FTB needing advice - to share or not to share full survey report with EA?

[howabouthisthen]

Hi all,

I'm a FTB and completely new to all this. Am relocating and offer has been accepted on a house. It was a HMO (has been unoccupied for months) and needs a lot of tlc and repairs.

Have just had a full building survey done on house. Pretty grim - lots more urgent work needed than we had expected (Scary big stuff all connected re: damp (everywhere), roof, brickwork...), so it's going to cost a lot more than we had budgeted when we made our offer.

Plus the valuation came in at 20K under our offer.

So - we are going to need to revise our offer and wanted to get quotes for the work and do our sums before we get back to the EA with full info and a revised offer that seems fair to us.

I asked EA if they could give keys to contractors so they can give us the quotes. EA has just asked to see the full survey report and wants to discuss everything at once. Partly as the vendor wants to complete a month today (!) [I have a whole other question re: is it reasonable to be put under so much pressure? if it was the vendor's home/they were in a chain i would understand, but seems to just want it all done before Christmas, no specific reason given].

At present I don't know if we can afford to proceed, let alone want to take on all the work. And hence want the quotes in for the work that's needed. Had hoped to then go back to EA when we feel like we know a bit more what we're talking about.

Is it normal to share survey report with EA? How do people sequence the negotiations? once we reveal valuation is 20K under it's reasonable that we reduce our offer, but we haven't yet factored in costs of repairs so do we say something like "clearly, with the valuation £20K less, and more extensive repairs/work needing doing than anticipated, we will need to revise our offer and will let you know this as soon as we have the quotes in".

Vendor previously rejected our first offer (which, interestingly, was £20K less!), so perhaps it's helpful to get it all out on the table at once so if they really won't negotiate we just walk away and don't waste anyone's time?

Advice much appreciated! Ta.

[DrWashout]

Sharing some evidence of the reduced valuation is a good idea I think. It is in your interest for your seller to know you are telling the truth. But the whole survey is not the EA's business.

If you are wanting more than £20k off now (?) you first need to know if they are even open to dropping the £20k. If not, you are not going to agree an even lower price and you might as well agree to walk away now without getting quotes. I think you need to be talking to them, because if you don't, it'll look like you're sitting on your hands.

In their position I think I'd take the view that the adjusted value is £20k lower, in its current state, and I'm not sure I've be open to further negotiation. But perhaps you are talking about agreeing a value above your surveyor's valuation, if you can get quotes for the cost of remedying at less than £20k? Either way I do think you need to be talking to them, not being silent until you get quotes in.

[Kamma89]

The survey is your property and you have paid for it. By all means share relevant snippets of info explaining why the property is not worth what they want / why you are reducing an offer. Don't give the whole thing to them as they can then give this to other potential buyers to get a quick sale.

[Fleabag123]

I’m in the same position - I have only shared the valuation report (ie the bit of paper saying it’s worth 20k less) rather than the full survey report

[Mildura]

The PPs are quite correct, the survey is yours, you've paid for it, and you don't have to show the whole thing to the EA.

However, the EA wants the sale to go through almost as much as you do, and therefore ammunition to convince the seller they may need to reduce the agreed selling price is likely to prove useful.

[Unacervezaporfavor]

I agree with the above. There should be a summary of the report with valuation. I’d send this. I agree that you don’t just want to hand the whole thing over.

Based on the things you mention are in the survey it looks like the property would present in poor condition. In this case reducing £20k to reflect valuation is pretty fair. Anything below that perhaps not especially if the property was priced as a property that obviously “needs work”. That said you can always offer a little under the valuation and supply the most damning parts of the report to qualify your position. If nothing else it might make them more amenable to accepting £20k less.

Has the surveyor stated a retention until certain work is done (in addition to the valuation)?

[Lucisky]

No, I wouldn't share a full survey with an e.a.I think it's cheeky to ask. You can tell them what the relevant bits say.
The main thing that leaps out at me is that you are a ftb buying what sounds like a potential money pit. Be careful.

