue she would google it and suddenly it was a cancer scare, everytime she phoned she had something wrong with her, she always had a hangover food poisoning at the weekend too. When DD1 was born she said she was fat and ginger the first photo she saw but to everyone else she was beautiful, DD2 well at least I could have a third to have a boy, DD3 well no one has big families these days, she had told me it was for the best when I had a miscarriage as well.

When DD1 was a baby she asked to look after her a few times then undermined me completely by giving her salty porridge and lucozade at 8 months old because she wanted to see her face!

There was loads of other things as well, nasty things she would say to me on the phone then deny of course and if I ever tried to bring these things up again of course "I was off on one again"

Anyway I simply started making as much effort as she did i.e. none stopped phoning her as it jsut made me miserable to spend time listening to her health/money worries or trying to make me feel bad. Months went past and then I got a note saying phone me I don't know what I have done, I wrote her a letter telling her and got one back saying that even as a child I was a know it all, I made her feel she was beneath me (by being an independent child), she never felt welcome in my house but her gifts and money always was!!!, and DD1 would know the truth one day.

I just gave up after that, my brother has always been her golden child and he is welcome to her.

I do not miss her one little bit but I really miss having a Mum in my life.

[Bear1984]

HerHissyness, I know! Lol. We're planning to when it's the summer between DD finishing primary and starting secondary school. Want to be at least an hour away. Just 3 years to wait... But for the time being, we're looking to see if we can at least move to a different part of the area, as our home is through the housing association so we are able to do a house swap with someone. Fingers crossed!

sweetkitty, I'm so sorry to hear about what you went through. It's terrible the things some parents say to their kids. I look at DD and think I couldn't even begin to think about, let alone do!!, any of the things my mum use to say or do to me.

Hugs to everyone that has a toxic parent. It is such a horrible thing to go through, but least we've learnt that in the end it isn't our fault. It took me a long time to figure that out.

[Bear1984]

Just received a text from my mum asking if I could meet her in the park to talk about what was said yesterday, just the two of us. I don't see the point because I'll just be repeating myself and not being heard, and will probably lose my cool and scream at her. I have opted to ignoring her, as again I think if I text back and say no, I'll end up in a text war with her.

[pointybunnyears]

Good for you, Bear. Baby steps, they say, but this is a big one - you are choosing not to play her game.

[springydaffs]

I'm sorry you have a mum like this Bear - so painful

You have had some excellent advice re your mum but what stood out for me was this in your OP:

Having DD, I was very worried I would turn out like her. When I get angry, I feel like I am her, and it scares me. I wouldn't hit my DD, I know I would never do such a thing, but when I get angry, I'm scared I'm too much like my mum.

imo I think you need to go into counselling (if you haven't already - you said you have had a breakdown ), ie proper therapy, to untwine the threads that link you to her in your mind. I also show characteristics from my abusive dad which is horrifying, the very last thing I would want to be, yet there it is, plain as day... I've had a lot of counselling/therapy but when you've been seriously damaged by a toxic childhood imo you need intermittent top-ups as you go through life and face fresh challenges from your poisonous parent/family. xx