Unreasonable neighbours

[crazycrofter]

I’m after some advice for my parents. They live in a property with a shared drive. They are at the end of the drive - their house is on the right with space for up to 4 cars right in front. Their neighbour’s house is to the right of theirs. Because of the shared access/drive which passes his house, he only has room for two cars.

The man next door has been so difficult since they moved in. He doesn’t work and he sits in his front room all day, which has a full length window looking onto the shared drive. When he’s not in the front room he’s cleaning his two cars.

Every time someone drives past to my parents house he comes out to ‘clean his car’ or look under the bonnet or something. He hates them having visitors. He claims to be worried about his cars but no one has come close to hitting them.

He’s made numerous complaints and demands over the years. He told them they couldn’t have four cars on the drive and they complied for a while.

He’s had a go about delivery vans etc, so they have Amazon parcels delivered elsewhere (he refuses to take them in). They’ve tried hard to appease him but they’re very busy, with lots of children and grandchildren and other friends and family visiting. And they like to look after their house so they have workmen, people to cut the hedge etc.

He has a big go at them every couple of months - usually after a particularly sociable period. They find it very stressful. What do you think is the best approach for dealing with him and would they be able to report him for harassment? They’re both in their 70s now and it feels like bullying to me.

[Daisy2990]

To play devil's advocate for a second, is it possible that your parents' visitors are inconveniencing him in some way? E.g. blocking his access? Are people parking big vans on the drive and getting close to his car with lawnmowers and things?

It sounds like something is triggering this at busy times and it would be worth figuring it out and solving it amicabl. Is the boundary clearly defined? Have you looked at the deeds to make sure that everyone is giving the appropriate right of way?

Reporting him for harassment should be an absolute last resort. Sort it out in a friendly way or your parents will have a hell of a time trying to sell the house if they fall out.

I don't think the Amazon parcel thing is relevant btw, he's within his rights to refuse to take parcels in.

[crazycrofter]

I agree about the parcels. There’s plenty of room to get past his cars to my parents’ patch. Sometimes, when he sees they have visitors he parks as far out as he can from his house to make it more difficult to get past but it’s still possible. No one has ever got to near his car as far as I’m aware and he would definitely tell them if that had happened.

When vans come down they park in front of my parents’ house - there’s plenty of room as they only have 2 cars there permanently.

The problem is he’s not reasonable. For example he shouted at them and said mother was ill and he might need to get out at any minute (which he could do anyway - he’s never ever blocked in) but when my mum asked about his mother at a later date he seemed to have forgotten about her illness. He never goes out apart from on Sundays so he has nothing else to occupy him.

Basically he says he doesn’t have visitors and so they shouldn’t either. And if they do they should park on the road - but they’re on a bend and it’s not a very safe place to park. Can he insist on that and should they comply? I don’t think so as one of the reasons for buying the house was the parking space.

[HoleyCoMoley]

What do the deeds and right of access say about how much space is allocated to each house. How is it safe for vans to park on the road but not cars because of the bend. Is there access to his house for emergency vehicles and workmen to get to. What would happen if he had 3 or 4 cars, how would they share the space, this could happen if he ever moves and a family move In. It's not his responsibility to take in their parcels and it's no ones business really if he never goes out or wants to sit in his front room all day, washes his car, only goes out on Sundays, maybe he feels he's being watched and harassed. Why don't they just talk to him, see if there's something upsetting him and try and reach a compromise.

[BerylStreep]

Well I would be checking the deeds first before I did anything else.

I've had similar recently with my mother and her neighbour. I ended up writing to her explaining the legal situation, that we were well within our rights, and advising if there was a repeat of her having a go at my Mum I would call the police and report her for harassment.

Not necessarily an ideal situation but my Mum's neighbour had been bullying Mum for years and she overstepped the mark when she harangued my Mum when she was just out of hospital.

[Daisy2990]

I would get the land registry documents for both houses from the website, then next time he complains, explain you've checked the boundaries and easements and give him a copy. I would personally mark the boundary physically somehow as well.