[howabouthisthen]

Thanks all, good to know it's reasonable not to share the full report! The EA is being really pushy about it, but I will be firm on this thanks to your supportive advice!

Good points re: just share the valuation report, and perhaps also share snippets to help bolster our case. There is a 'summary of advice' page which lists the main issues /advises what we should do. Perhaps I could share the key info from that, and the valuation page? Hopefully that would give enough info to explain that there are significant, costly, repairs needed, but not give away the whole report.

@Mildura: ah yes, we will def give the EA enough ammo to persuade the vendor. thanks.

@Kamma89: good point re: EA could use our survey report to give to other buyers to get a quick sale! One to avoid for sure, thanks.

@DrWashout: we really don't know if we are going to ask for the full £20K off, or reduce our offer even further than that, or if we'll go a bit above the valuation. Have to run the figures to see what we can afford. Agree that if vendor won't go down even 20K we may need to walk away, but first want to check what we can afford, and then think about what we are comfy with, and what feels fair.

@Unacervezaporfavor: the house was partly 'done up' (cheap carpet, quick paint job, new 'on trend' cupboard doors in kitchen) at the end of the last tenancy, and has been presented as 'ready to move into' (i.e. not at all a doer-upper (how on earth do you spell that?).). So the asking price was with that expectation. But it turns out it hasn't been maintained well (at all?) in the past 10 years whilst it's been rented out, so the survey has found lots of significant repairs needed. Vendor actually wanted to get £85K over the valuation price initially (even the EA said they had told the vendor it wasn't worth that)!!!

@Luckisy: you're so right to caution us re: it could be a money pit! Thank you for those wise words. My family are all cautioning the same. I can see that we could make the house into a lovely home, but have to be cold about it and focus on what the figures are telling us.

@Fleabag123: how are your negotiations going? Have fingers crossed it works out ok for you.

Thanks again all - my first thread on Mumsnet and it's been really helpful

[Unacervezaporfavor]

Oh a quick paint and tart up is my pet hate because it’s a failure to address, if not an attempt to hide, the work that really needs doing. In this respect I like obviously run down properties as they are “honest”.

Don’t feel pressured in any way by the EA - they only care about their commission.

I’d share the most damning parts of the survey and, keeping in mind that remedial works might be costly, insist on allowing access for builders or quantity surveyor to advise on likely costs (if you’re still considering buying it). I’d make the point to the agent also that any subsequent purchaser will be made aware of these issues so it’s not like it’s going to go away.

Good luck, think things through in your own time and be firm with the EA and anyone else who tries to pressure you.

[3asAbird]

Op i feel your pain i hate house hunting and i hate estate agents

We had 1 house fall though because sellers changed mind.

2offers rejected which were fair based on work needed and recently sold houses in that street .

Puzzled why you upped offer by 20k.

I kept reading reading here that in current slow market 10% is reasonable.
I know this is different but market stagnating here lots sales fallung through/ reductions and taking 6months to sell.

We actually saw a hmo house it wasent great condition.
After years of renting i know how tight landords are in investing and maintaining properties.

We are currently buying a doer upper.
Bur we buying it at reasonable price and factoring in the work that needs doing.

Are you sure this house is the one.
Don't feel rushed or pressured.

If you vetting mortgage wont the bank havr issue with the value.

[Fleabag123]

Thank you for asking - still waiting!!!! Trying to be patient as allegedly the vendor only found out about the valuation report on Tuesday.
Giving them till this afternoon before I start getting stroppy.
Good luck for you too 🤞🏼

[howabouthisthen]

Thanks @Unacervezaporfavor. I agree - seems like a waste of resources and the vendor's cash, and more importantly it makes me suspect that they are trying to hide things.

@3asAbird - sound advice, thanks. We upped our offer as we really like the house and the location so we got quotes for the work that we could see needed doing, and worked out what we (thought) we could afford & would be happy with. But with the house valuation so much lower, and so much more urgent repair work needed than we knew, we are now redoing sums substantially! My gut feeling is we will end up walking away as I think the vendor is unlikely to accept our offer - but then again, if vendor wants to get rid of the house, and knowing that the market is stalled (if not falling), and any other buyer will have similar issues... they might just agree. And if they don't they will have to fix it to put it back on the rental market anyway (though of course could have a whole separate post about state of some houses on rental market!)

@Fleabag123: Thanks for update! Hope it's working out ok.

[Fleabag123]

Got there in the end! Agreed new price in line with valuation. It took a while to get here

Keeping fingers crossed that your vendor accepts your new offer. And that they decide quicker than mine did!!!

[Diseno]

when i sold my 1st house it was down valued by 10k.
they wanted it so bad so paid for another valuation where it was put back up.
the 1st valuer had issues with ex council houses.

[howabouthisthen]

@Fleabag123 - that's great news! Sounds like a fair outcome. Congratulations and well done for holding your nerve.

@Diseno - it's so interesting how the system works isn't it? One person's view can have such big implications for both buyer and seller. Glad to hear it worked out well in your case.

[ForgivenessIsDivine]

Reply to the Estate Agent: The survey came up with significant issues including the roof and brickwork which are not consistent with the description 'read to move in to' nor could they be determined from the viewings. The valuation is significantly less than the offer we have made. We are not willing at this stage to share the survey report until we have had some opportunity to cost out the items that are in need of urgent attention.

Get quotations for all of the work that you could not have anticipated based on the viewings and reassess. Be very wary of allowing the vendor to have this work completed himself before the sale.

Bitter experience: Damp and rotten wood found on the survey, we were naively fobbed off by the vendor and the estate agent that it was probably just due to general bathroom wetness and the floor board in the bathroom was replaced to the satisfaction of the surveyor. The problem was in fact a leaking waste pipe under the floor boards which had also caused the joists to rot. Replacing the top floor board just masked the problem.

[Diseno]

its the same as having 3 estate agents around all giving different values.
valuers are the same.
I wouldnt budge due to the fixtures and how is was done up compaired to others on the street, was so much nicer finished, underfloor heating etc
your case if different as you have found problems though, hope yours comes good

[howabouthisthen]

@forgivenessisdivine - what a nightmare! Poor you. The vendor did initially offer to do some of the work (we spotted a couple of glaring instances of damp on our viewing, which we got quotes for sorting before making our final offer), but we were very careful and said we'd rather find out the cause and what's needed to fix it and get it done ourselves to be sure. I feel for you - must have been a real pain and it's so horrible to be deceived.
Our survey report came back with even more and serious damp issues than we had spotted, and pointed to different (more expensive) causes than the quotes we'd got from a general builder for the ones we had seen.
Great advice re: what to say to EA, ta. House is feeling like a money pit to be honest - so the price will have to be right to reflect that, or we will sadly have to walk away.

@diseno - that sounds fair enough! I dream of underfloor heating so that's a definite bonus in my opinion

[MovingNextYearHopefully]

Any news yet OP? My suggestion would be to run a mile tbh. As a FTB, with I presume no experience of undertaking what sounds like a complete refurb project, you definitely don't need the grief. Just imagine the stuff your building survey hasn't picked up that you'll find out after purchase? Theres always something. I'd be cutting my losses & getting something that is less of a money pit personally!

[howabouthisthen]

Thanks @MovingNextYearHopefully! Your advice is really sound - all our families are saying the same. Having spent the cash on the survey we will see through the costings of repairs (as I do really love the house and garden and the location....). If we can afford it and the price is right, we may be foolish enough to go for it. But that's all feeling unlikely tbh... [ps - what does 'OP' mean? Mumsnet newbie and haven't worked that one out yet ]

[Mildura]

OP = Original Poster

[Fleabag123]

any news @howabout - what did you decide in the end?