The next stop would be a visit to a solicitor to write a letter. For the sake of keeping the peace it would be worth coming to a compromise that de-escalates the situation before this happens imo.

I guess you could keep a diary and report it as anti social behaviour or ask a PCSO to have a word with him. However, if the access is narrow across the end of his drive, he could make life difficult for your parents if he decided to start parking further and further back.

[WowCrabby]

My bet would be the best way of dealing with him is to avoid him as much as possible, take whatever steps are easy to take to avoid annoying him then try not to worry about it. He won't stop being a git if you complain about him. I know it would be frustrating to allow him to continue to be so obnoxious but it might be better than ramping things up.


I'd also get CCTV.

[user1471530109]

OMG. Are you talking about my parents? If you've changed a few details you could v well be!

In that case. The access to the drive is on the deeds. It is NOT a shared drive. That means that you can't park your cars on the part of the drive in front of their house. It just means you have access through it.

The deeds have been checked and a surveyor has done a report.

you also can't be a cunt and threaten my parents and key my sister's car. All on my parents CCTV. And the police have spoken to you etc

If you're not talking about my parents. I strongly suggest you get a solicitor to read the deeds carefully. If it's access only, stay on your own patch and keep the peace with your elderly neighbours. Remember, you have to legally report neighbour disputes.

[crazycrofter]

No it’s not your parents. The neighbours aren’t elderly.

No one ever parks in front of their house - there’s easily room for four cars in front of my parents’ house. The shared access (the drive which runs past neighbour’s house) is actually very wide and it’s easy to stay clear of his car even when he parks it further out. He knows where the boundary is and sometimes puts cones on it.

He just doesn’t like people driving up and down. He’s definitely not being watched - quite the opposite! It’s quite intimidating turning round in front of my parents’ house or backing out as he watches the whole time.

It’s not really safe for vans to park on the road. The Tesco van does I think as a concession.

I think it’s just a huge incompatibility. My parents have lots of visitors and he’s very anxious about cars driving past. And other things too - he had a go at the neighbour at the top of the drive for installing security lights.

They’ve always tried to be accommodating but I think my dad has got more frustrated with him over the last couple of years. He was targeting my mum, so my dad said he should bring all complaints to him. He sent a few letters too.

I guess I wondered what they could do other than try to ignore?

[wowfudge]

We own our shared access and next door have rights to pass and re-pass over it so we are in effect in your parents' strange neighbour's position. Except we would never behave like that. Next time he raises an issue, refer him to the details on the title register and state firmly that everything is within the rights as set down in the title register.

To me he sounds like an oddball who has fixated on the access because he has very little going on in his life. He's either very socially awkward and doesn't want to see/speak to other people or he is jealous that they have visitors when he doesn't.

It's one of those situations where you either stand up to him or try to make a friend of him.

[crazycrofter]

You’ve hit the nail on the head. He is very strange and quite miserable. They tried hard at first - invited him and his wife for coffee when they first moved in, for example but they didn’t want to come. He’s not really up for friendship.

He’s not actually accusing them of going on his property - he just goes on and on about the number of visitors, how it’s unsafe for anyone to back out, how they shouldn’t be doing three point turns in front of their own house etc. I’ve told them to ignore. They’ve tended to make concessions but it hasn’t got them anywhere - eg for a while they said we had to park on the road because of him - but he’s not stopped having a go. I wondered if my husband and brother should go round and have a word.

[Singlenotsingle]

Has nobody asked for a diagram yet? I thought it was mandatory - and in this case it would be useful. Please?

[cushioncuddle]

Your mum needs a line like / can't talk now. She says it and walks off.
Check the right of way on the dead's. Copy it and post it to him.
He sounds quite unpleasant

[wowfudge]

I couldn't imagine doing that. I get a bit twitchy when someone visiting next door mistakenly parks on our land but as long as we can turn around without doing a multi point turn on the bit outside our house I'm not bothered. I prefer to turn around at the top of the drive because it doesn't involve reversing up to a precipice!

[crazycrofter]

I might give you a diagram tomorrow!

[crazycrofter]

Here’s the layout

[Daisy2990]

Who owns the bit that says shared access? I know it's technically a shared area but it must be on someone's title.

It looks as though he might own that area and your parents have the right to drive over his land. In which case he may be confused about their rights.

He obviously feels his cars are vulnerable. In your parents position I would consider putting 3 cars on the drive and fencing off the boundary so he cant watch over it. Either that or line it with planters and tell him it's to protect his cars.

Btw I know you don't much like this fella, but calling him names on here doesn't do you any favours. If you take this further you need to stick to the facts of the access issue and not his social skills

[crazycrofter]

Thanks, did I call him names? I wasn’t aware that I had!? I guess I agreed he’s a bit strange and miserable - to be honest I’m being fairly understated! I’m perfectly pleasant to him when I see him, but it’s really getting my parents down.

Yes, I believe the shared access bit is owned by him - does that give him any power to stipulate how often cars can come down and also whether vans can use it? That’s what I’m not sure about.

I agree, he seems to think his cars are at risk but they’re really not. It’s quite a wide drive.

[Sicario]

Nightmare. My number one rule is never fall out with neighbours unless it's completely unavoidable. I had a shared drive once but with a nice neighbour and we were very much live and let live.

If this man is regularly upsetting your mum, you might want to consider applying for a restraining order to prevent him communicating with her at all.

It's hard to ignore unreasonable behaviour (because it's stressful and can make you feel very cross), but it's either ignore it, or get the restraining order.

Complete cow living next door to us (has planted leylandei right up against our walls) finally moved out last month. Good effing riddance. Neighbours, eh? Can't live with them... can't shoot them.

[Sicario]

Shared access right of way usually means you can pass over their property but not stop on it.

[Santaispolishinghissleigh]

Get your dps headphones for Christmas. Tell them to make a point of wearing them on leaving and entering their car /house. He will soon get fed up of talking to himself I imagine.

[Daisy2990]

Only the land registry documents can tell you what everyone's rights are over the area, but I suspect they will say everyone has a right to pass over the area without stopping. However, it might say something really odd, particularly if it's gone to court in the past. I almost bought a house that had shared access for 6 houses and only 1 was allowed to park there. So oddities do exist.

You really need to download both titles and check that your access assumptions are correct, just in case he's right and you're not. It should cost £3 per house and would be money well spent next time he approaches your parents.

[crazycrofter]

I agree, they don’t want to fall out although it appears they have anyway in his eyes.

No one ever stops or parks on the shared access bit so that’s not really an issue. I feel my parents should move - although would they have to disclose disputes or is that only the case if it’s gone further?

[Troels]

Your poor Mum, maybe he had friends in line to but the place, but your mums offer was accepted before they had a chance. People can be weird.
Myself I'd get CCTV installed to cover myself and each time he tried to talk to me, I'd rush and say, "can't stop/talk, visitors are coming over" Even if they aren't.

[crazycrofter]

Yes, I’m trying to get them not to engage. I think they need to draw a line in the sand and say they’re not going to make any more adjustments for him - so he should only speak to them if he has a genuine grievance ie blocked access when he needs to go out, damage to property etc.

[Daisy2990]

One thing that keeps sticking in my mind is that he shouted at your parents because "he might need to get out at any minute", yet his access wasn't blocked at the time.

So why did he think he might be blocked in?

Is it possible that

• he struggles to get his car out without driving over part of their driveway, whether he should or not
• someone's blocked him in before (maybe before they moved in)
• he can't see very well to judge distance
• the deeds say he has the right to drive over part of their driveway and having 4 cars there is preventing him doing that
• the deeds say nobody is supposed to park on the driveways at all

I suspect you could solve this by actually getting to the bottom of the access problem, but if you can't then moving is probably going to be cheaper than getting a solicitor involved.